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            "transcript": "Nachhaltig leben, künstliche Intelligenz nutzen oder Podcasts hören. Das alles sind Trends, die in den vergangenen Jahren aufkam und einige Trends sind so groß, dass sie ganz offensichtlich sind. Bei anderen Trends aber fällt's vielleicht nicht ganz so leicht, sie zu erkennen. Eine Möglichkeit aus der Trendforschung, man befragt regelmäßig Expert*innen. Eine andere Option bietet ein neues Tool von Fraunhofer Fokus. Die Website Wiki4Trends analysiert Trends anhand großer Datenmengen und zwar von Wikipedia. Wie das geht, das erfahren wir heute in diesem Podcast. Herzlich willkommen beim öFIT Podcast restart digital, eine Produktion des Fraunhofer Instituts für offene Kommunikationssysteme. Ich bin Philipp 1 und ich begrüße hier im Studio in Berlin Tegel meine beiden Co Hosts. Das ist zum einen Jahn Dennis Gumtz. Er ist Data Scientist am Kompetenzzentrum öffentlicher IT und seine Arbeitsschwerpunkte liegen im Bereich der Trendforschung sowie der Auswertung und Aufbereitung von Daten. Hallo Dennis. Hallo, vielen Dank, dass ich hier sein darf. Und mit dabei, unser Stammgast könnte man ja immer gern sagen, Doktor Mike Weber, ebenfalls Trendforscher und stellvertretender Leiter des öfid. Tag, Maik. Hallo Philipp. Ja, ihr seid beide Trendforscher. Das hat mich total gefreut, weil dann seid ihr natürlich ausgewiesene Experten auch für ein Trend Tool, das ihr so entwickelt habt. Helft mir doch gleich mal zum Beginn weiter. Warum habt ihr ausgerechnet Wikipedia angezapft? Es war zum einen eine Ergänzung zu unseren bisherigen Tools, die mehr auf wissenschaftliche Publikationen geblickt haben. Zum anderen ist Wikipedia aber einfach eine geeignete Datenquelle aus mehreren Gründen. Zum einen wird das halt regelmäßig aktualisiert durch eine engagierte Community, das heißt, die bringen neue Artikel ein, verändern Artikel, sie auf den aktuellen Stand zu bringen. Wikipedia ist eine der populärsten Websites des gesamten Internets und für viele Menschen immer noch eine wichtige Anlaufstation, wenn sie sich zu etwas informieren wollen. Dann kommt noch dazu, dass Wikipedia einfach wunderbare Schnittstellen bietet, aus denen man viele nützliche Daten seines Artikelaufrufe, seien es der Text selbst und Und diese Schnittstellen, die sind sogar kostenfrei, anzapbar und das ist ja auch nicht selbstverständlich. Genau, ja, absolut nicht. Es gibt Archive als offene Quelle, aber wenn man so über Quellen wie Scoupus oder Web of Science spricht, dann gibt es meines Wissens da keine offenen, frei verfügbaren APIs. Mhm. Also große Datenmengen, viel Aktivität der Community und das alles kostenfrei verfügbar. Mike, wie kam's überhaupt zu dieser Projektidee, Wikipedia anzapfen für die Trendforschung? Also einerseits war's eine Marktlücke, weil Wikipedia Daten erstaunlich wenig ausgewertet werden. So früher Twitter Auswertungen, in Anführungszeichen macht ja jeder, aber Wikipedia, da ist die Nutzung dafür, dass die Daten so wunderbar sind, erstaunlich gering. Und wir adressieren mit diesen Daten ja auch 'n bisschen andere Informationsquellen als die, die wir mit anderen Daten haben. Also wenn man wissenschaftliche Publikationen hat, die sind dann ja auch durch gewisse Einflüsse werden die dann getrieben, zum Beispiel große Förderprojekte oder so was, die dann dazu führen, dass in einem Bereich enorm viel publiziert wird. Wir haben auch 'n 'n Timelag bei wissenschaftlichen Publikationen. Also je nachdem, welche Quelle man da anzapft, bevor son Paper dann veröffentlicht ist, kann ja eine ganze lange Zeit vergangen sein. Und bei Wikipedia haben wir das Wunderbare, dass wir auch nicht nur aus so 1 Nische, so 1 wissenschaftlichen Nische, sondern aus der Breite der Gesellschaften Impulse bekommen. Das löst dann ganz nebenbei auch ein Problem, das die Trendforschung immer hat, nämlich die Überflughöhe. Auf welcher Ebene wollen wir uns denn hier mit einem Trend beschäftigen? Und das löst Wikipedia automatisch, weil dann ist es ein Artikel dazu. Mhm. Dann haben wir die Überflughöhe, die wir brauchen und können dann in die Tiefe, die Dennis ja auch schon beschrieben hat, reingehen. Und diese Kombination aus neuartigen Informationsquellen mit wunderbarer Auswertbarkeit, da konnte Dennis gar nicht anders als zuzuschlagen. Konnte es nicht anders als zuzuschlagen, aber die Idee muss ja trotzdem erst mal da sein. Wie kam's dazu? Ich muss sagen, ich kann mich gar nicht an einen Grund erinnern. Die Idee kam mir einfach. Ich hab gemerkt, hoppla, wir machen ja gar nichts dazu. Wir haben ja früher auch mal Twitter ausgewertet. Wir haben bereits wissenschaftliche Publikationen ausgewertet. Hin und wieder schauen wir mal, ob wir Medienberichte auswerten können und mir ist einfach die Idee gekommen und mir ist aufgefallen, hey, da haben wir noch nichts und an sich lässt sich das aber eigentlich wunderbar auswerten. Wie machst Du das denn konkret mit deinem Tool? Also wie funktioniert das so, dass ich's mir jetzt auch als Laie gut vorstellen kann? Ich würd das Tool im Grunde in in 3 Teile aufteilen. Das eine ist die Datensammlung. Da habe ich und meine Mitentwicklerin uns vorher Gedanken gemacht, welche Daten wollen wir eigentlich haben und wie wollen wir sie abspeichern? Und genau das macht dieser erste Teil, dass wir's automatisiert laufen lassen können. Dann, wie wollen wir die Daten auswerten? Und haben uns so Gedanken gemacht über verschiedene Metriken, die vielleicht einen Trend anzeigen können oder für eine hohe Popularität 1 Artikels stehen können. Und dementsprechend ist der zweite Teil diese Analyse, bei deren wir dann die bei uns gespeicherten Daten analysieren. Und der dritte Teil ist dann die Ergebnisaufbereitung. Da haben wir dann noch 'n Dashboard gebaut, das im Grunde auf diese analysierten Daten zugreift und diese dann ja aufbereitet darstellt, die Ergebnisse davon, ja. Und das Dashboard, das ist ja auch frei zugänglich. Also man kann dort einfach als Website sozusagen das Dashboard ansteuern und kann auch Daten dort suchen, anschauen. Nun ist es ja so, dass die deutschsprachige Wikipedia allein eine ungeheure Anzahl von Daten umfasst. Also es sind mehr als 3000000 Artikel. Meist interessieren sich Menschen ja für Trends auf 'nem bestimmten Gebiet. Jetzt nicht, ne, so in alle Richtungen, sondern bestimmtes Gebiet wie zum Beispiel Rechtsruck in der europäischen Politik könnte ja ein Trend sein. Wie geht euer Tool mit diesen verschiedenen Kategorien Ja, im Grunde war das war das eine große Herausforderung. Die Zahl von 3000000 für die deutsche Wikipedia hatte ich jetzt nicht im Kopf, aber ich weiß, dass es fast über 6, fast 7000000 Artikel in der englischsprachigen Wikipedia Edition sind. Und das ist natürlich eine Herausforderung, insbesondere für uns auch als Kompetenzzentrum öffentlicher IT. Uns interessiert zum Beispiel nicht, was ja in der Biologie passiert oder in der in der Geschichte notwendigerweise, sondern schon dieser Augenmerk auf IT, die auch den öffentlichen Raum betrifft. Wie wir vorgegangen sind, sind, dass wir uns so etwa 100 Artikel ausgesucht haben, die gut zu den Themen gepasst haben, die wir in der Vergangenheit bearbeitet haben. Dann haben wir uns angeschaut, in welche Kategorien fallen diese Artikel? Denn jeder Artikel bei Wikipedia ist 2, 3, manchmal auch mehr Kategorien zugeordnet. Dann haben wir relativ schnell gemerkt, es gibt Kategorien, die besonders häufig dann da auftreten und genau diese Kategorien sind die, die wir im Grunde abfragen auf alle Artikel, die sich daran befinden. Dadurch gelingt es uns halt, aus etwa 900 Kategorien einen Ausschnitt von Wikipedia zu betrachten. Das sind dann immer noch über 30000 Artikel pro Wikipedia Edition, also immer noch viele, aber keine 6000000. Mhm. Und sie passen halt tatsächlich zu zu unserem Interessensgebiet eigentlich. Und dadurch haben wir's ja, ich sag mal geschickt, eingegrenzt und haben weder zu viel Beifang dabei bei den Ergebnissen noch verschwenden wir zu viel Rechenressourcen für die Auswertung von Gesamtwiki, wo uns eigentlich nur ein kleiner Ausschnitt davon interessiert. Mhm. Und das Schöne ist ja, das steht ja auch als Open Source zur Verfügung und dementsprechend, wenn dich jetzt der Rechtsruck in Europa interessiert, kannst Du genau mit dem gleichen Verfahren deinen eigenen Datensatz aufbauen und mit dem Tool dann entsprechend auswerten. Das wär fast meine nächste Frage gewesen. Ich hab's natürlich ja auch getestet, ne. Ich wollt ja mal gucken, wie's funktioniert. Ja, und dann hab ich bei meinem Test auf Platz 1 des Dashboards eben gefunden, den Eintrag Retrieval Augmented Generation mit 1 Trendstärke von 82.8. Hab rausgefunden, das hat irgendwas mit Programmieren zu tun, aber zunächst mal ist es ja nicht so das Gebiet, auf dem ich so wirklich bewandert bin. Wie kann ich das dann machen, dass ich eben das Dashboard an meine Interessensgebiete anpasse, wie Du sagst, Bike? Also das Tool selbst bietet in der Onlinevariante schon bestimmte Filterfunktionen und auch Fokussierungsfunktionen. Zum Beispiel auch eine Annäherung dadran, für welchen gesellschaftlichen Bereich das besonders interessant und spannend sein könnte. Also wenn ich bei Rechtsruck Politik Zivilgesellschaft bin, dann könnte ich zum Beispiel da eine hohe Bedeutung für die Zivilgesellschaft dieses Themas angeben und hätte dementsprechend eine Fokussierung auf diese Themenfelder. Wenn Du dein eigenes Forschungsprojekt daraus machen willst, dann müsstest Du an den Source Code gehen und den entsprechend für deine Bedarfe anpassen. Also da bräuchte ich schon schon Programmierkenntnisse? Ja. Ja, ein wenig. Ich sag mal so, die müssen jetzt nicht supertief gehen, weil wir haben da auch 'n Jupiter Notebook bereitgestellt. Vielleicht für alle, die nicht wissen, was das ist, dass im Grunde ein, ich sag mal, ein Python Skript, das aber relativ gut dokumentiert ist und da sieht man Schritt für Schritt, was da eigentlich gemacht wird. Das wird auch oft für so für Dokumentation tatsächlich verwendet. Das heißt, da muss man jetzt keine sehr tiefgehenden Programmierkenntnisse für haben, genau diese Anpassung vorzunehmen. Etwas wäre natürlich nützlich, aber das ist befindet sich dann eher im mittleren Bereich. Und das Schöne ist, dass wir beim letzten Podcast gelernt haben, kann man ja KI nutzen, die Syntax zum Beispiel immer richtig zu treffen bei dessen Anpassungen. Das macht's son bisschen einfacher. Das ist durchaus eine sehr nützliche Unterstützung. Wenn man das Grundkonzept verstanden hat und dann halt so Details ändern will, dann ist das Gold wert. Mhm. 'N weiterer Punkt, über den ich gern sprechen möchte, sind die Filter. Auch die Möglichkeit hab ich ja, dass ich die Ergebnisse auf dem Dashboard mir noch mal filtern kann. Welche Kriterien kann ich denn an meine Suche anlegen und auch an meine Filterung? Ich würde sagen, es gibt 4 inhaltliche Filter. Das ist die Relevanz für uns, also für ÖffIT, so als Tengebiet, dann Staat, Politik und Zivilgesellschaft. Alles, was dahintersteckt, ist im Grunde, dass der Text dieser Artikel ja durch einen Klassifizierer gelaufen ist, der im Grunde ausgibt, wie hoch ist die Relevanz für diesen Bereich? Dann kann ich halt da so Mindestwerte einstellen und sagen, okay, das soll jetzt mindestens 30 Prozent Relevanz für Staat haben. So und dann gibt es die, ich sag mal, mehr quantitativen Faktoren, indem ich zum Beispiel angeben kann, wie viele Wörter soll son Artikel mindestens beinhalten? Wie viele Aufrufe, durchschnittliche Aufrufe am Tag soll es mindestens haben? Wie viele Bearbeitungen mindestens soll es haben? Das ist aber durchaus nützlich, wie ich jetzt grade erst heute Morgen festgestellt habe, weil ich hab mir die Daten für den April 20 25 angeschaut. Und die Nummer 1 in der deutschen Wikipedia ist halt ein Tatort, der heißt. Der Grund, warum das überhaupt da drin gelandet ist, weil es inhaltlich wohl, ich hab den Tatort nicht gesehen, aber ich hab mir die Kurzzusammenfassung durchgelesen, einen Mord geht, bei dem autonomes Fahren involviert war und bei dem es einen, glaub ich, einen IT Chef getroffen hat. Deshalb ist es innerhalb unseres Interessensgebiet gelandet. Aber der Grund, dass dieser Artikel dann am Fremden ist, ist, dass es 2, ich sag mal, Berge in den Aufbruchstatistiken gab, 1 relativ kürzlich. Und es hängt einfach damit zusammen, dass dieser Tatort erst kürzlich wieder ausgestrahlt worden ist. Dementsprechend haben da Leute anschließend drauf geklickt auf diesen Artikel und deshalb ist der so hoch gewandert. Verstehe. Genau, wenn man sich aber die Bearbeitung anschaut, weil er, der ist 2018, glaub ich, das erste Mal ausgestrahlt hat, hat er kaum Bearbeitung. Das heißt, wenn ich den Filter für Bearbeitung hochsetze, dann taucht dieser Artikel nicht mehr auf unter diesen Trendartikeln, weil da eigentlich nichts Neues passiert ist. Da hat sich inhaltlich nichts dran geändert, aber nur in den Aufrufstatistiken. Das heißt, da hab ich ja gleich son bisschen eigentlich heute Morgen herausgefunden, dieser Bearbeitungsfilter für für Mindestanzahl von Bearbeitungen ist eigentlich ganz nützlich. Jetzt kannst Du an die ganzen Kleinigkeiten, danach zu justieren, Maik? So kann man dann durch 2 einfache Einstellungen 'n Hype vom Trend unterscheiden. Also der Hype, weil das noch mal ausgestrahlt worden ist, aber im Prinzip ist nicht viel passiert, also kein Trend. Mhm. Weil ich den Tatort auch nicht gesehen hab, vielleicht ist er voll trendig, das weiß ich jetzt nicht. Bleiben wir noch mal so bei den Filterungen und bei den ganzen Unterscheidungen, die man so treffen kann. Ihr unterscheidet auf dem Dashboard auch zwischen Trend versucht man normalerweise irgendwas abzugreifen, was erst im Kommen ist. Das heißt, meistens geht es dabei einen Anstieg, eine Steigerung. Das kann ein Anstieg der Aufrufanzahl sein, das kann ein Anstieg der Bearbeitungen sein, so was in der Art. Etwas, was vielleicht jetzt noch nicht superpopulär ist, aber es in 2, 3 Jahren vielleicht sein könnte. Da geht das halt darum, irgendwie vor die Welle zu kommen oder zumindest im Gleichschritt mit der Welle zu sein, halt frühzeitig über neue Entwicklungen informiert zu sein und dementsprechend handeln zu können. Das heißt, populär ist die Gegenwart und Populär. Der Trend ist so der der Versuch 1 Blicks in die Zukunft. Ganz genau, ja. Mhm. Dennis, Du schreibst ja in 'nem Artikel über das Projekt, dass es noch mehr ist als nur ein Dashboard. Was meinst Du damit? Was steckt da noch dahinter? Also welche Vision hast Du noch dafür? Zum einen ist dieses Dashboard halt nicht statisch oder in der Zeit eingefroren. Das heißt, das ist etwas, was wir sowohl mit neuen Daten befüllen werden, als auch wo wir noch darüber nachdenken, zusätzliche Funktionalität hinzu zu bauen und auch durch Dritte dadurch, dass der Source Code auch verfügbar ist, ja, auch Funktionalität dazu gebaut werden kann. Und zum anderen ist es halt dieses dreiteilige Programmpaket, was eben nicht nur dieses Dashboard betrifft, sondern wo halt auch die Datensammlung und Datenanalyse vorliegt. Und Analyse ist 'n super Stichwort. Mike, was macht ihr denn eigentlich mit den Daten? Was macht ihr mit den Ergebnissen? Wenn ich nur einen Satz dazu sagen Na klar, gerne. Auch die Metriken, die dahinter liegen, sind natürlich Das ist alles plausibel, alles nachvollziehbar, aber gerade in der Anwendung wird man dann ja noch zusätzlich lernen, welche Metriken vielleicht noch besser passen als die, die jetzt schon verbaut sind, die da drin sind. Und was man damit machen kann, ist ja Erst mal hat man, wenn man das aufruft, hat man ja schon einen Eindruck von dem, was gerade im Moment populär ist, was gerade trendet. Das ist natürlich schon der erste große Mehrwert, aber das Schöne ist, wenn man dann auch ganz bewusst in einzelne Technologien oder einzelne Trends, einzelne Themenbereiche rein zoomt, dann eröffnet sich ja noch mal ein Riesenfeld von Indikatoren und dann Dingen, die man beobachten kann. Also auch Sachen, die jetzt vielleicht nicht so der ganz heiße Scheiß sind, der im Moment diskutiert wird, kann man dann halt weiter nachverfolgen, ob es zum Beispiel da noch eine Community gibt, die sich damit beschäftigt. Also vielleicht war das ja mal 'n großer Hype und jetzt wird es Gedeiht es in 'ner Nische weiter oder aber war's 'n großer Hype und ist dann abgeflacht? Wie ist das mit der Entwicklung der Bearbeitenden und Beobachtenden? Also wird diese Community da vielleicht dann doch wieder größer? Entsteht da vielleicht wieder was Neues oder bleibt das so in etwa? Oder aber stirbt es ab? Halt solche Sachen kann man damit halt eben auch beobachten. Mhm. Schon ganz gutes Beispiel. Vielleicht machen wir das noch 'n bisschen greifbarer und steigen mal ein in die Frage, wie sich diese Daten, diese Ergebnisse auch nutzen lassen für die öffentliche Verwaltung. Konntet ihr schon Trends für die digitale Verwaltung ableiten aus euren Ergebnissen, aus euren Analysen? Vielleicht läuft es dafür noch nicht lang genug. Wir haben das jetzt erst, ich glaub, Ende April online gestellt. Was ich persönlich halt sagen kann, was mir aufgefallen ist, dass son paar Dinge ja in den Top Ten dieser Listen dann aufgetaucht sind, die mir noch nichts gesagt haben, zum Beispiel diverse Cybersecurity Bedrohungen, die natürlich auch für die öffentliche Verwaltung relevant sind, weil auch die öffentliche Verwaltung natürlich bedroht ist. Ansonsten viel aus dem Bereich KI neue Entwicklungen in diesem Bereich, was natürlich auch wieder relevant ist für die öffentliche Verwaltung, wenn sie KI einsetzen möchte. Und wie ich schon erwähnt hatte, ist das ganze ja transferierbar. Das heißt, die öffentliche Verwaltung, falls sie ein spezielles Interessensgebiet hat, kann sie theoretisch dieses Tool auch darauf zuschneiden. Mhm. Meine Frage war halt dann auch, na ja, wozu muss die digitale Verwaltung überhaupt Trends erkennen? Vielleicht 'n bisschen ketzerisch, aber so, wie Du's jetzt grad beschrieben hast, macht's ja erst mal Sinn, ne? Also Cybersecurity, Sicherheit, aber auch KI Tools, die ja in der Verwaltung wahrscheinlich auch sehr, sehr helfen können in den nächsten Jahren. Also klingt erst mal logisch, oder? Absolut. Und eine der schönen Seiten von Wikipedia ist ja, dass nicht nur dann die Konzepte und die schwierig auszusprechenden neuesten Entwicklungen da berücksichtigt werden, sondern bis hin zu Produkten, die angeboten werden, die halt eben auch entsprechende entsprechende Einträge haben und wo man dann gucken kann, welches Sprachmodell gerade besonders hip ist oder so was in der Richtung. Aber wir betreiben ja auch schon 'n ganzes Weilchentrennforschung und aus guten Gründen. Dieses, was Dennis ja auch schon gesagt hat, vor die Welle zu kommen und so zu wissen, erst mal, was überhaupt gerade im Moment diskutiert wird und und was gerade passiert, kann enorm wichtig sein. Also wir hatten das rückblickend ein ein ganz spezieller Fall, VMware ist eine Software, die sehr verbreitet ist in der öffentlichen Verwaltung oder war, wahrscheinlich immer noch ist und wo dann der Eigentümer gewechselt hat und dementsprechend die Preismodelle gewechselt haben und all so etwas. Und das ist etwas, was man jetzt historisch betrachtet in den Wikipedia Daten hervorragend sieht. Genau da, wo es dir 'n Wechsel gegeben hat, gibt es einen Riesenausschlag. Das heißt, wenn wir das Tool damals schon gehabt hätten, wäre es sofort angesprungen. Und das Systemfeld, VMware, was machen wir damit in der öffentlichen Verwaltung? Wie ersetzen wir's möglicherweise oder wie gehen wir sonst damit Das ist ein riesiges operativ wichtiges Themenfeld, das gerade munter diskutiert wird in dem Bereich. Warum machen wir das? Dieses vor die Welle kommen, es ist ja immer Also es Die die öffentliche Hand hat ja ganz, ganz viele Bedarfe in dem Bereich. Also sowohl, was sie selbst einsetzt, was sie aktuell einsetzt, das lässt sich wunderbar beobachten durch das Tool, was sie möglicherweise zukünftig einsetzt. Da sind dann auch solche Trendbeobachtungen ganz besonders wichtig. Aber natürlich auch, wo sind möglicherweise Regulierungsherausforderungen? Auch dafür eben, weil Wikipedia so breit ist und so in unterschiedlichen Sektoren, würd ich mal sagen, unterwegs ist, auch dafür eignet es sich hervorragend. Und dann hatten wir ja immer das Problem, dass Daten immer nur die Vergangenheit abbilden können. Es ist halt so. Und deswegen dieser dieser Versuch, in die Zukunft zu gucken, dementsprechend herausfordernd ist, aber grade da ja auch wieder Wikipedia so viele Daten liefert, da ist dann wieder die die Verfügbarkeit der Daten ganz entscheidend, dass man damit entsprechend variieren kann und dann hoffentlich der Zukunft ein bisschen näher kommt als mit anderen Datenquellen. Welche Behörden brauchen dieses Wissen, dieses Trendwissen dann besonders? Also an an wen denkt ihr da? Das ist ja jetzt ganz einfach, das Digitalministerium. Ja gut. Nein, aber bei unserem Themenfeld im Bereich der Digitalisierung sind es in der Tat all die Ministerien und Einrichtungen, die sich mit Digitalisierungsfragen beschäftigen. Sicherheitsrisiken hatten wir eben schon. Auch das BSI betreibt ja auch eigene Trendforschung. Da ist es 'n ganz, ganz wichtiger Bereich. Für den Einsatz ist es 'n ganz wichtiger Bereich. Ein Aspekt, zu dem wir ja auch selbst grade arbeiten im Bereich digitale Souveränität ist es 'n ganz wichtiger Punkt. Auf welche Technologien soll ich für die Zukunft setzen, die digitale Souveränität zu erhalten oder zu steigern? Also ich will alle. Wenn jetzt eine Behörde sagt, na ja, also klingt spannend, wir würden gerne Wiki4Trace auch bei uns einsetzen, für uns einsetzen, wie könnt ihr da unterstützen? Oder ist das gar nicht nötig, weil jeder drauf zugreifen kann? In der Idealvorstellung ist es natürlich nicht nötig, dass wir da unterstützen. Gleichzeitig wissen wir natürlich auch dadurch, dass wir das Tool entwickelt haben, ist für uns die Hürde, Änderungen und Anpassungen da vorzunehmen, natürlich sehr viel geringer als ja bei Neulingen, die sich da erst einarbeiten müssen. Von daher, wir haben es gut dokumentiert online gestellt, sind aber auch bereit, ja, zu unterstützen dabei, es dann auch zum Laufen zu bekommen, ja, da wir es nicht nur für uns entwickelt haben wollen, sondern auch Nachnutzung gerne haben möchten. Dennis, Du hast ja im Behördenspiegel Artikel veröffentlicht. Auch zu dem Thema kam da jetzt schon auf euch zu, haben gesagt, ja, genau das wollen wir? Diverse, Diverse. Wir hatten vielleicht auch noch als Hintergrund im im letzten Jahr bei unserer großen Onlinekonferenz bei der Piazza hatten wir einen Trend Workshop, also einen Workshop, der explizit mit der Trendforschung beschäftigt hat und wir werden auch dieses Jahr in diversen Formaten das Thema noch mal adressieren und mit der Idee, die Trendforschung, die es schon gibt, zusammenzubringen. Und weil Wikipedia so eine wunderbare Marktlücke ist, ist das Interesse dadran groß. Wie sich Wikipedia für die Trendsuche nutzen lässt. Das war restart digital, der Podcast des Kompetenzzentrums öffentlicher IT. Herzlichen Dank an meine beiden Co Hosts, Jan Dennis Gumtz und Doktor Mike Weber. Wenn ihr Trends aus der Welt der digitalen Verwaltung selbst aufspüren wollt, Wiki4Trends könnt ihr kostenfrei online nutzen. Den Link haben wir euch mal in die Shownotes gepackt. Und falls euch dieser Podcast gefallen hat, folgt uns kostenfrei auf Spotify, Apple Podcasts und vielen weiteren Apps. Tschüs und bis bald, Ich bin Philipp Heinz.",
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              "transcript": "\nSpeaker 0: Nachhaltig leben, künstliche Intelligenz nutzen oder Podcasts hören. Das alles sind Trends, die in den vergangenen Jahren aufkam und einige Trends sind so groß, dass sie ganz offensichtlich sind. Bei anderen Trends aber fällt's vielleicht nicht ganz so leicht, sie zu erkennen. Eine Möglichkeit aus der Trendforschung, man befragt regelmäßig Expert*innen. Eine andere Option bietet ein neues Tool von Fraunhofer Fokus.\n\nDie Website Wiki4Trends analysiert Trends anhand großer Datenmengen und zwar von Wikipedia. Wie das geht, das erfahren wir heute in diesem Podcast. Herzlich willkommen beim öFIT Podcast restart digital, eine Produktion des Fraunhofer Instituts für offene Kommunikationssysteme. Ich bin Philipp 1 und ich begrüße hier im Studio in Berlin Tegel meine beiden Co Hosts. Das ist zum einen Jahn Dennis Gumtz.\n\nEr ist Data Scientist am Kompetenzzentrum öffentlicher IT und seine Arbeitsschwerpunkte liegen im Bereich der Trendforschung sowie der Auswertung und Aufbereitung von Daten. Hallo Dennis.\n\nSpeaker 1: Hallo, vielen Dank, dass ich hier sein darf.\n\nSpeaker 0: Und mit dabei, unser Stammgast könnte man ja immer gern sagen, Doktor Mike Weber, ebenfalls Trendforscher und stellvertretender Leiter des öfid. Tag, Maik.\n\nSpeaker 2: Hallo Philipp.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja, ihr seid beide Trendforscher. Das hat mich total gefreut, weil dann seid ihr natürlich ausgewiesene Experten auch für ein Trend Tool, das ihr so entwickelt habt. Helft mir doch gleich mal zum Beginn weiter. Warum habt ihr ausgerechnet Wikipedia angezapft?\n\nSpeaker 1: Es war zum einen eine Ergänzung zu unseren bisherigen Tools, die mehr auf wissenschaftliche Publikationen geblickt haben. Zum anderen ist Wikipedia aber einfach eine geeignete Datenquelle aus mehreren Gründen. Zum einen wird das halt regelmäßig aktualisiert durch eine engagierte Community, das heißt, die bringen neue Artikel ein, verändern Artikel, sie auf den aktuellen Stand zu bringen. Wikipedia ist eine der populärsten Websites des gesamten Internets und für viele Menschen immer noch eine wichtige Anlaufstation, wenn sie sich zu etwas informieren wollen. Dann kommt noch dazu, dass Wikipedia einfach wunderbare Schnittstellen bietet, aus denen man viele nützliche Daten seines Artikelaufrufe, seien es der Text selbst und\n\nSpeaker 0: Und diese Schnittstellen, die sind sogar kostenfrei, anzapbar und das ist ja auch nicht selbstverständlich.\n\nSpeaker 1: Genau, ja, absolut nicht. Es gibt Archive als offene Quelle, aber wenn man so über Quellen wie Scoupus oder Web of Science spricht, dann gibt es meines Wissens da keine offenen, frei verfügbaren APIs.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm. Also große Datenmengen, viel Aktivität der Community und das alles kostenfrei verfügbar. Mike, wie kam's überhaupt zu dieser Projektidee, Wikipedia anzapfen für die Trendforschung?\n\nSpeaker 2: Also einerseits war's eine Marktlücke, weil Wikipedia Daten erstaunlich wenig ausgewertet werden. So früher Twitter Auswertungen, in Anführungszeichen macht ja jeder, aber Wikipedia, da ist die Nutzung dafür, dass die Daten so wunderbar sind, erstaunlich gering. Und wir adressieren mit diesen Daten ja auch 'n bisschen andere Informationsquellen als die, die wir mit anderen Daten haben. Also wenn man wissenschaftliche Publikationen hat, die sind dann ja auch durch gewisse Einflüsse werden die dann getrieben, zum Beispiel große Förderprojekte oder so was, die dann dazu führen, dass in einem Bereich enorm viel publiziert wird. Wir haben auch 'n 'n Timelag bei wissenschaftlichen Publikationen.\n\nAlso je nachdem, welche Quelle man da anzapft, bevor son Paper dann veröffentlicht ist, kann ja eine ganze lange Zeit vergangen sein. Und bei Wikipedia haben wir das Wunderbare, dass wir auch nicht nur aus so 1 Nische, so 1 wissenschaftlichen Nische, sondern aus der Breite der Gesellschaften Impulse bekommen. Das löst dann ganz nebenbei auch ein Problem, das die Trendforschung immer hat, nämlich die Überflughöhe. Auf welcher Ebene wollen wir uns denn hier mit einem Trend beschäftigen? Und das löst Wikipedia automatisch, weil dann ist es ein Artikel dazu.\n\nMhm. Dann haben wir die Überflughöhe, die wir brauchen und können dann in die Tiefe, die Dennis ja auch schon beschrieben hat, reingehen. Und diese Kombination aus neuartigen Informationsquellen mit wunderbarer Auswertbarkeit, da konnte Dennis gar nicht anders als zuzuschlagen.\n\nSpeaker 0: Konnte es nicht anders als zuzuschlagen, aber die Idee muss ja trotzdem erst mal da sein. Wie kam's dazu?\n\nSpeaker 1: Ich muss sagen, ich kann mich gar nicht an einen Grund erinnern. Die Idee kam mir einfach. Ich hab gemerkt, hoppla, wir machen ja gar nichts dazu. Wir haben ja früher auch mal Twitter ausgewertet. Wir haben bereits wissenschaftliche Publikationen ausgewertet.\n\nHin und wieder schauen wir mal, ob wir Medienberichte auswerten können und mir ist einfach die Idee gekommen und mir ist aufgefallen, hey, da haben wir noch nichts und an sich lässt sich das aber eigentlich wunderbar auswerten.\n\nSpeaker 0: Wie machst Du das denn konkret mit deinem Tool? Also wie funktioniert das so, dass ich's mir jetzt auch als Laie gut vorstellen kann?\n\nSpeaker 1: Ich würd das Tool im Grunde in in 3 Teile aufteilen. Das eine ist die Datensammlung. Da habe ich und meine Mitentwicklerin uns vorher Gedanken gemacht, welche Daten wollen wir eigentlich haben und wie wollen wir sie abspeichern? Und genau das macht dieser erste Teil, dass wir's automatisiert laufen lassen können. Dann, wie wollen wir die Daten auswerten?\n\nUnd haben uns so Gedanken gemacht über verschiedene Metriken, die vielleicht einen Trend anzeigen können oder für eine hohe Popularität 1 Artikels stehen können. Und dementsprechend ist der zweite Teil diese Analyse, bei deren wir dann die bei uns gespeicherten Daten analysieren. Und der dritte Teil ist dann die Ergebnisaufbereitung. Da haben wir dann noch 'n Dashboard gebaut, das im Grunde auf diese analysierten Daten zugreift und diese dann ja aufbereitet darstellt, die Ergebnisse davon, ja.\n\nSpeaker 0: Und das Dashboard, das ist ja auch frei zugänglich. Also man kann dort einfach als Website sozusagen das Dashboard ansteuern und kann auch Daten dort suchen, anschauen. Nun ist es ja so, dass die deutschsprachige Wikipedia allein eine ungeheure Anzahl von Daten umfasst. Also es sind mehr als 3000000 Artikel. Meist interessieren sich Menschen ja für Trends auf 'nem bestimmten Gebiet.\n\nJetzt nicht, ne, so in alle Richtungen, sondern bestimmtes Gebiet wie zum Beispiel Rechtsruck in der europäischen Politik könnte ja ein Trend sein. Wie geht euer Tool mit diesen verschiedenen Kategorien\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, im Grunde war das war das eine große Herausforderung. Die Zahl von 3000000 für die deutsche Wikipedia hatte ich jetzt nicht im Kopf, aber ich weiß, dass es fast über 6, fast 7000000 Artikel in der englischsprachigen Wikipedia Edition sind. Und das ist natürlich eine Herausforderung, insbesondere für uns auch als Kompetenzzentrum öffentlicher IT. Uns interessiert zum Beispiel nicht, was ja in der Biologie passiert oder in der in der Geschichte notwendigerweise, sondern schon dieser Augenmerk auf IT, die auch den öffentlichen Raum betrifft. Wie wir vorgegangen sind, sind, dass wir uns so etwa 100 Artikel ausgesucht haben, die gut zu den Themen gepasst haben, die wir in der Vergangenheit bearbeitet haben.\n\nDann haben wir uns angeschaut, in welche Kategorien fallen diese Artikel? Denn jeder Artikel bei Wikipedia ist 2, 3, manchmal auch mehr Kategorien zugeordnet. Dann haben wir relativ schnell gemerkt, es gibt Kategorien, die besonders häufig dann da auftreten und genau diese Kategorien sind die, die wir im Grunde abfragen auf alle Artikel, die sich daran befinden. Dadurch gelingt es uns halt, aus etwa 900 Kategorien einen Ausschnitt von Wikipedia zu betrachten. Das sind dann immer noch über 30000 Artikel pro Wikipedia Edition, also immer noch viele, aber keine 6000000.\n\nMhm. Und sie passen halt tatsächlich zu zu unserem Interessensgebiet eigentlich. Und dadurch haben wir's ja, ich sag mal geschickt, eingegrenzt und haben weder zu viel Beifang dabei bei den Ergebnissen noch verschwenden wir zu viel Rechenressourcen für die Auswertung von Gesamtwiki, wo uns eigentlich nur ein kleiner Ausschnitt davon interessiert.\n\nSpeaker 2: Mhm. Und das Schöne ist ja, das steht ja auch als Open Source zur Verfügung und dementsprechend, wenn dich jetzt der Rechtsruck in Europa interessiert, kannst Du genau mit dem gleichen Verfahren deinen eigenen Datensatz aufbauen und mit dem Tool dann entsprechend auswerten.\n\nSpeaker 0: Das wär fast meine nächste Frage gewesen. Ich hab's natürlich ja auch getestet, ne. Ich wollt ja mal gucken, wie's funktioniert. Ja, und dann hab ich bei meinem Test auf Platz 1 des Dashboards eben gefunden, den Eintrag Retrieval Augmented Generation mit 1 Trendstärke von 82.8. Hab rausgefunden, das hat irgendwas mit Programmieren zu tun, aber zunächst mal ist es ja nicht so das Gebiet, auf dem ich so wirklich bewandert bin.\n\nWie kann ich das dann machen, dass ich eben das Dashboard an meine Interessensgebiete anpasse, wie Du sagst, Bike?\n\nSpeaker 2: Also das Tool selbst bietet in der Onlinevariante schon bestimmte Filterfunktionen und auch Fokussierungsfunktionen. Zum Beispiel auch eine Annäherung dadran, für welchen gesellschaftlichen Bereich das besonders interessant und spannend sein könnte. Also wenn ich bei Rechtsruck Politik Zivilgesellschaft bin, dann könnte ich zum Beispiel da eine hohe Bedeutung für die Zivilgesellschaft dieses Themas angeben und hätte dementsprechend eine Fokussierung auf diese Themenfelder. Wenn Du dein eigenes Forschungsprojekt daraus machen willst, dann müsstest Du an den Source Code gehen und den entsprechend für deine Bedarfe anpassen.\n\nSpeaker 0: Also da bräuchte ich schon schon Programmierkenntnisse?\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja. Ja, ein wenig. Ich sag mal so, die müssen jetzt nicht supertief gehen, weil wir haben da auch 'n Jupiter Notebook bereitgestellt. Vielleicht für alle, die nicht wissen, was das ist, dass im Grunde ein, ich sag mal, ein Python Skript, das aber relativ gut dokumentiert ist und da sieht man Schritt für Schritt, was da eigentlich gemacht wird. Das wird auch oft für so für Dokumentation tatsächlich verwendet.\n\nDas heißt, da muss man jetzt keine sehr tiefgehenden Programmierkenntnisse für haben, genau diese Anpassung vorzunehmen. Etwas wäre natürlich nützlich, aber das ist befindet sich dann eher im mittleren Bereich.\n\nSpeaker 2: Und das Schöne ist, dass wir beim letzten Podcast gelernt haben, kann man ja KI nutzen, die Syntax zum Beispiel immer richtig zu treffen bei dessen Anpassungen.\n\nSpeaker 0: Das macht's son bisschen einfacher.\n\nSpeaker 2: Das ist durchaus eine sehr nützliche Unterstützung. Wenn man das Grundkonzept verstanden hat und dann halt so Details ändern will, dann ist das Gold wert.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm. 'N weiterer Punkt, über den ich gern sprechen möchte, sind die Filter. Auch die Möglichkeit hab ich ja, dass ich die Ergebnisse auf dem Dashboard mir noch mal filtern kann. Welche Kriterien kann ich denn an meine Suche anlegen und auch an meine Filterung?\n\nSpeaker 2: Ich\n\nSpeaker 1: würde sagen, es gibt 4 inhaltliche Filter. Das ist die Relevanz für uns, also für ÖffIT, so als Tengebiet, dann Staat, Politik und Zivilgesellschaft. Alles, was dahintersteckt, ist im Grunde, dass der Text dieser Artikel ja durch einen Klassifizierer gelaufen ist, der im Grunde ausgibt, wie hoch ist die Relevanz für diesen Bereich? Dann kann ich halt da so Mindestwerte einstellen und sagen, okay, das soll jetzt mindestens 30 Prozent Relevanz für Staat haben. So und dann gibt es die, ich sag mal, mehr quantitativen Faktoren, indem ich zum Beispiel angeben kann, wie viele Wörter soll son Artikel mindestens beinhalten?\n\nWie viele Aufrufe, durchschnittliche Aufrufe am Tag soll es mindestens haben? Wie viele Bearbeitungen mindestens soll es haben? Das ist aber durchaus nützlich, wie ich jetzt grade erst heute Morgen festgestellt habe, weil ich hab mir die Daten für den April 20 25 angeschaut. Und die Nummer 1 in der deutschen Wikipedia ist halt ein Tatort, der heißt. Der Grund, warum das überhaupt da drin gelandet ist, weil es inhaltlich wohl, ich hab den Tatort nicht gesehen, aber ich hab mir die Kurzzusammenfassung durchgelesen, einen Mord geht, bei dem autonomes Fahren involviert war und bei dem es einen, glaub ich, einen IT Chef getroffen hat.\n\nDeshalb ist es innerhalb unseres Interessensgebiet gelandet. Aber der Grund, dass dieser Artikel dann am Fremden ist, ist, dass es 2, ich sag mal, Berge in den Aufbruchstatistiken gab, 1 relativ kürzlich. Und es hängt einfach damit zusammen, dass dieser Tatort erst kürzlich wieder ausgestrahlt worden ist. Dementsprechend haben da Leute anschließend drauf geklickt auf diesen Artikel und deshalb ist der so hoch gewandert.\n\nSpeaker 0: Verstehe.\n\nSpeaker 1: Genau, wenn man sich aber die Bearbeitung anschaut, weil er, der ist 2018, glaub ich, das erste Mal ausgestrahlt hat, hat er kaum Bearbeitung. Das heißt, wenn ich den Filter für Bearbeitung hochsetze, dann taucht dieser Artikel nicht mehr auf unter diesen Trendartikeln, weil da eigentlich nichts Neues passiert ist. Da hat sich inhaltlich nichts dran geändert, aber nur in den Aufrufstatistiken. Das heißt, da hab ich ja gleich son bisschen eigentlich heute Morgen herausgefunden, dieser Bearbeitungsfilter für für Mindestanzahl von Bearbeitungen ist eigentlich ganz nützlich.\n\nSpeaker 0: Jetzt kannst Du an die ganzen Kleinigkeiten, danach zu justieren, Maik?\n\nSpeaker 2: So kann man dann durch 2 einfache Einstellungen 'n Hype vom Trend unterscheiden. Also der Hype, weil das noch mal ausgestrahlt worden ist, aber im Prinzip ist nicht viel passiert, also kein Trend.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm. Weil ich\n\nSpeaker 2: den Tatort auch nicht gesehen hab, vielleicht ist er voll trendig, das weiß ich jetzt nicht.\n\nSpeaker 0: Bleiben wir noch mal so bei den Filterungen und bei den ganzen Unterscheidungen, die man so treffen kann. Ihr unterscheidet auf dem Dashboard auch zwischen\n\nSpeaker 1: Trend versucht man normalerweise irgendwas abzugreifen, was erst im Kommen ist. Das heißt, meistens geht es dabei einen Anstieg, eine Steigerung. Das kann ein Anstieg der Aufrufanzahl sein, das kann ein Anstieg der Bearbeitungen sein, so was in der Art. Etwas, was vielleicht jetzt noch nicht superpopulär ist, aber es in 2, 3 Jahren vielleicht sein könnte. Da geht das halt darum, irgendwie vor die Welle zu kommen oder zumindest im Gleichschritt mit der Welle zu sein, halt frühzeitig über neue Entwicklungen informiert zu sein und dementsprechend handeln zu können.\n\nSpeaker 0: Das heißt, populär ist die Gegenwart und Populär. Der Trend ist so der der Versuch 1 Blicks in die Zukunft.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ganz genau, ja.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm. Dennis, Du schreibst ja in 'nem Artikel über das Projekt, dass es noch mehr ist als nur ein Dashboard. Was meinst Du damit? Was steckt da noch dahinter? Also welche Vision hast Du noch dafür?\n\nSpeaker 1: Zum einen ist dieses Dashboard halt nicht statisch oder in der Zeit eingefroren. Das heißt, das ist etwas, was wir sowohl mit neuen Daten befüllen werden, als auch wo wir noch darüber nachdenken, zusätzliche Funktionalität hinzu zu bauen und auch durch Dritte dadurch, dass der Source Code auch verfügbar ist, ja, auch Funktionalität dazu gebaut werden kann. Und zum anderen ist es halt dieses dreiteilige Programmpaket, was eben nicht nur dieses Dashboard betrifft, sondern wo halt auch die Datensammlung und Datenanalyse vorliegt.\n\nSpeaker 0: Und Analyse ist 'n super Stichwort. Mike, was macht ihr denn eigentlich mit den Daten? Was macht ihr mit den Ergebnissen?\n\nSpeaker 1: Wenn ich\n\nSpeaker 2: nur einen Satz dazu sagen Na klar, gerne. Auch die Metriken, die dahinter liegen, sind natürlich Das ist alles plausibel, alles nachvollziehbar, aber gerade in der Anwendung wird man dann ja noch zusätzlich lernen, welche Metriken vielleicht noch besser passen als die, die jetzt schon verbaut sind, die da drin sind. Und was man damit machen kann, ist ja Erst mal hat man, wenn man das aufruft, hat man ja schon einen Eindruck von dem, was gerade im Moment populär ist, was gerade trendet. Das ist natürlich schon der erste große Mehrwert, aber das Schöne ist, wenn man dann auch ganz bewusst in einzelne Technologien oder einzelne Trends, einzelne Themenbereiche rein zoomt, dann eröffnet sich ja noch mal ein Riesenfeld von Indikatoren und dann Dingen, die man beobachten kann. Also auch Sachen, die jetzt vielleicht nicht so der ganz heiße Scheiß sind, der im Moment diskutiert wird, kann man dann halt weiter nachverfolgen, ob es zum Beispiel da noch eine Community gibt, die sich damit beschäftigt.\n\nAlso vielleicht war das ja mal 'n großer Hype und jetzt wird es Gedeiht es in 'ner Nische weiter oder aber war's 'n großer Hype und ist dann abgeflacht? Wie ist das mit der Entwicklung der Bearbeitenden und Beobachtenden? Also wird diese Community da vielleicht dann doch wieder größer? Entsteht da vielleicht wieder was Neues oder bleibt das so in etwa? Oder aber stirbt es ab?\n\nHalt solche Sachen kann man damit halt eben auch beobachten.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm. Schon ganz gutes Beispiel. Vielleicht machen wir das noch 'n bisschen greifbarer und steigen mal ein in die Frage, wie sich diese Daten, diese Ergebnisse auch nutzen lassen für die öffentliche Verwaltung. Konntet ihr schon Trends für die digitale Verwaltung ableiten aus euren Ergebnissen, aus euren Analysen?\n\nSpeaker 1: Vielleicht läuft es dafür noch nicht lang genug. Wir haben das jetzt erst, ich glaub, Ende April online gestellt. Was ich persönlich halt sagen kann, was mir aufgefallen ist, dass son paar Dinge ja in den Top Ten dieser Listen dann aufgetaucht sind, die mir noch nichts gesagt haben, zum Beispiel diverse Cybersecurity Bedrohungen, die natürlich auch für die öffentliche Verwaltung relevant sind, weil auch die öffentliche Verwaltung natürlich bedroht ist. Ansonsten viel aus dem Bereich KI neue Entwicklungen in diesem Bereich, was natürlich auch wieder relevant ist für die öffentliche Verwaltung, wenn sie KI einsetzen möchte. Und wie ich schon erwähnt hatte, ist das ganze ja transferierbar.\n\nDas heißt, die öffentliche Verwaltung, falls sie ein spezielles Interessensgebiet hat, kann sie theoretisch dieses Tool auch darauf zuschneiden.\n\nSpeaker 2: Mhm.\n\nSpeaker 0: Meine Frage war halt dann auch, na ja, wozu muss die digitale Verwaltung überhaupt Trends erkennen? Vielleicht 'n bisschen ketzerisch, aber so, wie Du's jetzt grad beschrieben hast, macht's ja erst mal Sinn, ne? Also Cybersecurity, Sicherheit, aber auch KI Tools, die ja in der Verwaltung wahrscheinlich auch sehr, sehr helfen können in den nächsten Jahren. Also klingt erst mal logisch, oder?\n\nSpeaker 2: Absolut. Und eine der schönen Seiten von Wikipedia ist ja, dass nicht nur dann die Konzepte und die schwierig auszusprechenden neuesten Entwicklungen da berücksichtigt werden, sondern bis hin zu Produkten, die angeboten werden, die halt eben auch entsprechende entsprechende Einträge haben und wo man dann gucken kann, welches Sprachmodell gerade besonders hip ist oder so was in der Richtung. Aber wir betreiben ja auch schon 'n ganzes Weilchentrennforschung und aus guten Gründen. Dieses, was Dennis ja auch schon gesagt hat, vor die Welle zu kommen und so zu wissen, erst mal, was überhaupt gerade im Moment diskutiert wird und und was gerade passiert, kann enorm wichtig sein. Also wir hatten das rückblickend ein ein ganz spezieller Fall, VMware ist eine Software, die sehr verbreitet ist in der öffentlichen Verwaltung oder war, wahrscheinlich immer noch ist und wo dann der Eigentümer gewechselt hat und dementsprechend die Preismodelle gewechselt haben und all so etwas.\n\nUnd das ist etwas, was man jetzt historisch betrachtet in den Wikipedia Daten hervorragend sieht. Genau da, wo es dir 'n Wechsel gegeben hat, gibt es einen Riesenausschlag. Das heißt, wenn wir das Tool damals schon gehabt hätten, wäre es sofort angesprungen. Und das Systemfeld, VMware, was machen wir damit in der öffentlichen Verwaltung? Wie ersetzen wir's möglicherweise oder wie gehen wir sonst damit Das ist ein riesiges operativ wichtiges Themenfeld, das gerade munter diskutiert wird in dem Bereich.\n\nWarum machen wir das? Dieses vor die Welle kommen, es ist ja immer Also es Die die öffentliche Hand hat ja ganz, ganz viele Bedarfe in dem Bereich. Also sowohl, was sie selbst einsetzt, was sie aktuell einsetzt, das lässt sich wunderbar beobachten durch das Tool, was sie möglicherweise zukünftig einsetzt. Da sind dann auch solche Trendbeobachtungen ganz besonders wichtig. Aber natürlich auch, wo sind möglicherweise Regulierungsherausforderungen?\n\nAuch dafür eben, weil Wikipedia so breit ist und so in unterschiedlichen Sektoren, würd ich mal sagen, unterwegs ist, auch dafür eignet es sich hervorragend. Und dann hatten wir ja immer das Problem, dass Daten immer nur die Vergangenheit abbilden können. Es ist halt so. Und deswegen dieser dieser Versuch, in die Zukunft zu gucken, dementsprechend herausfordernd ist, aber grade da ja auch wieder Wikipedia so viele Daten liefert, da ist dann wieder die die Verfügbarkeit der Daten ganz entscheidend, dass man damit entsprechend variieren kann und dann hoffentlich der Zukunft ein bisschen näher kommt als mit anderen Datenquellen.\n\nSpeaker 0: Welche Behörden brauchen dieses Wissen, dieses Trendwissen dann besonders? Also an an wen denkt ihr da?\n\nSpeaker 2: Das ist ja jetzt ganz einfach, das Digitalministerium.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja gut.\n\nSpeaker 2: Nein, aber bei unserem Themenfeld im Bereich der Digitalisierung sind es in der Tat all die Ministerien und Einrichtungen, die sich mit Digitalisierungsfragen beschäftigen. Sicherheitsrisiken hatten wir eben schon. Auch das BSI betreibt ja auch eigene Trendforschung. Da ist es 'n ganz, ganz wichtiger Bereich. Für den Einsatz ist es 'n ganz wichtiger Bereich.\n\nEin Aspekt, zu dem wir ja auch selbst grade arbeiten im Bereich digitale Souveränität ist es 'n ganz wichtiger Punkt. Auf welche Technologien soll ich für die Zukunft setzen, die digitale Souveränität zu erhalten oder zu steigern? Also ich will alle.\n\nSpeaker 0: Wenn jetzt eine Behörde sagt, na ja, also klingt spannend, wir würden gerne Wiki4Trace auch bei uns einsetzen, für uns einsetzen, wie könnt ihr da unterstützen? Oder ist das gar nicht nötig, weil jeder drauf zugreifen kann?\n\nSpeaker 1: In der Idealvorstellung ist es natürlich nicht nötig, dass wir da unterstützen. Gleichzeitig wissen wir natürlich auch dadurch, dass wir das Tool entwickelt haben, ist für uns die Hürde, Änderungen und Anpassungen da vorzunehmen, natürlich sehr viel geringer als ja bei Neulingen, die sich da erst einarbeiten müssen. Von daher, wir haben es gut dokumentiert online gestellt, sind aber auch bereit, ja, zu unterstützen dabei, es dann auch zum Laufen zu bekommen, ja, da wir es nicht nur für uns entwickelt haben wollen, sondern auch Nachnutzung gerne haben möchten.\n\nSpeaker 0: Dennis, Du hast ja im Behördenspiegel Artikel veröffentlicht. Auch zu dem Thema kam da jetzt schon auf euch zu, haben gesagt, ja, genau das wollen\n\nSpeaker 2: wir? Diverse, Diverse. Wir hatten vielleicht auch noch als Hintergrund im im letzten Jahr bei unserer großen Onlinekonferenz bei der Piazza hatten wir einen Trend Workshop, also einen Workshop, der explizit mit der Trendforschung beschäftigt hat und wir werden auch dieses Jahr in diversen Formaten das Thema noch mal adressieren und mit der Idee, die Trendforschung, die es schon gibt, zusammenzubringen. Und weil Wikipedia so eine wunderbare Marktlücke ist, ist das Interesse dadran groß.\n\nSpeaker 0: Wie sich Wikipedia für die Trendsuche nutzen lässt. Das war restart digital, der Podcast des Kompetenzzentrums öffentlicher IT. Herzlichen Dank an meine beiden Co Hosts, Jan Dennis Gumtz und Doktor Mike Weber. Wenn ihr Trends aus der Welt der digitalen Verwaltung selbst aufspüren wollt, Wiki4Trends könnt ihr kostenfrei online nutzen. Den Link haben wir euch mal in die Shownotes gepackt.\n\nUnd falls euch dieser Podcast gefallen hat, folgt uns kostenfrei auf Spotify, Apple Podcasts und vielen weiteren Apps. Tschüs und bis bald, Ich bin\n\nSpeaker 1: Philipp Heinz.",
              "paragraphs": [
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Nachhaltig leben, künstliche Intelligenz nutzen oder Podcasts hören.",
                      "start": 1.5999999,
                      "end": 5.6
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das alles sind Trends, die in den vergangenen Jahren aufkam und einige Trends sind so groß, dass sie ganz offensichtlich sind.",
                      "start": 5.6,
                      "end": 12.915
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Bei anderen Trends aber fällt's vielleicht nicht ganz so leicht, sie zu erkennen.",
                      "start": 13.155,
                      "end": 17.095
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Eine Möglichkeit aus der Trendforschung, man befragt regelmäßig Expert*innen.",
                      "start": 17.555,
                      "end": 21.415
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Eine andere Option bietet ein neues Tool von Fraunhofer Fokus.",
                      "start": 22.115,
                      "end": 25.494999
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1.5999999,
                  "end": 25.494999,
                  "num_words": 61.0,
                  "speaker": 0
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Die Website Wiki4Trends analysiert Trends anhand großer Datenmengen und zwar von Wikipedia.",
                      "start": 25.76,
                      "end": 31.46
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Wie das geht, das erfahren wir heute in diesem Podcast.",
                      "start": 31.92,
                      "end": 34.66
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Herzlich willkommen beim öFIT Podcast restart digital, eine Produktion des Fraunhofer Instituts für offene Kommunikationssysteme.",
                      "start": 51.045,
                      "end": 57.6
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Ich bin Philipp 1 und ich begrüße hier im Studio in Berlin Tegel meine beiden Co Hosts.",
                      "start": 58.94,
                      "end": 63.84
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das ist zum einen Jahn Dennis Gumtz.",
                      "start": 63.899998,
                      "end": 66.32
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 25.76,
                  "end": 66.32,
                  "num_words": 61.0,
                  "speaker": 0
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Er ist Data Scientist am Kompetenzzentrum öffentlicher IT und seine Arbeitsschwerpunkte liegen im Bereich der Trendforschung sowie der Auswertung und Aufbereitung von Daten.",
                      "start": 66.38,
                      "end": 75.705
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Hallo Dennis.",
                      "start": 75.705,
                      "end": 76.525
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 66.38,
                  "end": 76.525,
                  "num_words": 25.0,
                  "speaker": 0
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Hallo, vielen Dank, dass ich hier sein darf.",
                      "start": 76.825,
                      "end": 79.085
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 76.825,
                  "end": 79.085,
                  "num_words": 8.0,
                  "speaker": 1
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Und mit dabei, unser Stammgast könnte man ja immer gern sagen, Doktor Mike Weber, ebenfalls Trendforscher und stellvertretender Leiter des öfid.",
                      "start": 79.465,
                      "end": 86.659996
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Tag, Maik.",
                      "start": 86.659996,
                      "end": 87.479996
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                  ],
                  "start": 79.465,
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                {
                  "sentences": [
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                      "text": "Hallo Philipp.",
                      "start": 87.619995,
                      "end": 88.44
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 87.619995,
                  "end": 88.44,
                  "num_words": 2.0,
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                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Ja, ihr seid beide Trendforscher.",
                      "start": 89.38,
                      "end": 90.76
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das hat mich total gefreut, weil dann seid ihr natürlich ausgewiesene Experten auch für ein Trend Tool, das ihr so entwickelt habt.",
                      "start": 90.9,
                      "end": 96.405
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Helft mir doch gleich mal zum Beginn weiter.",
                      "start": 96.885,
                      "end": 98.725
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Warum habt ihr ausgerechnet Wikipedia angezapft?",
                      "start": 98.725,
                      "end": 101.705
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 89.38,
                  "end": 101.705,
                  "num_words": 41.0,
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                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Es war zum einen eine Ergänzung zu unseren bisherigen Tools, die mehr auf wissenschaftliche Publikationen geblickt haben.",
                      "start": 103.765,
                      "end": 111.96
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Zum anderen ist Wikipedia aber einfach eine geeignete Datenquelle aus mehreren Gründen.",
                      "start": 112.12,
                      "end": 118.14
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Zum einen wird das halt regelmäßig aktualisiert durch eine engagierte Community, das heißt, die bringen neue Artikel ein, verändern Artikel, sie auf den aktuellen Stand zu bringen.",
                      "start": 119.0,
                      "end": 129.825
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Wikipedia ist eine der populärsten Websites des gesamten Internets und für viele Menschen immer noch eine wichtige Anlaufstation, wenn sie sich zu etwas informieren wollen.",
                      "start": 129.885,
                      "end": 140.3
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Dann kommt noch dazu, dass Wikipedia einfach wunderbare Schnittstellen bietet, aus denen man viele nützliche Daten seines Artikelaufrufe, seien es der Text selbst und",
                      "start": 140.3,
                      "end": 150.7
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 103.765,
                  "end": 150.7,
                  "num_words": 105.0,
                  "speaker": 1
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Und diese Schnittstellen, die sind sogar kostenfrei, anzapbar und das ist ja auch nicht selbstverständlich.",
                      "start": 150.86,
                      "end": 155.46501
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 150.86,
                  "end": 155.46501,
                  "num_words": 15.0,
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                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Genau, ja, absolut nicht.",
                      "start": 155.925,
                      "end": 157.125
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Es gibt Archive als offene Quelle, aber wenn man so über Quellen wie Scoupus oder Web of Science spricht, dann gibt es meines Wissens da keine offenen, frei verfügbaren APIs.",
                      "start": 157.125,
                      "end": 170.9
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 155.925,
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                  "num_words": 34.0,
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                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Mhm.",
                      "start": 171.12,
                      "end": 171.62
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also große Datenmengen, viel Aktivität der Community und das alles kostenfrei verfügbar.",
                      "start": 172.0,
                      "end": 177.3
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Mike, wie kam's überhaupt zu dieser Projektidee, Wikipedia anzapfen für die Trendforschung?",
                      "start": 177.36,
                      "end": 181.62
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                  ],
                  "start": 171.12,
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                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Also einerseits war's eine Marktlücke, weil Wikipedia Daten erstaunlich wenig ausgewertet werden.",
                      "start": 183.415,
                      "end": 188.95499
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "So früher Twitter Auswertungen, in Anführungszeichen macht ja jeder, aber Wikipedia, da ist die Nutzung dafür, dass die Daten so wunderbar sind, erstaunlich gering.",
                      "start": 189.33499,
                      "end": 199.34
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                    {
                      "text": "Und wir adressieren mit diesen Daten ja auch 'n bisschen andere Informationsquellen als die, die wir mit anderen Daten haben.",
                      "start": 199.95999,
                      "end": 207.95999
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also wenn man wissenschaftliche Publikationen hat, die sind dann ja auch durch gewisse Einflüsse werden die dann getrieben, zum Beispiel große Förderprojekte oder so was, die dann dazu führen, dass in einem Bereich enorm viel publiziert wird.",
                      "start": 207.95999,
                      "end": 220.035
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                    {
                      "text": "Wir haben auch 'n 'n Timelag bei wissenschaftlichen Publikationen.",
                      "start": 220.035,
                      "end": 223.015
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 183.415,
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                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Also je nachdem, welche Quelle man da anzapft, bevor son Paper dann veröffentlicht ist, kann ja eine ganze lange Zeit vergangen sein.",
                      "start": 223.155,
                      "end": 229.81
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und bei Wikipedia haben wir das Wunderbare, dass wir auch nicht nur aus so 1 Nische, so 1 wissenschaftlichen Nische, sondern aus der Breite der Gesellschaften Impulse bekommen.",
                      "start": 230.34999,
                      "end": 240.12999
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das löst dann ganz nebenbei auch ein Problem, das die Trendforschung immer hat, nämlich die Überflughöhe.",
                      "start": 241.33499,
                      "end": 245.275
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Auf welcher Ebene wollen wir uns denn hier mit einem Trend beschäftigen?",
                      "start": 245.33499,
                      "end": 248.635
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und das löst Wikipedia automatisch, weil dann ist es ein Artikel dazu.",
                      "start": 249.095,
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                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Mhm.",
                      "start": 252.855,
                      "end": 253.095
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Dann haben wir die Überflughöhe, die wir brauchen und können dann in die Tiefe, die Dennis ja auch schon beschrieben hat, reingehen.",
                      "start": 253.095,
                      "end": 258.44
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und diese Kombination aus neuartigen Informationsquellen mit wunderbarer Auswertbarkeit, da konnte Dennis gar nicht anders als zuzuschlagen.",
                      "start": 258.66,
                      "end": 267.8
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 252.855,
                  "end": 267.8,
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                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Konnte es nicht anders als zuzuschlagen, aber die Idee muss ja trotzdem erst mal da sein.",
                      "start": 268.38498,
                      "end": 272.38498
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Wie kam's dazu?",
                      "start": 272.38498,
                      "end": 273.285
                    }
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                      "text": "Ich muss sagen, ich kann mich gar nicht an einen Grund erinnern.",
                      "start": 275.26498,
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                      "text": "Die Idee kam mir einfach.",
                      "start": 278.225,
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                      "text": "Ich hab gemerkt, hoppla, wir machen ja gar nichts dazu.",
                      "start": 279.985,
                      "end": 282.805
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                    {
                      "text": "Wir haben ja früher auch mal Twitter ausgewertet.",
                      "start": 283.15997,
                      "end": 286.13998
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Wir haben bereits wissenschaftliche Publikationen ausgewertet.",
                      "start": 286.43997,
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                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Hin und wieder schauen wir mal, ob wir Medienberichte auswerten können und mir ist einfach die Idee gekommen und mir ist aufgefallen, hey, da haben wir noch nichts und an sich lässt sich das aber eigentlich wunderbar auswerten.",
                      "start": 289.4,
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                  "num_words": 38.0,
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                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Wie machst Du das denn konkret mit deinem Tool?",
                      "start": 302.645,
                      "end": 304.885
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also wie funktioniert das so, dass ich's mir jetzt auch als Laie gut vorstellen kann?",
                      "start": 304.885,
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                    }
                  ],
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                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Ich würd das Tool im Grunde in in 3 Teile aufteilen.",
                      "start": 308.725,
                      "end": 312.96
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das eine ist die Datensammlung.",
                      "start": 314.13998,
                      "end": 315.84
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                      "text": "Da habe ich und meine Mitentwicklerin uns vorher Gedanken gemacht, welche Daten wollen wir eigentlich haben und wie wollen wir sie abspeichern?",
                      "start": 316.53998,
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                      "text": "Und genau das macht dieser erste Teil, dass wir's automatisiert laufen lassen können.",
                      "start": 326.19498,
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                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Dann, wie wollen wir die Daten auswerten?",
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                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Und haben uns so Gedanken gemacht über verschiedene Metriken, die vielleicht einen Trend anzeigen können oder für eine hohe Popularität 1 Artikels stehen können.",
                      "start": 335.555,
                      "end": 347.08002
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                    {
                      "text": "Und dementsprechend ist der zweite Teil diese Analyse, bei deren wir dann die bei uns gespeicherten Daten analysieren.",
                      "start": 347.08002,
                      "end": 353.90002
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und der dritte Teil ist dann die Ergebnisaufbereitung.",
                      "start": 354.745,
                      "end": 356.925
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Da haben wir dann noch 'n Dashboard gebaut, das im Grunde auf diese analysierten Daten zugreift und diese dann ja aufbereitet darstellt, die Ergebnisse davon, ja.",
                      "start": 357.625,
                      "end": 368.73
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                  "start": 335.555,
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                  "sentences": [
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                      "text": "Und das Dashboard, das ist ja auch frei zugänglich.",
                      "start": 368.89,
                      "end": 371.15002
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also man kann dort einfach als Website sozusagen das Dashboard ansteuern und kann auch Daten dort suchen, anschauen.",
                      "start": 371.21002,
                      "end": 377.23
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Nun ist es ja so, dass die deutschsprachige Wikipedia allein eine ungeheure Anzahl von Daten umfasst.",
                      "start": 377.69,
                      "end": 382.97
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also es sind mehr als 3000000 Artikel.",
                      "start": 382.97,
                      "end": 385.39502
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                      "text": "Meist interessieren sich Menschen ja für Trends auf 'nem bestimmten Gebiet.",
                      "start": 386.49503,
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                  "sentences": [
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                      "text": "Jetzt nicht, ne, so in alle Richtungen, sondern bestimmtes Gebiet wie zum Beispiel Rechtsruck in der europäischen Politik könnte ja ein Trend sein.",
                      "start": 389.93503,
                      "end": 398.41
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Wie geht euer Tool mit diesen verschiedenen Kategorien",
                      "start": 398.47,
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                  ],
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                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Ja, im Grunde war das war das eine große Herausforderung.",
                      "start": 402.47,
                      "end": 405.21
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Die Zahl von 3000000 für die deutsche Wikipedia hatte ich jetzt nicht im Kopf, aber ich weiß, dass es fast über 6, fast 7000000 Artikel in der englischsprachigen Wikipedia Edition sind.",
                      "start": 406.39,
                      "end": 418.395
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und das ist natürlich eine Herausforderung, insbesondere für uns auch als Kompetenzzentrum öffentlicher IT.",
                      "start": 419.81497,
                      "end": 426.875
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Uns interessiert zum Beispiel nicht, was ja in der Biologie passiert oder in der in der Geschichte notwendigerweise, sondern schon dieser Augenmerk auf IT, die auch den öffentlichen Raum betrifft.",
                      "start": 427.22,
                      "end": 441.16
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Wie wir vorgegangen sind, sind, dass wir uns so etwa 100 Artikel ausgesucht haben, die gut zu den Themen gepasst haben, die wir in der Vergangenheit bearbeitet haben.",
                      "start": 442.045,
                      "end": 453.48502
                    }
                  ],
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                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Dann haben wir uns angeschaut, in welche Kategorien fallen diese Artikel?",
                      "start": 453.48502,
                      "end": 458.75
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Denn jeder Artikel bei Wikipedia ist 2, 3, manchmal auch mehr Kategorien zugeordnet.",
                      "start": 458.75,
                      "end": 464.21002
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Dann haben wir relativ schnell gemerkt, es gibt Kategorien, die besonders häufig dann da auftreten und genau diese Kategorien sind die, die wir im Grunde abfragen auf alle Artikel, die sich daran befinden.",
                      "start": 464.91,
                      "end": 477.105
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Dadurch gelingt es uns halt, aus etwa 900 Kategorien einen Ausschnitt von Wikipedia zu betrachten.",
                      "start": 477.885,
                      "end": 484.305
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das sind dann immer noch über 30000 Artikel pro Wikipedia Edition, also immer noch viele, aber keine 6000000.",
                      "start": 484.845,
                      "end": 493.2
                    }
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                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Mhm.",
                      "start": 493.42,
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                    },
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                      "text": "Und sie passen halt tatsächlich zu zu unserem Interessensgebiet eigentlich.",
                      "start": 494.86002,
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                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und dadurch haben wir's ja, ich sag mal geschickt, eingegrenzt und haben weder zu viel Beifang dabei bei den Ergebnissen noch verschwenden wir zu viel Rechenressourcen für die Auswertung von Gesamtwiki, wo uns eigentlich nur ein kleiner Ausschnitt davon interessiert.",
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                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Mhm.",
                      "start": 519.42004,
                      "end": 519.58
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und das Schöne ist ja, das steht ja auch als Open Source zur Verfügung und dementsprechend, wenn dich jetzt der Rechtsruck in Europa interessiert, kannst Du genau mit dem gleichen Verfahren deinen eigenen Datensatz aufbauen und mit dem Tool dann entsprechend auswerten.",
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                  ],
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                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Das wär fast meine nächste Frage gewesen.",
                      "start": 532.545,
                      "end": 534.145
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Ich hab's natürlich ja auch getestet, ne.",
                      "start": 534.145,
                      "end": 535.825
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Ich wollt ja mal gucken, wie's funktioniert.",
                      "start": 535.825,
                      "end": 537.445
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Ja, und dann hab ich bei meinem Test auf Platz 1 des Dashboards eben gefunden, den Eintrag Retrieval Augmented Generation mit 1 Trendstärke von 82.8.",
                      "start": 538.705,
                      "end": 547.99
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Hab rausgefunden, das hat irgendwas mit Programmieren zu tun, aber zunächst mal ist es ja nicht so das Gebiet, auf dem ich so wirklich bewandert bin.",
                      "start": 549.00995,
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                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Wie kann ich das dann machen, dass ich eben das Dashboard an meine Interessensgebiete anpasse, wie Du sagst, Bike?",
                      "start": 555.97,
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                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Also das Tool selbst bietet in der Onlinevariante schon bestimmte Filterfunktionen und auch Fokussierungsfunktionen.",
                      "start": 563.385,
                      "end": 569.885
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Zum Beispiel auch eine Annäherung dadran, für welchen gesellschaftlichen Bereich das besonders interessant und spannend sein könnte.",
                      "start": 571.065,
                      "end": 576.94
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also wenn ich bei Rechtsruck Politik Zivilgesellschaft bin, dann könnte ich zum Beispiel da eine hohe Bedeutung für die Zivilgesellschaft dieses Themas angeben und hätte dementsprechend eine Fokussierung auf diese Themenfelder.",
                      "start": 577.8,
                      "end": 589.185
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Wenn Du dein eigenes Forschungsprojekt daraus machen willst, dann müsstest Du an den Source Code gehen und den entsprechend für deine Bedarfe anpassen.",
                      "start": 590.28503,
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                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Also da bräuchte ich schon schon Programmierkenntnisse?",
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                  "sentences": [
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                      "text": "Ja.",
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                      "text": "Ja, ein wenig.",
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                    {
                      "text": "Ich sag mal so, die müssen jetzt nicht supertief gehen, weil wir haben da auch 'n Jupiter Notebook bereitgestellt.",
                      "start": 603.31,
                      "end": 610.21
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Vielleicht für alle, die nicht wissen, was das ist, dass im Grunde ein, ich sag mal, ein Python Skript, das aber relativ gut dokumentiert ist und da sieht man Schritt für Schritt, was da eigentlich gemacht wird.",
                      "start": 612.11,
                      "end": 622.245
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das wird auch oft für so für Dokumentation tatsächlich verwendet.",
                      "start": 622.305,
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                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Das heißt, da muss man jetzt keine sehr tiefgehenden Programmierkenntnisse für haben, genau diese Anpassung vorzunehmen.",
                      "start": 625.34503,
                      "end": 633.15
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Etwas wäre natürlich nützlich, aber das ist befindet sich dann eher im mittleren Bereich.",
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                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Und das Schöne ist, dass wir beim letzten Podcast gelernt haben, kann man ja KI nutzen, die Syntax zum Beispiel immer richtig zu treffen bei dessen Anpassungen.",
                      "start": 640.315,
                      "end": 648.495
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                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Das macht's son bisschen einfacher.",
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                },
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                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Das ist durchaus eine sehr nützliche Unterstützung.",
                      "start": 650.555,
                      "end": 652.875
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Wenn man das Grundkonzept verstanden hat und dann halt so Details ändern will, dann ist das Gold wert.",
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                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Mhm.",
                      "start": 659.11,
                      "end": 659.61
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "'N weiterer Punkt, über den ich gern sprechen möchte, sind die Filter.",
                      "start": 660.95,
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                    },
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                      "text": "Auch die Möglichkeit hab ich ja, dass ich die Ergebnisse auf dem Dashboard mir noch mal filtern kann.",
                      "start": 663.58997,
                      "end": 668.57
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Welche Kriterien kann ich denn an meine Suche anlegen und auch an meine Filterung?",
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                  ],
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                      "text": "Ich",
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                  ],
                  "start": 673.055,
                  "end": 673.555,
                  "num_words": 1.0,
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                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "würde sagen, es gibt 4 inhaltliche Filter.",
                      "start": 675.455,
                      "end": 678.835
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das ist die Relevanz für uns, also für ÖffIT, so als Tengebiet, dann Staat, Politik und Zivilgesellschaft.",
                      "start": 680.09503,
                      "end": 688.38
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Alles, was dahintersteckt, ist im Grunde, dass der Text dieser Artikel ja durch einen Klassifizierer gelaufen ist, der im Grunde ausgibt, wie hoch ist die Relevanz für diesen Bereich?",
                      "start": 688.38,
                      "end": 698.24
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Dann kann ich halt da so Mindestwerte einstellen und sagen, okay, das soll jetzt mindestens 30 Prozent Relevanz für Staat haben.",
                      "start": 698.51495,
                      "end": 705.795
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "So und dann gibt es die, ich sag mal, mehr quantitativen Faktoren, indem ich zum Beispiel angeben kann, wie viele Wörter soll son Artikel mindestens beinhalten?",
                      "start": 705.795,
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                    }
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                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Wie viele Aufrufe, durchschnittliche Aufrufe am Tag soll es mindestens haben?",
                      "start": 716.6,
                      "end": 722.36
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Wie viele Bearbeitungen mindestens soll es haben?",
                      "start": 722.36,
                      "end": 725.58
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das ist aber durchaus nützlich, wie ich jetzt grade erst heute Morgen festgestellt habe, weil ich hab mir die Daten für den April 20 25 angeschaut.",
                      "start": 725.96,
                      "end": 735.585
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und die Nummer 1 in der deutschen Wikipedia ist halt ein Tatort, der heißt.",
                      "start": 736.28503,
                      "end": 741.265
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Der Grund, warum das überhaupt da drin gelandet ist, weil es inhaltlich wohl, ich hab den Tatort nicht gesehen, aber ich hab mir die Kurzzusammenfassung durchgelesen, einen Mord geht, bei dem autonomes Fahren involviert war und bei dem es einen, glaub ich, einen IT Chef getroffen hat.",
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                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Deshalb ist es innerhalb unseres Interessensgebiet gelandet.",
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                      "end": 764.125
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Aber der Grund, dass dieser Artikel dann am Fremden ist, ist, dass es 2, ich sag mal, Berge in den Aufbruchstatistiken gab, 1 relativ kürzlich.",
                      "start": 764.505,
                      "end": 774.33
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und es hängt einfach damit zusammen, dass dieser Tatort erst kürzlich wieder ausgestrahlt worden ist.",
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                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Dementsprechend haben da Leute anschließend drauf geklickt auf diesen Artikel und deshalb ist der so hoch gewandert.",
                      "start": 779.69,
                      "end": 784.59
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 760.825,
                  "end": 784.59,
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                  "speaker": 1
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Verstehe.",
                      "start": 784.73004,
                      "end": 785.23004
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 784.73004,
                  "end": 785.23004,
                  "num_words": 1.0,
                  "speaker": 0
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Genau, wenn man sich aber die Bearbeitung anschaut, weil er, der ist 2018, glaub ich, das erste Mal ausgestrahlt hat, hat er kaum Bearbeitung.",
                      "start": 785.525,
                      "end": 792.165
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das heißt, wenn ich den Filter für Bearbeitung hochsetze, dann taucht dieser Artikel nicht mehr auf unter diesen Trendartikeln, weil da eigentlich nichts Neues passiert ist.",
                      "start": 792.165,
                      "end": 802.32
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Da hat sich inhaltlich nichts dran geändert, aber nur in den Aufrufstatistiken.",
                      "start": 802.32,
                      "end": 806.66003
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das heißt, da hab ich ja gleich son bisschen eigentlich heute Morgen herausgefunden, dieser Bearbeitungsfilter für für Mindestanzahl von Bearbeitungen ist eigentlich ganz nützlich.",
                      "start": 807.04004,
                      "end": 815.58496
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 785.525,
                  "end": 815.58496,
                  "num_words": 86.0,
                  "speaker": 1
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Jetzt kannst Du an die ganzen Kleinigkeiten, danach zu justieren, Maik?",
                      "start": 815.96497,
                      "end": 818.865
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 815.96497,
                  "end": 818.865,
                  "num_words": 11.0,
                  "speaker": 0
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "So kann man dann durch 2 einfache Einstellungen 'n Hype vom Trend unterscheiden.",
                      "start": 818.925,
                      "end": 822.705
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also der Hype, weil das noch mal ausgestrahlt worden ist, aber im Prinzip ist nicht viel passiert, also kein Trend.",
                      "start": 823.245,
                      "end": 829.505
                    }
                  ],
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                  "end": 829.505,
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                  "speaker": 2
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Mhm.",
                      "start": 830.01,
                      "end": 830.33
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Weil ich",
                      "start": 830.33,
                      "end": 830.49
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 830.01,
                  "end": 830.49,
                  "num_words": 3.0,
                  "speaker": 0
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                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "den Tatort auch nicht gesehen hab, vielleicht ist er voll trendig, das weiß ich jetzt nicht.",
                      "start": 830.49,
                      "end": 833.95
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 830.49,
                  "end": 833.95,
                  "num_words": 16.0,
                  "speaker": 2
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Bleiben wir noch mal so bei den Filterungen und bei den ganzen Unterscheidungen, die man so treffen kann.",
                      "start": 835.69,
                      "end": 840.43
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Ihr unterscheidet auf dem Dashboard auch zwischen",
                      "start": 841.37,
                      "end": 842.75
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 835.69,
                  "end": 842.75,
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                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Trend versucht man normalerweise irgendwas abzugreifen, was erst im Kommen ist.",
                      "start": 849.655,
                      "end": 854.135
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das heißt, meistens geht es dabei einen Anstieg, eine Steigerung.",
                      "start": 854.135,
                      "end": 858.14996
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das kann ein Anstieg der Aufrufanzahl sein, das kann ein Anstieg der Bearbeitungen sein, so was in der Art.",
                      "start": 858.29,
                      "end": 864.06995
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Etwas, was vielleicht jetzt noch nicht superpopulär ist, aber es in 2, 3 Jahren vielleicht sein könnte.",
                      "start": 864.44995,
                      "end": 871.23505
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Da geht das halt darum, irgendwie vor die Welle zu kommen oder zumindest im Gleichschritt mit der Welle zu sein, halt frühzeitig über neue Entwicklungen informiert zu sein und dementsprechend handeln zu können.",
                      "start": 873.29504,
                      "end": 884.43
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 849.655,
                  "end": 884.43,
                  "num_words": 90.0,
                  "speaker": 1
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Das heißt, populär ist die Gegenwart und Populär.",
                      "start": 884.43,
                      "end": 886.58997
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Der Trend ist so der der Versuch 1 Blicks in die Zukunft.",
                      "start": 886.75,
                      "end": 889.49
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 884.43,
                  "end": 889.49,
                  "num_words": 20.0,
                  "speaker": 0
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Ganz genau, ja.",
                      "start": 889.71,
                      "end": 890.67
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 889.71,
                  "end": 890.67,
                  "num_words": 3.0,
                  "speaker": 1
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Mhm.",
                      "start": 890.67,
                      "end": 891.17
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Dennis, Du schreibst ja in 'nem Artikel über das Projekt, dass es noch mehr ist als nur ein Dashboard.",
                      "start": 891.95,
                      "end": 898.345
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Was meinst Du damit?",
                      "start": 898.345,
                      "end": 899.145
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Was steckt da noch dahinter?",
                      "start": 899.145,
                      "end": 900.265
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also welche Vision hast Du noch dafür?",
                      "start": 900.265,
                      "end": 902.285
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 890.67,
                  "end": 902.285,
                  "num_words": 36.0,
                  "speaker": 0
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Zum einen ist dieses Dashboard halt nicht statisch oder in der Zeit eingefroren.",
                      "start": 902.90497,
                      "end": 906.685
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das heißt, das ist etwas, was wir sowohl mit neuen Daten befüllen werden, als auch wo wir noch darüber nachdenken, zusätzliche Funktionalität hinzu zu bauen und auch durch Dritte dadurch, dass der Source Code auch verfügbar ist, ja, auch Funktionalität dazu gebaut werden kann.",
                      "start": 907.385,
                      "end": 924.56
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und zum anderen ist es halt dieses dreiteilige Programmpaket, was eben nicht nur dieses Dashboard betrifft, sondern wo halt auch die Datensammlung und Datenanalyse vorliegt.",
                      "start": 924.56,
                      "end": 935.385
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 902.90497,
                  "end": 935.385,
                  "num_words": 82.0,
                  "speaker": 1
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Und Analyse ist 'n super Stichwort.",
                      "start": 936.005,
                      "end": 937.705
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Mike, was macht ihr denn eigentlich mit den Daten?",
                      "start": 937.925,
                      "end": 939.925
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Was macht ihr mit den Ergebnissen?",
                      "start": 939.925,
                      "end": 941.145
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 936.005,
                  "end": 941.145,
                  "num_words": 21.0,
                  "speaker": 0
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Wenn ich",
                      "start": 942.08,
                      "end": 942.24
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 942.08,
                  "end": 942.24,
                  "num_words": 2.0,
                  "speaker": 1
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "nur einen Satz dazu sagen Na klar, gerne.",
                      "start": 942.24,
                      "end": 943.76
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Auch die Metriken, die dahinter liegen, sind natürlich Das ist alles plausibel, alles nachvollziehbar, aber gerade in der Anwendung wird man dann ja noch zusätzlich lernen, welche Metriken vielleicht noch besser passen als die, die jetzt schon verbaut sind, die da drin sind.",
                      "start": 943.92,
                      "end": 956.5
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und was man damit machen kann, ist ja Erst mal hat man, wenn man das aufruft, hat man ja schon einen Eindruck von dem, was gerade im Moment populär ist, was gerade trendet.",
                      "start": 956.97504,
                      "end": 967.29504
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das ist natürlich schon der erste große Mehrwert, aber das Schöne ist, wenn man dann auch ganz bewusst in einzelne Technologien oder einzelne Trends, einzelne Themenbereiche rein zoomt, dann eröffnet sich ja noch mal ein Riesenfeld von Indikatoren und dann Dingen, die man beobachten kann.",
                      "start": 967.29504,
                      "end": 983.05005
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also auch Sachen, die jetzt vielleicht nicht so der ganz heiße Scheiß sind, der im Moment diskutiert wird, kann man dann halt weiter nachverfolgen, ob es zum Beispiel da noch eine Community gibt, die sich damit beschäftigt.",
                      "start": 983.33496,
                      "end": 994.21497
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 942.24,
                  "end": 994.21497,
                  "num_words": 166.0,
                  "speaker": 2
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Also vielleicht war das ja mal 'n großer Hype und jetzt wird es Gedeiht es in 'ner Nische weiter oder aber war's 'n großer Hype und ist dann abgeflacht?",
                      "start": 994.21497,
                      "end": 1001.86
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Wie ist das mit der Entwicklung der Bearbeitenden und Beobachtenden?",
                      "start": 1002.39996,
                      "end": 1006.02
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also wird diese Community da vielleicht dann doch wieder größer?",
                      "start": 1006.95996,
                      "end": 1009.76
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Entsteht da vielleicht wieder was Neues oder bleibt das so in etwa?",
                      "start": 1009.76,
                      "end": 1013.135
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Oder aber stirbt es ab?",
                      "start": 1013.99506,
                      "end": 1015.275
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 994.21497,
                  "end": 1015.275,
                  "num_words": 66.0,
                  "speaker": 2
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Halt solche Sachen kann man damit halt eben auch beobachten.",
                      "start": 1015.275,
                      "end": 1017.455
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1015.275,
                  "end": 1017.455,
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                  "speaker": 2
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Mhm.",
                      "start": 1017.835,
                      "end": 1018.335
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Schon ganz gutes Beispiel.",
                      "start": 1019.59503,
                      "end": 1020.55505
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Vielleicht machen wir das noch 'n bisschen greifbarer und steigen mal ein in die Frage, wie sich diese Daten, diese Ergebnisse auch nutzen lassen für die öffentliche Verwaltung.",
                      "start": 1020.55505,
                      "end": 1029.54
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Konntet ihr schon Trends für die digitale Verwaltung ableiten aus euren Ergebnissen, aus euren Analysen?",
                      "start": 1030.32,
                      "end": 1036.74
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1017.835,
                  "end": 1036.74,
                  "num_words": 48.0,
                  "speaker": 0
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Vielleicht läuft es dafür noch nicht lang genug.",
                      "start": 1039.9349,
                      "end": 1042.195
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Wir haben das jetzt erst, ich glaub, Ende April online gestellt.",
                      "start": 1042.415,
                      "end": 1046.595
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Was ich persönlich halt sagen kann, was mir aufgefallen ist, dass son paar Dinge ja in den Top Ten dieser Listen dann aufgetaucht sind, die mir noch nichts gesagt haben, zum Beispiel diverse Cybersecurity Bedrohungen, die natürlich auch für die öffentliche Verwaltung relevant sind, weil auch die öffentliche Verwaltung natürlich bedroht ist.",
                      "start": 1046.975,
                      "end": 1066.96
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Ansonsten viel aus dem Bereich KI neue Entwicklungen in diesem Bereich, was natürlich auch wieder relevant ist für die öffentliche Verwaltung, wenn sie KI einsetzen möchte.",
                      "start": 1067.985,
                      "end": 1077.125
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und wie ich schon erwähnt hatte, ist das ganze ja transferierbar.",
                      "start": 1078.225,
                      "end": 1081.525
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1039.9349,
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                  "num_words": 108.0,
                  "speaker": 1
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Das heißt, die öffentliche Verwaltung, falls sie ein spezielles Interessensgebiet hat, kann sie theoretisch dieses Tool auch darauf zuschneiden.",
                      "start": 1081.905,
                      "end": 1090.78
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1081.905,
                  "end": 1090.78,
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                  "speaker": 1
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Mhm.",
                      "start": 1091.48,
                      "end": 1091.98
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1091.48,
                  "end": 1091.98,
                  "num_words": 1.0,
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                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Meine Frage war halt dann auch, na ja, wozu muss die digitale Verwaltung überhaupt Trends erkennen?",
                      "start": 1093.0,
                      "end": 1099.905
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Vielleicht 'n bisschen ketzerisch, aber so, wie Du's jetzt grad beschrieben hast, macht's ja erst mal Sinn, ne?",
                      "start": 1099.905,
                      "end": 1104.145
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also Cybersecurity, Sicherheit, aber auch KI Tools, die ja in der Verwaltung wahrscheinlich auch sehr, sehr helfen können in den nächsten Jahren.",
                      "start": 1104.145,
                      "end": 1111.9249
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also klingt erst mal logisch, oder?",
                      "start": 1112.37,
                      "end": 1113.97
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1093.0,
                  "end": 1113.97,
                  "num_words": 62.0,
                  "speaker": 0
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Absolut.",
                      "start": 1113.97,
                      "end": 1114.47
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und eine der schönen Seiten von Wikipedia ist ja, dass nicht nur dann die Konzepte und die schwierig auszusprechenden neuesten Entwicklungen da berücksichtigt werden, sondern bis hin zu Produkten, die angeboten werden, die halt eben auch entsprechende entsprechende Einträge haben und wo man dann gucken kann, welches Sprachmodell gerade besonders hip ist oder so was in der Richtung.",
                      "start": 1114.85,
                      "end": 1133.915
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Aber wir betreiben ja auch schon 'n ganzes Weilchentrennforschung und aus guten Gründen.",
                      "start": 1133.915,
                      "end": 1138.015
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Dieses, was Dennis ja auch schon gesagt hat, vor die Welle zu kommen und so zu wissen, erst mal, was überhaupt gerade im Moment diskutiert wird und und was gerade passiert, kann enorm wichtig sein.",
                      "start": 1138.315,
                      "end": 1149.49
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also wir hatten das rückblickend ein ein ganz spezieller Fall, VMware ist eine Software, die sehr verbreitet ist in der öffentlichen Verwaltung oder war, wahrscheinlich immer noch ist und wo dann der Eigentümer gewechselt hat und dementsprechend die Preismodelle gewechselt haben und all so etwas.",
                      "start": 1149.49,
                      "end": 1167.045
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1113.97,
                  "end": 1167.045,
                  "num_words": 152.0,
                  "speaker": 2
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Und das ist etwas, was man jetzt historisch betrachtet in den Wikipedia Daten hervorragend sieht.",
                      "start": 1167.185,
                      "end": 1172.49
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Genau da, wo es dir 'n Wechsel gegeben hat, gibt es einen Riesenausschlag.",
                      "start": 1172.57,
                      "end": 1175.71
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Das heißt, wenn wir das Tool damals schon gehabt hätten, wäre es sofort angesprungen.",
                      "start": 1175.85,
                      "end": 1179.23
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und das Systemfeld, VMware, was machen wir damit in der öffentlichen Verwaltung?",
                      "start": 1180.49,
                      "end": 1184.57
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Wie ersetzen wir's möglicherweise oder wie gehen wir sonst damit Das ist ein riesiges operativ wichtiges Themenfeld, das gerade munter diskutiert wird in dem Bereich.",
                      "start": 1184.57,
                      "end": 1195.505
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1167.185,
                  "end": 1195.505,
                  "num_words": 79.0,
                  "speaker": 2
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Warum machen wir das?",
                      "start": 1196.685,
                      "end": 1197.5651
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Dieses vor die Welle kommen, es ist ja immer Also es Die die öffentliche Hand hat ja ganz, ganz viele Bedarfe in dem Bereich.",
                      "start": 1197.5651,
                      "end": 1205.72
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also sowohl, was sie selbst einsetzt, was sie aktuell einsetzt, das lässt sich wunderbar beobachten durch das Tool, was sie möglicherweise zukünftig einsetzt.",
                      "start": 1205.72,
                      "end": 1213.74
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Da sind dann auch solche Trendbeobachtungen ganz besonders wichtig.",
                      "start": 1214.2799,
                      "end": 1218.14
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Aber natürlich auch, wo sind möglicherweise Regulierungsherausforderungen?",
                      "start": 1218.3251,
                      "end": 1220.665
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1196.685,
                  "end": 1220.665,
                  "num_words": 67.0,
                  "speaker": 2
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Auch dafür eben, weil Wikipedia so breit ist und so in unterschiedlichen Sektoren, würd ich mal sagen, unterwegs ist, auch dafür eignet es sich hervorragend.",
                      "start": 1221.765,
                      "end": 1229.865
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und dann hatten wir ja immer das Problem, dass Daten immer nur die Vergangenheit abbilden können.",
                      "start": 1230.005,
                      "end": 1234.61
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Es ist halt so.",
                      "start": 1234.61,
                      "end": 1235.75
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Und deswegen dieser dieser Versuch, in die Zukunft zu gucken, dementsprechend herausfordernd ist, aber grade da ja auch wieder Wikipedia so viele Daten liefert, da ist dann wieder die die Verfügbarkeit der Daten ganz entscheidend, dass man damit entsprechend variieren kann und dann hoffentlich der Zukunft ein bisschen näher kommt als mit anderen Datenquellen.",
                      "start": 1235.97,
                      "end": 1254.385
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1221.765,
                  "end": 1254.385,
                  "num_words": 99.0,
                  "speaker": 2
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Welche Behörden brauchen dieses Wissen, dieses Trendwissen dann besonders?",
                      "start": 1255.5651,
                      "end": 1259.165
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also an an wen denkt ihr da?",
                      "start": 1259.165,
                      "end": 1260.865
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1255.5651,
                  "end": 1260.865,
                  "num_words": 16.0,
                  "speaker": 0
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Das ist ja jetzt ganz einfach, das Digitalministerium.",
                      "start": 1261.39,
                      "end": 1263.57
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1261.39,
                  "end": 1263.57,
                  "num_words": 8.0,
                  "speaker": 2
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Ja gut.",
                      "start": 1264.51,
                      "end": 1265.17
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1264.51,
                  "end": 1265.17,
                  "num_words": 2.0,
                  "speaker": 0
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Nein, aber bei unserem Themenfeld im Bereich der Digitalisierung sind es in der Tat all die Ministerien und Einrichtungen, die sich mit Digitalisierungsfragen beschäftigen.",
                      "start": 1266.4299,
                      "end": 1274.69
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Sicherheitsrisiken hatten wir eben schon.",
                      "start": 1275.095,
                      "end": 1277.115
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Auch das BSI betreibt ja auch eigene Trendforschung.",
                      "start": 1277.255,
                      "end": 1279.515
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Da ist es 'n ganz, ganz wichtiger Bereich.",
                      "start": 1279.735,
                      "end": 1281.755
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Für den Einsatz ist es 'n ganz wichtiger Bereich.",
                      "start": 1282.215,
                      "end": 1284.535
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1266.4299,
                  "end": 1284.535,
                  "num_words": 54.0,
                  "speaker": 2
                },
                {
                  "sentences": [
                    {
                      "text": "Ein Aspekt, zu dem wir ja auch selbst grade arbeiten im Bereich digitale Souveränität ist es 'n ganz wichtiger Punkt.",
                      "start": 1284.535,
                      "end": 1291.42
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Auf welche Technologien soll ich für die Zukunft setzen, die digitale Souveränität zu erhalten oder zu steigern?",
                      "start": 1291.42,
                      "end": 1297.92
                    },
                    {
                      "text": "Also ich will alle.",
                      "start": 1298.3,
                      "end": 1299.76
                    }
                  ],
                  "start": 1284.535,
                  "end": 1299.76,
                  "num_words": 41.0,
                  "speaker": 2
                },
                {
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                      "text": "wir?",
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                      "text": "Diverse, Diverse.",
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                      "text": "Wir hatten vielleicht auch noch als Hintergrund im im letzten Jahr bei unserer großen Onlinekonferenz bei der Piazza hatten wir einen Trend Workshop, also einen Workshop, der explizit mit der Trendforschung beschäftigt hat und wir werden auch dieses Jahr in diversen Formaten das Thema noch mal adressieren und mit der Idee, die Trendforschung, die es schon gibt, zusammenzubringen.",
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                      "text": "Herzlichen Dank an meine beiden Co Hosts, Jan Dennis Gumtz und Doktor Mike Weber.",
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                      "text": "Den Link haben wir euch mal in die Shownotes gepackt.",
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