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Neben der Infrastruktur und dem digitalen Leben geht es dabei auch die digitale Verwaltung. Und das darf ich schon mal spoilern, in einigen Bereichen, da hat sich wirklich was getan. Was genau, das finden wir heute in dieser Podcastfolge heraus. Herzlich willkommen beim öFIT Podcast restart digital, eine Produktion des Fraunhofer Instituts für offene Kommunikationssysteme. Ich bin Philipp 1 und ich begrüße hier im Studio in Berlin Tegel meine beiden Co Hosts. Zum einen Nicole Opiala, sie ist stellvertretende Leiterin des Kompetenzzentrums öffentlicher IT und forscht zu soziotechnischen Trends an der Schnittstelle zwischen Gesellschaft, Verwaltung und Politik. Nicole ist heute nicht im Studio, sondern sie ist uns online zugeschaltet aus Oldenburg. Hallo Nicole. Hallo Philipp. Hier aber wirklich vor Ort ist Jan Dennis Gumpz. Er ist Data Scientist am Kompetenzzentrum öffentlicher IT und seine Arbeitsschwerpunkte liegen im Bereich der Trendforschung und in der Auswertung und Aufbereitung von Daten. Dennis, da bist Du natürlich genau richtig beim Deutschlandindex. Danke, ja, guten Tag. Zunächst mal hatten wir uns ja vor 2 Jahren schon über den Deutschlandindex, den damaligen Deutschlandindex der Digitalisierung unterhalten. So ganz grob, was hat sich seitdem getan, was euch beide wirklich überrascht hat? Da gibt's ganz viele Aspekte. Der Deutschlandindex ist ja wirklich umfangreich. Wir gucken uns da fast 50 verschiedene Kennzahlen an in verschiedenen Bereichen der Digitalisierung und überraschende Entwicklungen gibt's eigentlich an vielen Stellen. Beispielsweise fand ich auch sehr überraschend, dass der Glasfaserausbau tatsächlich sehr rasant vorangeschritten ist. Das Ziel, 50 Prozent der Haushalte bis Ende diesen Jahres anzuschließen, rückt tatsächlich in greifbare Nähe, also ist 'n sehr schöner Erfolg. Also schnelles Internet für alle, das ist tatsächlich ja 'n Stück weit weitergegangen. Genau. Und auf der anderen Seite haben wir auch Entwicklungen, wo es vielleicht 'n bisschen nach unten geht, beispielsweise was die Kompetenzen angeht, was ich auch überraschend fand, denn die Nutzung von digitalen Möglichkeiten auch im Alltag, die steigt eigentlich grundsätzlich. Das ist ja immer son bisschen, wir gucken ja auch auf die verschiedenen Ländern, natürlich ist das auch nicht in allen Ländern gleich, aber im Bereich der digitalen Basiskompetenzen, also beispielsweise Personen, die von sich selbst sagen, dass es ihnen leicht fällt, ein Programm zu installieren, sich anonym im Netz zu bewegen oder auch eine Sicherheitskopie von Daten anzufertigen. Da sehen wir beispielsweise Rückgänge und das finde ich schon 'n ganz interessanten Kontrast, dass die Nutzung auf der einen Seite steigt, aber die Kompetenzen oder auf jeden Fall dieses Selbstbewusstsein, dass man diese Kompetenzen hat, abnimmt. Mhm, okay. Ja, da werden wir uns vielleicht noch mal drüber unterhalten, das noch mal vertiefen, Dennis gibt's irgendwas, was dich wirklich überrascht hat an dem neuen Zahlen, an dem Deutschlandindex? Eine Sache, die mich überrascht hat, war, wir haben über die vergangenen Jahre immer so beobachtet, dass die Unterschiede zwischen den Bundesländern tendenziell immer 'n bisschen kleiner werden und zumindest im Bereich digitales Leben gibt es jetzt einzelne Indikatoren und dadurch auch 'n Gesamtindex, so eine Entwicklung, wo die sich eher 'n bisschen auseinanderentwickeln. Das heißt, sie sind weiter verteilt über einen Wertebereich. Das heißt, die Unterschiede werden sind in den letzten 2 Jahren scheinbar etwas größer geworden zwischen den Bundesländern. Mhm. Und da kann man gar nicht unbedingt sagen zwischen Stadt und Land, sondern ganz allgemein, da gibt's 'n paar Bundesländer, die sind haben sich ganz gut entwickelt und andere sind eher abgehängt. Also auch da werden wir gleich noch mal genauer drüber sprechen. Der Deutschlandindex, der setzt ja jedes Mal verschiedene Schwerpunkte und auch Themenfelder. Diesmal sind Themenfelder Infrastruktur, digitales Leben und digitale Verwaltung, aber auch KI spielt eine Rolle. Damit habt ihr euch ja auch befasst, oder? Ja, genau. Wir haben der der Entwicklung im Bereich KI, insbesondere generative KI Rechnung getragen, indem wir in unsere große Bevölkerungsbefragung diesmal 'n paar Fragen zur KI reingenommen haben, insbesondere halt wie häufig wird so was bereits genutzt und wofür? Also werfen wir zunächst mal 'n genaueren Blick auf das Thema Infrastruktur. Nicole, Du hast ja schon gesagt, der Indexwert, den berechnet ihr ja für Infrastruktur 20 25, der ist in allen Bundesländern gestiegen, insbesondere liegt das auch am Glasfaserausbau. Da soll bis Ende 20 25 mindestens 50 Prozent aller Haushalte versorgt werden mit Glasfaser. Klappt das? Ist das überhaupt möglich? Es rückt tatsächlich in greifbare Nähe. Wir haben die Daten von Mitte 20 24, da lagen wir bundesweit bei 37.5 Prozent, Ende 20 24 jetzt bei knapp 40 Prozent. Also ob jetzt die letzten 10 Prozentpunkte noch gewuppt werden können das Ende diesen Jahres, das ist jetzt son bisschen Rätselraten, aber auf jeden Fall sind wir knapp davor, tatsächlich dieses Ziel zu erreichen. Und das ist ja schon sehr beeindruckend, wenn man sich auch beispielsweise die Entwicklung anguckt in anderen Bereichen der Infrastruktur. Auch da gibt's politische Zielsetzungen, beispielsweise Breitband mit 50 Mbit pro Sekunde, da sollte ein Vollausbau, also 100 Prozent aller Haushalte können diese Bandbreiten erhalten, schon 20 18 erreicht sein. Da sind wir immer noch nicht, auch 7 Jahre später noch nicht, aber in fast allen Ländern haben wir inzwischen 95 Prozent aller Haushalte mit 50 Mbit pro Sekunde versorgt und das zeigt auch son bisschen, wenn man von Vollausbau spricht, dann ist eine 100 Prozent eher nicht erreichbar. Also Vollausbau bedeutet schon eher über 95 Prozent, aber nicht unbedingt 100 Prozent, denn es gibt immer sehr abgelegene Liegenschaften. Also wir sprechen wirklich nicht von Orten oder Ortsteilen, sondern wirklich einzelnen Liegenschaften, die dann sehr schwierig und unter sehr hohem Aufwand nur anzuschließen sind und bei denen dann tatsächlich es vielleicht sinnvoller ist zu überlegen, mit welchen alternativen Technologien Richtfunk, Satellit, Mobilfunk und so weiter, die angeschlossen werden können. Und das ist vielleicht auch ganz wichtig im Hinterkopf zu behalten, wenn man jetzt auf den Vollausbau Glasfaser schielt, der dann 20 30 erreicht werden soll. Mhm. Jetzt kann man ja auch noch mal schauen, wo genau klappt's denn mit dem Ausbau gut? Also ich wohn jetzt selbst in Berlin, da wurde auch vorm meiner Haustür kräftig gebuddelt und irgendwelche Glasfaserleitungen wurden da verlegt, denkt man natürlich, na gut, also grad in großen Städten, da ist man da vielleicht 'n bisschen schneller. Ist das denn so? Gibt's tatsächlich da 'n Vorteil in den Städten gegenüber den ländlichen Kommunen? Ja, interessanterweise nicht. Und was wir, ich muss sagen, in den Anfangszeiten des Deutschlandindex ja oft beobachtet haben, das war son West Ost Gefälle zwischen den Ländern und eben auch eine Stadt Land Gefälle. Also in den Anfangstagen, da waren eigentlich die Stadtstaaten immer unaufholbar an der Spitze in fast allen Bereichen und dieses Bild hat sich zunehmend aufgelöst, grade auch bei der Infrastruktur sieht man das. Also Ost West ist da ein wesentliches Unterscheidungsmerkmal mehr, beispielsweise beim Glasfaser und Stadt Land tatsächlich auch nicht. Also wir haben große Städte, die sehr gut versorgt sind, aber genauso gut auch große Städte, die deutlich unter dem bundesweiten Schnitt liegen. Mhm. Was ich auch noch ganz interessant fand, ist, dass viele private Nutzer*innen ganz offensichtlich an diesem Glasfaserausbau überhaupt kein Interesse haben. Die sind mit ihrem DSL- und Kabelanschluss eigentlich ganz zufrieden. Wird da vielleicht an den Bedürfnissen von Menschen vorbeigebaut? Das ist tatsächlich noch ein Problem, dass die Nachfrage theoretischen Versorgbarkeit noch hinterherhinkt. Also wir haben da noch eine große Spanne zwischen den Homes past, also da läuft irgendwo eine Leitung vorbei und Homes connectet, die also tatsächlich auch den Anschluss haben und genau, die Nutzung ist dann auch noch mal eine andere Frage. Das liegt einfach daran, dass für die derzeit gängigen Anwendungen in vielen Fällen eben Kabel oder DSL noch ausreichend sind. Aber wenn wir uns die Entwicklung anschauen, dann kommen da schon zunehmend auch im Nutzungsverhalten natürlich Anwendungen und Technologien, die auch höhere Ansprüche an die Infrastruktur stellen. Also das ist sozusagen im Moment vielleicht noch 'n bisschen Investition in die Zukunft, aber wenn man sich die Entwicklung anschaut, durchaus notwendig und auch auf politischer Ebene gibt's ja beispielsweise die EU hat auch vor, die Kupfernetze komplett abzuschalten im Jahr 20 30. Also der Trend geht schon ganz klar hin zu Glasfaser. Und den sollte man auch nicht verschlafen, auch wenn man im Moment vielleicht sagt, na ja gut, mit dem, was ich so tagtäglich mache, brauche ich das vielleicht noch nicht unbedingt. Noch nicht. Ja, das ist ja genau der der Punkt, ne. Also die Politik macht ja auch Druck von anderer Seite. Man möchte Kupfernetze abschalten, Dennis ist das eine gute Idee? Ich weiß nicht, ob es eine gute Idee ist, Kupfernetze abzuschalten, aber ich wollte eher bei der Glasfaser noch mal einhaken. Es gibt, glaube ich, sogar fast global den Trend, zum Beispiel zum Videostreaming statt zum Fernsehen und gerade da beobachten wir ja, dass es immer höhere Auflösungen angeboten werden und sicherlich irgendwann dann auch nachgefragt werden. Also ich glaub schon, dass dass das, auch wenn die Nachfrage jetzt noch nicht da ist, das doch sinnvoll ist, Glasfaser auszubauen, weil ja, ich glaub, das wird dann eingeholt dadurch. Na ja, in der Tat. Also ich nutz ja auch ganz gerne und ich dreh immer im Kreis, wenn's dann anfängt zu ruckeln und man kann praktisch nix machen. Wahrscheinlich ist dann irgendwann die Geschwindigkeit einfach zu langsam, wenn alle drauf zugreifen oder? Das würde ich vermuten, ja. Nicole, schauen wir noch mal aufs Mobilfunknetz. Die vier-g-Versorgung, die ist ja nahezu flächendeckend. Die Abdeckung mit 5 g, die hat sich stark verbessert als Vierfach am ICE. Da bekomme ich davon leider nicht so viel mit. Da ruckelt's auf ganzer Strecke, könnte man sagen, wo muss ich dann noch was tun? Ja, ich find's auch immer erstaunlich, dass wir, wenn man sich die Versorgung eigentlich anguckt mit 5 G, da auch bei eigentlich in allen Ländern mindestens 90 Prozent Flächenabdeckung tatsächlich der kompletten Fläche. Da zählt alles dazu, auch jedes Naturschutzgebiet, auch jede Bahnstrecke liegen und man es dann trotzdem immer mal wieder doch schafft, in so ein Funkloch hineinzugeraten. Kommen wir mal zum nächsten Themenfeld, nämlich digitales Leben. Da erschafft ihr auch einen Index erstellt, auch wieder für dieses Jahr und diesen Index, der basiert auf 1 repräsentativen Bevölkerungsbefragung mit über 5800 Teilnehmenden. Die wird auch regelmäßig durchgeführt, zuletzt Ende 20 24, also mal zu erklären, wo die Daten eigentlich überhaupt herkommen. Und da gibt's zunächst mal 'n positives Ergebnis, nämlich die Nutzung von Telemedizin. Die hat sich stark erhöht von 5.1 Prozent in 20 20 auf 13.5 Prozent in 20 24. Wo läuft's da besonders gut mit der Telemedizin, Dennis? Ich glaube, hier gibt es einfach tatsächlich eine große Nachfrage, weil man kann das auch beobachten, dass es vor allem jüngere Menschen sind, die das stärker nachfragen oder stärker nutzen und ich vermute einfach, das hängt ganz stark damit zusammen, dass die sowieso digital affiner sind und dann halt nicht zum Beispiel beim Arzt sitzen wollen im im Sprechzimmer oder im Warteraum, sondern zeitsparend das tatsächlich erledigen wollen. Ich vermute auch, dass gerade während der Coronapandemie, ich weiß es jetzt schon 'n bisschen her, aber da dann halt auch wahrscheinlich viele Ärzte und Ärztinnen, ja, überhaupt das Angebot erst geschaffen haben mit Videosprechstunden und Ähnlichem. Genau, aber das scheint angenommen zu werden. Ja, ich find mich da ganz gut wieder. Also ich nutz auch Telemedizin gelegentlich, gerade wenn's da ich sag mal, Lapalien geht, Verwaltung, was auch immer. Man braucht irgend 'n Schein oder so. Mhm. Ich muss da nicht extra hin. Das ist ja wirklich schon sehr praktisch. Allerdings will man ja mit Telemedizin auch gerade eine ältere Zielgruppe erreichen im ländlichen Raum, ja? Da die Versorgung sicherzustellen, aber gerade der ländliche Raum, der wirkt dann noch ein bisschen abgehängt, hab ich bei euch gelesen. Wie kann man da vielleicht Angebote noch attraktiver machen? Ich würde es nicht sagen, tatsächlich abgehängt, sondern eher auf dem auf dem gleichen Niveau. Wie kann man das attraktiver machen? Ich bin mir da gar nicht so sicher, ob man das machen kann, weil das Angebot ist letzten Endes, glaube ich, da. Ich weiß jetzt nicht, ob es so ist, dass gerade Ärzte im ländlichen Raum, die normalerweise auch der Hausarzt wären, ob die das vielleicht seltener anbieten. Das könnte eine Ursache sein, aber ich hab mich jetzt nicht genau mit den Ursachen davon beschäftigt tatsächlich. Schauen wir uns mal 'n anderen Punkt an, nämlich der Anteil der online engagierten Internetnutzenden. Der ist nach einem Rückgang kurzzeitigen 20 23 auf einen neuen Höchststand gestiegen. 13 Prozent, die sich regelmäßig online engagieren, wie es so heißt, also es betrifft Wikipedia Artikel, Open Source Software, die programmiert wird, offene Lernmaterialien. Was ist da geschehen? Ja, erst mal finde ich das eine eine sehr positive Entwicklung. Auch hier ist es relativ schwierig zu sagen, worauf das jetzt genau zurückzuführen ist. Ich hab verschiedene Rechnungen angestellt, eine Ursache zu finden. Das konnte ich leider nicht identifizieren. Also als wir diesen Rückgang beobachtet haben, dann war unsere erste Interpretation natürlich, okay, während der Coronapandemie, man war auf jeden Fall eingeschränkter in den Möglichkeiten, sich im Analogen zu engagieren. Deswegen hat sich da vielleicht das Engagement ins digitale Ädern eher verlagert und Post Corona dann ein Rückgang, weil dann jetzt die Personen dann doch sich lieber wieder direkt vor Ort engagieren. Und dadurch, dass die Zahlen jetzt aber gestiegen sind und tatsächlich auf einen auf einen Höchststand, also auch höher als während Corona sozusagen, sehen wir, dass diese Interpretation tatsächlich dann eher nicht getragen hat, sondern dass das auch ein Nebeneinander ist und dass auch jetzt nach Corona, wo es wieder möglich ist, sich vor Ort zu engagieren, digitales Engagement trotzdem weiter einen wichtigen Platz in der Gesellschaft und im Bereich gesellschaftliches Engagement einnimmt. Das heißt, durch Corona ist es einfach gewachsen son Stück weit und hört jetzt ein dazu ganz normal, wie auch 'n Engagement die Ecke. Das finden Genau. Leider eine, ja, ich find's leider 'n bisschen eine schwierige Aussage, weil wir tatsächlich keine Zahlen vor Corona haben. Die erste Bevölkerungsbefragung, die haben wir 2020 gemacht. Dementsprechend haben wir den Vergleich zu zuvor einfach nicht. Ich könnte mir auch vorstellen, dass diese Informationsbereitstellung einfach im Internet einfach eine größere Rolle spielt und deshalb vielleicht es mehr Engagement gibt. Warum es dann den den kleinen Rückgang 2022 gab. Jetzt den Höchststand lässt sich damit allerdings immer noch nicht so gut erklären. Mhm. Aber es ist tatsächlich ja was, was wir in allen Bereichen, korrigier mich, Dennis, in allen Bereichen des Engagements eigentlich tatsächlich beobachtet haben, dass es in allen Bereichen, die wir uns angeschaut haben, einen Anstieg gegeben hat. Und das betrifft, wenn man so möchte, auch Partizipation in der eigenen Gemeinde. Also Personen, die sich beispielsweise an Planungsverfahren in ihrer Gemeinde online beteiligen oder auch über Onlinemängelnmelder Vorschläge machen oder Müll oder Sonstiges im öffentlichen Raum melden und damit dazu beitragen, dass die Gemeinde Bescheid weiß, wo sie vielleicht aktiv werden müsste oder könnte. In der Beziehung zur zur eigenen Gemeindeverwaltung sehen wir auch, dass da auch das Engagement gestiegen ist. Da schauen wir auch gleich noch mal genauer hin, nämlich in die digitale Verwaltung. Das ist ja auch 'n Thema, das ihr genau untersucht habt. Vorher machen wir noch eine kleine Abwägung. K I, grad generative K I, das ist auch Gegenstand gewesen. Was habt ihr da rausgefunden? Zum einen, was was ich schon überraschend fand, war, dass die Nutzung von generativer K I innerhalb der Bevölkerung noch gar nicht so groß ist Und das, obwohl natürlich jedes Smartphone mittlerweile mit, hier ist generative KI drin beworben wird. Wofür KI genutzt wird, das ist vielleicht gar nicht so überraschend, wenn man die Beschwerden von Hochschulprofessorinnen und Professoren und Lehrerinnen und Lehrern hört, nämlich dass es vor allem im Bereich Ausbildung zum Einsatz kommt und gar nicht so sehr bei Unterhaltung und für oder für andere Zwecke. Mhm. Ja, kann man gut nachvollziehen, ne. Also grade für die Vorbereitung von wahrscheinlich Hausarbeiten Rechercheaufgaben, da wird KI sicher gerne genutzt. Nur tatsächlich interessant die Zahlen, wenn man schaut, wer insgesamt denn zu KI greift. Das sind weniger als die Hälfte der Internetnutzenden, die überhaupt KI verwenden und nur ein Viertel mindestens einmal im Monat. Verschlafen wir da grad in Deutschland einen Trend? Da wäre ich mir nicht sicher. Ich glaube, weil gerade wurden ja die diese primären Einsatzzwecke von KI beschrieben und ich glaube, die Leute verwenden es einfach dafür, wo es nützlich ist. Das heißt, ich glaube nicht, dass da ein Trend verschlafen wird. Ausbildung, dann vielleicht auch noch Beruf. Als jetzt ChatGPT das erste Mal veröffentlicht worden ist, dann war das hochinteressant, auch zu Unterhaltungszwecken sich damit auszutauschen, aber ich glaub, das nutzt sich einfach ab. Mhm. Ich zum Beispiel hab jetzt außerhalb des Berufs nicht ständig das Bedürfnis, generative KI zu nutzen. Wozu? Das heißt, ich glaube nicht, dass ein ein Trend hier verschlafen wird. Also einmal ist es ganz spannend, sich mit ChatGPT zu unterhalten, aber nachm fünfzehnten oder zwanzigsten Mal, dann lässt der Reiz auch nach. Das wäre meine Vermutung, ja. Ihr habt, fand ich interessant, auch gefragt, wie optimistisch die Befragten gegenüber Neuerungen durch KI sind. Was ist da das Ergebnis? Es wird vor allem ein positiver Einfluss grade auf Bildung und Forschung erwartet, was sich dann auch mit dem Ergebnis deckt, dass generative KI vor allem für Ausbildung und Beruf genutzt wird. Gleichzeitig sind die Erwartungen gerade so gesamtgesellschaftlich eher negativ, wenn es zum Beispiel den Zusammenhalten der Gesellschaft geht und auch Wohlstand und Wohlstandsverteilung. Wobei ganz interessant war, dass gerade unter denjenigen, die generative KI schon häufiger nutzen, diese Erwartungen generell positiver sind. Das heißt, vor allem diejenigen, die generative KI selten nutzen, erwarten auch tendenziell negativere Auswirkungen. Kommen wir doch mal zum letzten Themenfeld der digitalen Verwaltung. Da fand ich ganz spannend, dass ihr festgestellt habt, dass diese Effekte des Onlinezugangsgesetzes, wir hatten uns darüber auch schon mal hier in diesem Podcast unterhalten, dass die sichtbar werden. Also im Mai 20 25, das war son Bezugszeitraum, den ihr euch mal angeschaut habt, da standen im Schnitt für 227 Verwaltungsleistungen Onlinedienste flächendeckend zur Verfügung und das sind 68 mehr als 2 Jahre zuvor. Liegt das nur an dem Gesetz oder woran vielleicht noch, Nicole? Na, ich wollte noch ergänzen, dass die Erwartung der Auswirkungen von KI übrigens auch bei der öffentlichen Verwaltung positiver waren. Also da wird auf jeden Fall von den Bürgerinnen und Bürgern auch noch großes Potenzial gesehen, KI in der öffentlichen Verwaltung zu nutzen. Aber genau, was Du angesprochen hast, ja das Onlinezugangsgesetz hatte ja eigentlich oder die ursprüngliche Frist, sagen wir's so, war eigentlich bis Ende 20 22 alle 575 Leistungen digital anzubieten. Das heißt also, dass ich als Bürger, Bürgerin einen Onlinezugang dazu habe. Du hast grade schon gesagt, jetzt im Mai waren's 227 Leistungen im Schnitt in den Ländern. Da sind wir von 575 noch 'n ganzes Stück entfernt und 20 22 ist auch schon 'n bisschen länger her. Das heißt, der Anstieg, der klingt besser, als er letztendlich insgesamt ist, ne, wenn man sich total anschaut, was erreicht werden könnte, ja? Ja, das das UZG war einfach ein ein sehr ambitioniertes Vorhaben. Es war eigentlich auch schon relativ früh klar, dass das wahrscheinlich nicht erreicht werden kann, aber es hat auch durch die die erste Frist beispielsweise natürlich ganz klare Anreize gesetzt und die Verwaltung motiviert. Obwohl diese Frist jetzt verstrichen ist, ist das OZG ja immer noch in Kraft. Das heißt, dieses Ziel, auch wenn's jetzt keine so klare Frist mehr gibt, alle Leistungen digital anzubieten, das besteht auch weiterhin. Dazu kommen auch auf EU Ebene jetzt noch verschiedene andere Regelungen, die das auch erforderlich machen würden. Da müssen wir jetzt vielleicht gar nicht so gar nicht so tief drauf eingehen. Aber wie Du schon gesagt hast, der Anstieg auch innerhalb von 2 Jahren, der ist doch durchaus noch beachtlich, auch wenn das Ziel genau noch nicht erreicht ist. Und das da sieht man also, dass dieses OZG und diese Verpflichtung, die damit geschaffen wurde, auch nach Fristende immer noch diese Zugwirkung hat, weitere Leistungen digital anzubieten. Was wir allerdings dabei sehen, ist, dass die Unterschiede der Länder da relativ groß sind. Also wir haben das Dashboard digitale Verwaltung des inzwischen BMDS. Da kann man sich angucken, für wie viele dieser OZG Leistungen Onlinedienste in den Ländern schon flächendeckend zur Verfügung stehen. Und da haben wir noch relativ große Unterschiede. Also Hamburg ist hier Spitzenreiter oder war Spitzenreiter im Mai 20 25. Da ist relativ viel Dynamik drin, muss ich tatsächlich sagen. Also es lohnt sich schon fast monatlich, da mal in die Daten reinzugucken, weil sich da doch immer wieder auch was ändert. Ach so schnell. Ändert sich da tatsächlich auch das Angebot, ja? Ja, tatsächlich, genau. Ja. Und haben also zu dem Mai hatte Hamburg, ich glaube eineinhalb Mal so viele Leistungen im Angebot etwa wie wie das Schlusslicht und in der Dynamik sehen wir da auch sehr große Unterschiede. Also Hamburg, aber auch Sachsen Anhalt beispielsweise haben in den letzten 2 Jahren für über 90 OZG Leistungen Onlinedienste flächendeckend ausgerollt. In anderen Ländern waren's im gleichen Zeitraum nicht einmal halb so viele. Also da ist viel Bewegung drin und das ist Auf der einen Seite kann man sagen, ja gut, eigentlich war ja mal das Ziel auch mit dem UZG, wir haben eine Nachnutzung, ein Land entwickelt mal was und die anderen können es dann nachnutzen und dann müsste es ja relativ gleich sein zwischen den Ländern. Das mit der Nachnutzung stößt an viele Probleme, das ist auch schon relativ tiefgehend analysiert worden von verschiedenen Seiten. Aber durch diese hohe Dynamik ist das jetzt gar nicht so gesetzt. Da kann man jetzt nicht sagen, okay, jetzt haben wir aber die Spitzenreiter und die Schlusslichter und irgendwie, das ist auch so fest, ne, da da ändert sich wenig, sondern wir sehen auch in den letzten, wenn man das vergleicht mit 20 23 Länder, die eher in der Schlussgruppe waren, die sind inzwischen irgendwo im Mittelfeld gelandet und umgekehrt. Also da passiert im Moment tatsächlich noch richtig, richtig viel im Bereich OZG Leistung. Was ich mich halt frage, also ihr habt ja auch geschaut, wie wird das Angebot eigentlich angenommen, ne? Also der Anteil der Nutzenden an diesen Onlineverwaltungsleistung, der ist gar nicht mal unbedingt gestiegen. Der ist eher gleich geblieben, ne? Also ungefähr genauso viele Leute, die ihre Anträge oder Formulare online übermitteln. Ich frag mich halt warum, ne. Also ich find das ja 'n super Service, wenn ich nicht zum Amt muss, sondern das online machen kann. Ist das vielleicht das falsche Angebot oder gibt's da Barrieren, die den Zugang erschweren? Wir haben uns auch gedacht, wenn ich ein ein steigendes Angebot habe, dann müssten doch auch immer mehr Menschen das für sie passende Angebot auch online finden können und nutzen können. Also warum hat sich der Anteil der Nutzenden da nicht wesentlich erhöht? Genau und das kann natürlich ja an an ganz verschiedenen Gründen liegen, aber unsere Interpretation an der Stelle ist, dass es Personen gibt, die nutzen Onlineverwaltungsleistungen und wenn's wenn dann noch mehr Leistungen online verfügbar sind, dann freuen sie sich und dass sie die dann auch noch nutzen können und es gibt aber auch Gruppen, die nutzen es eben nicht. Dass es eine grade eine Herausforderung ist, hier neue nutzenden Gruppen auch zu gewinnen für hier neue nutzenden Gruppen auch zu gewinnen für Onlineverwaltungsleistung. Mhm. Auf der anderen Seite ist ja vielleicht auch eine Diskrepanz, es gibt immer mehr Nutzer*innen, die sich zum Beispiel mit ihrer EID, also mit ihrem Personalausweis online ausweisen oder auch Chatmöglichkeiten mit Verwaltungsmitarbeitenden nutzen. Also diese, ich sag mal, Basic Angebote, die werden ja doch stärker wahrgenommen. Ja, genau, das steigt, aber das sind ja eher so begleitende Services, sag ich mal und wenn man sich das anguckt, also von den Bürgerinnen und Bürgern, die tatsächlich auch ein Verwaltungsanliegen hatten Innerhalb des letzten Jahres haben im Schnitt 2 Drittel tatsächlich, also 66 Prozent, dann auch Formulare oder Anträge online an die Verwaltung übermittelt. Und die Zahlen für solche Basiskomponenten, wie Du sie grade genannt hast, die liegen ja noch weit darunter. Also ich müsste jetzt noch mal reingucken, aber ich glaube, EID, na, sind wir bei einem Viertel oder auch bei bei Chatmöglichkeiten mit Verwaltungsmitarbeitenden, da sehen wir ein Wachstum, eigentlich auch ein stetiges Wachstum, aber die Zahlen liegen noch deutlich darunter. Also das sind dann eher Dienste, die ich vielleicht mitnutze, wenn ich ohnehin ein Onlineverwaltungsanliegen grade grade grade abwickeln möchte, dass ich mich vorher per Chat oder auch wenns 'n Chatbot gibt mit dem Chatbot erkundige, was ich dafür brauche, an wen ich mich da wenden muss oder dass ich dann auch, wenn's die Möglichkeit gibt, online den Status einsehe oder mich eben mit meiner EID authentifizieren kann, diesen Onlinedienst überhaupt nutzen zu können. Also das sind eher so begleitende Komponenten und wie gesagt, da ist die Nutzung doch noch deutlich geringer. Also 'n Angebot für Leute, die schon gewonnen sind, die auch schon online unterwegs sind in der Verwaltung, die nehmen das dann noch sozusagen mit? Das wäre eine Interpretation, das haben wir uns tatsächlich in in in dem Detail gar nicht angeschaut bisher. Also die Daten, die sind so unglaublich umfangreich, dass man tatsächlich da leider gar nicht alles immer bis ins Letzte für alle Gruppen auch auswerten kann. Deswegen genau. Was ihr abgefragt habt, ist, wie zufrieden die Leute sind mit ihrer elektronischen Verwaltung sozusagen, wo aber auch Verbesserungspotenziale sind. Was hat diese Abfrage ergeben? Ja, auch da war mir son bisschen überrascht, dass es ein sehr konstantes Antwortverhalten gab. Also wenn man die Zahlen vergleicht mit den Zahlen von vor 2 Jahren, dann hat sich da quasi gar nichts verändert, was in dem Fall nicht unbedingt schlecht ist, denn die Zufriedenheit mit dem Onlineangebot der eigenen Stadt oder Gemeinde ist tatsächlich eher hoch. Grade was die Auffindbarkeit von Informationen und Leistungen angeht oder auch die Bedienbarkeit des Onlineangebots. Da sagen so etwa 70 Prozent, dass sie damit eher oder auch voll und ganz zufrieden sind. Ein bisschen weniger sind es dann schon, die sagen, dass sie viele Verwaltungsleistungen auch online nutzen können und dafür eben nicht aufs Amt müssen, aber es sind auch immer noch mehr als die Hälfte, die das sagen. Und ein bisschen weniger sind es auch, die sagen, dass sie zum zuständigen Onlinedienst weitergeleitet werden, wenn ihre eigene Stadt oder Gemeinde eine Leistung eben nicht selbst online anbietet. Also genau, da sind die Zahlen noch ein bisschen geringer und das ist bei einem relativ komplexen föderalen System, wie wir es ja haben, eigentlich schon auch ganz wichtig, weil als Bürger, Bürger*in, woher soll ich denn jetzt wissen, wo ich meinen Wohngeldantrag zu stellen habe, ob das bei meiner Gemeinde ist, beim Kreis, vielleicht gibt's auch noch eine weitere Einheit wie eine Verwaltungsgemeinschaft oder so. Also mich da erst mal durchzufinden, dann ist es natürlich sehr hilfreich, wenn diese Angebote untereinander auch verknüpft sind. Wenn wir jetzt mal 'n Fazit ziehen, so ganz unterm Strich, kann man sagen jetzt anhand eures Deutschlandindex, dass Deutschland digitaler geworden ist. Also mit einem Anstieg des Gesamtindex, den er ja auch berechnet, 8.6 Prozent seit 20 23. Das ist ja doch 'n relativ deutliches Zeichen. Auf der anderen Seite gilt das eben nicht für alle Leistungen und auch nicht in allen Regionen gleichermaßen. Das war jetzt so mein Fazit, dass ich für mich mitgenommen hab. Was ist euer Fazit? Was nehmt ihr mit aus dem diesjährigen Deutschlandindex, Dennis? Fällt tatsächlich genauso aus bei mir, dass es Es gab 'n leichten Anstieg, aber der betrifft nicht alle Bundesländer gleich. Teilweise gibt's gibt's halt auch diese diese größere Spreizung zwischen den Bundesländern. Mhm. Nicole, was nimmst Du mit? Also signitaler ist ist Deutschland auf jeden Fall geworden. Grade in manchen Bereichen, also Infrastruktur, da hat's wirklich enorme Anstiege gegeben, haben wir ja am Anfang ja schon besprochen, aber auch im Bereich der Verwaltung mit den mit den OZG Leistungen beispielsweise. Was ich, genau, was ich son bisschen für mich mitgenommen habe, ist, dass dieser diese Angebote steigen. Also ich hab besseres Infrastrukturangebot, ich hab 'n größeres Angebot an Onlineverwaltungsleistung, aber diese die Nutzung sich tatsächlich eher sehr langsam ändert. Also da sehen wir gar nicht sone große Veränderung. Digitales Leben haben wir auch tatsächlich die ja die geringste Veränderung von allen unseren Themenbereichen, die wir uns anschauen und dass einfach so Verhalten und Gewohnheiten sich dann doch deutlich langsamer wandeln und diesen Änderungen im Angebot, die teilweise doch sehr schnell gehen können, son bisschen hinterherhinken. Und mit Blick auf Politik, wenn dann auch gewisse Maßnahmen beispielsweise evaluiert werden sollen, wie ist denn die Wirkung von gewissen Maßnahmen, von gewissen Angeboten, die geschaffen worden sind, dass man das auch im Hinterkopf behalten muss, dass man da einfach auch 'n längeren Atem braucht und sich vielleicht auch längere Zeiträume anschauen muss, bis sich dann tatsächlich auch in im Verhalten in der in der Nutzung eine Änderung zeigt. Mhm. Was ihr ja auch mitgebt mit dem Deutschlandindex ist sone Art Handlungsempfehlung für Politik, für Gesellschaft. Gibt's da etwas, was ihr als Handlungsempfehlung noch unbedingt loswerden möchtet? Also ich hab tatsächlich eine aus dem Bereich digitales Leben, weil es dann doch einen starken auffälligen Rückgang gab bei der Anfertigung von Sicherheitskopien. Das heißt, da wär's vielleicht gut, die Bevölkerung noch mal stärker für die Notwendigkeit dieser Sicherheitskopien zu sensibilisieren. Also mehr Sicherheitskopien, einfach weil Daten angreifbar sind, abgeschöpft werden können und da ist es ganz gut, eine Kopie zu haben? Klar, ja und man macht sich dann zum Beispiel auch nicht erpressbar durch ja Erpressungssoftware. Das betrifft jetzt noch nicht mal nur Privatpersonen, sondern auch wenn diese Privatpersonen natürlich auf der Arbeit sind, dann Weil ich glaub schon, dass dass solche Gewohnheiten wahrscheinlich nicht nur privat oder nicht nur beruflich existieren, sondern wahrscheinlich auch ja, eine Gewohnheit insgesamt sind, dass man Sicherheitskopien anfertigt. Nicole, hast Du eine Handlungsempfehlung für Politik, Verwaltung, aber vielleicht auch für die Hörerinnen und Hörer? Ja, was mich auch son bisschen überrascht hat oder was ich son bisschen aus dem Index mitnehme, nämlich wie unterschiedliche Wege die Länder auch teilweise gehen oder wie unterschiedlich sie sich entwickeln. Auch da OZG oder auch Glasfaserausbau sind da ganz gute Beispiele, das hatten wir noch gar nicht angesprochen. Wir gucken uns im Bereich Infrastruktur haben wir diesmal erstmalig son Gerechtigkeitsindex berechnet, bei dem wir uns nämlich anschauen, okay, beim Glasfaserausbau steht das Land als ganze so da, aber wie viele Kommunen sind denn eigentlich schon wie weit ausgebaut? Also sind das nur einige große oder sind tatsächlich schon auch ländliche Räume schon ausgebaut? Und auch da gibt's große Unterschiede zwischen den Ländern. Also einfach faszinierend auch zu sehen, wie unterschiedlich und wie vielfältig die Entwicklung in den Ländern passiert Und eine Handlungsempfehlung kann ich gar nicht so genau sagen. Ich hab mich ja vor allem mit der Verwaltung befasst und da gibt's im Moment ja ganz viele Ideen, was anders gemacht werden kann. Also dieses 1 für Alle Prinzip, dass sich Leistungen in einem Land entwickel und die anderen können es nachnutzen. Dieses, also kurz heißt das Eva Prinzip, dass darüber nachgedacht wird, das zu reformieren. Es gibt die Idee 1 Deutschland Stacks, also dass sich irgendwelche Infrastrukturen oder auch Dienste, so genau ist das alles noch gar nicht klar, zentral bereitstelle. Und da Also das sind grade ganz viele neue Überlegungen im Raum und genau, ich bin erst mal vor allem neugierig und gespannt, wie die sich dann in der Praxis auswirken werden und ob die dann vielleicht tatsächlich, ja, die Dynamik im Bereich der digitalen Verwaltung noch mal erhöhen können. Deutschland ist also digitaler geworden und darf noch digitaler werden. Das hör ich jetzt so raus, das nehme ich mit. Das war Reestart digital, der Podcast des Kompetenzzentrums öffentlicher IT. Ganz herzlichen Dank an meine Kuros, Nicolopialer und Jan Dennis Guns. Danke schön. Danke dir. Und falls euch der Podcast gefallen hat, folgt uns kostenfrei auf Spotify, Apple Podcast und vielen weiteren Apps. 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Antworten liefert der Deutschlandindex der Digitalisierung 20 25 vom Kompetenzzentrum öffentlicher IT. Alle 2 Jahre werden darin Daten und Zahlen zum Stand der Digitalisierung zusammengetragen und ausgewertet. Neben der Infrastruktur und dem digitalen Leben geht es dabei auch die digitale Verwaltung. Und das darf ich schon mal spoilern, in einigen Bereichen, da hat sich wirklich was getan.\n\nWas genau, das finden wir heute in dieser Podcastfolge heraus. Herzlich willkommen beim öFIT Podcast restart digital, eine Produktion des Fraunhofer Instituts für offene Kommunikationssysteme. Ich bin Philipp 1 und ich begrüße hier im Studio in Berlin Tegel meine beiden Co Hosts. Zum einen Nicole Opiala, sie ist stellvertretende Leiterin des Kompetenzzentrums öffentlicher IT und forscht zu soziotechnischen Trends an der Schnittstelle zwischen Gesellschaft, Verwaltung und Politik. Nicole ist heute nicht im Studio, sondern sie ist uns online zugeschaltet aus Oldenburg.\n\nHallo Nicole.\n\nSpeaker 1: Hallo Philipp.\n\nSpeaker 0: Hier aber wirklich vor Ort ist Jan Dennis Gumpz. Er ist Data Scientist am Kompetenzzentrum öffentlicher IT und seine Arbeitsschwerpunkte liegen im Bereich der Trendforschung und in der Auswertung und Aufbereitung von Daten. Dennis, da bist Du natürlich genau richtig beim Deutschlandindex.\n\nSpeaker 2: Danke, ja, guten Tag.\n\nSpeaker 0: Zunächst mal hatten wir uns ja vor 2 Jahren schon über den Deutschlandindex, den damaligen Deutschlandindex der Digitalisierung unterhalten. So ganz grob, was hat sich seitdem getan, was euch beide wirklich überrascht hat?\n\nSpeaker 1: Da gibt's ganz viele Aspekte. Der Deutschlandindex ist ja wirklich umfangreich. Wir gucken uns da fast 50 verschiedene Kennzahlen an in verschiedenen Bereichen der Digitalisierung und überraschende Entwicklungen gibt's eigentlich an vielen Stellen. Beispielsweise fand ich auch sehr überraschend, dass der Glasfaserausbau tatsächlich sehr rasant vorangeschritten ist. Das Ziel, 50 Prozent der Haushalte bis Ende diesen Jahres anzuschließen, rückt tatsächlich in greifbare Nähe, also ist 'n sehr schöner Erfolg.\n\nSpeaker 0: Also schnelles Internet für alle, das ist tatsächlich ja 'n Stück weit weitergegangen.\n\nSpeaker 1: Genau. Und auf der anderen Seite haben wir auch Entwicklungen, wo es vielleicht 'n bisschen nach unten geht, beispielsweise was die Kompetenzen angeht, was ich auch überraschend fand, denn die Nutzung von digitalen Möglichkeiten auch im Alltag, die steigt eigentlich grundsätzlich. Das ist ja immer son bisschen, wir gucken ja auch auf die verschiedenen Ländern, natürlich ist das auch nicht in allen Ländern gleich, aber im Bereich der digitalen Basiskompetenzen, also beispielsweise Personen, die von sich selbst sagen, dass es ihnen leicht fällt, ein Programm zu installieren, sich anonym im Netz zu bewegen oder auch eine Sicherheitskopie von Daten anzufertigen. Da sehen wir beispielsweise Rückgänge und das finde ich schon 'n ganz interessanten Kontrast, dass die Nutzung auf der einen Seite steigt, aber die Kompetenzen oder auf jeden Fall dieses Selbstbewusstsein, dass man diese Kompetenzen hat, abnimmt.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm, okay. Ja, da werden wir uns vielleicht noch mal drüber unterhalten, das noch mal vertiefen, Dennis gibt's irgendwas, was dich wirklich überrascht hat an dem neuen Zahlen, an dem Deutschlandindex?\n\nSpeaker 2: Eine Sache, die mich überrascht hat, war, wir haben über die vergangenen Jahre immer so beobachtet, dass die Unterschiede zwischen den Bundesländern tendenziell immer 'n bisschen kleiner werden und zumindest im Bereich digitales Leben gibt es jetzt einzelne Indikatoren und dadurch auch 'n Gesamtindex, so eine Entwicklung, wo die sich eher 'n bisschen auseinanderentwickeln. Das heißt, sie sind weiter verteilt über einen Wertebereich. Das heißt, die Unterschiede werden sind in den letzten 2 Jahren scheinbar etwas größer geworden zwischen den Bundesländern. Mhm.\n\nSpeaker 0: Und da kann man gar nicht unbedingt sagen zwischen Stadt und Land, sondern ganz allgemein, da gibt's 'n paar Bundesländer, die sind haben sich ganz gut entwickelt und andere sind eher abgehängt. Also auch da werden wir gleich noch mal genauer drüber sprechen. Der Deutschlandindex, der setzt ja jedes Mal verschiedene Schwerpunkte und auch Themenfelder. Diesmal sind Themenfelder Infrastruktur, digitales Leben und digitale Verwaltung, aber auch KI spielt eine Rolle. Damit habt ihr euch ja auch befasst, oder?\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja, genau. Wir haben der der Entwicklung im Bereich KI, insbesondere generative KI Rechnung getragen, indem wir in unsere große Bevölkerungsbefragung diesmal 'n paar Fragen zur KI reingenommen haben, insbesondere halt wie häufig wird so was bereits genutzt und wofür?\n\nSpeaker 0: Also werfen wir zunächst mal 'n genaueren Blick auf das Thema Infrastruktur. Nicole, Du hast ja schon gesagt, der Indexwert, den berechnet ihr ja für Infrastruktur 20 25, der ist in allen Bundesländern gestiegen, insbesondere liegt das auch am Glasfaserausbau. Da soll bis Ende 20 25 mindestens 50 Prozent aller Haushalte versorgt werden mit Glasfaser. Klappt das? Ist das überhaupt möglich?\n\nSpeaker 1: Es rückt tatsächlich in greifbare Nähe. Wir haben die Daten von Mitte 20 24, da lagen wir bundesweit bei 37.5 Prozent, Ende 20 24 jetzt bei knapp 40 Prozent. Also ob jetzt die letzten 10 Prozentpunkte noch gewuppt werden können das Ende diesen Jahres, das ist jetzt son bisschen Rätselraten, aber auf jeden Fall sind wir knapp davor, tatsächlich dieses Ziel zu erreichen. Und das ist ja schon sehr beeindruckend, wenn man sich auch beispielsweise die Entwicklung anguckt in anderen Bereichen der Infrastruktur. Auch da gibt's politische Zielsetzungen, beispielsweise Breitband mit 50 Mbit pro Sekunde, da sollte ein Vollausbau, also 100 Prozent aller Haushalte können diese Bandbreiten erhalten, schon 20 18 erreicht sein.\n\nDa sind wir immer noch nicht, auch 7 Jahre später noch nicht, aber in fast allen Ländern haben wir inzwischen 95 Prozent aller Haushalte mit 50 Mbit pro Sekunde versorgt und das zeigt auch son bisschen, wenn man von Vollausbau spricht, dann ist eine 100 Prozent eher nicht erreichbar. Also Vollausbau bedeutet schon eher über 95 Prozent, aber nicht unbedingt 100 Prozent, denn es gibt immer sehr abgelegene Liegenschaften. Also wir sprechen wirklich nicht von Orten oder Ortsteilen, sondern wirklich einzelnen Liegenschaften, die dann sehr schwierig und unter sehr hohem Aufwand nur anzuschließen sind und bei denen dann tatsächlich es vielleicht sinnvoller ist zu überlegen, mit welchen alternativen Technologien Richtfunk, Satellit, Mobilfunk und so weiter, die angeschlossen werden können. Und das ist vielleicht auch ganz wichtig im Hinterkopf zu behalten, wenn man jetzt auf den Vollausbau Glasfaser schielt, der dann 20 30 erreicht werden soll.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm. Jetzt kann man ja auch noch mal schauen, wo genau klappt's denn mit dem Ausbau gut? Also ich wohn jetzt selbst in Berlin, da wurde auch vorm meiner Haustür kräftig gebuddelt und irgendwelche Glasfaserleitungen wurden da verlegt, denkt man natürlich, na gut, also grad in großen Städten, da ist man da vielleicht 'n bisschen schneller. Ist das denn so? Gibt's tatsächlich da 'n Vorteil in den Städten gegenüber den ländlichen Kommunen?\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, interessanterweise nicht. Und was wir, ich muss sagen, in den Anfangszeiten des Deutschlandindex ja oft beobachtet haben, das war son West Ost Gefälle zwischen den Ländern und eben auch eine Stadt Land Gefälle. Also in den Anfangstagen, da waren eigentlich die Stadtstaaten immer unaufholbar an der Spitze in fast allen Bereichen und dieses Bild hat sich zunehmend aufgelöst, grade auch bei der Infrastruktur sieht man das. Also Ost West ist da ein wesentliches Unterscheidungsmerkmal mehr, beispielsweise beim Glasfaser und Stadt Land tatsächlich auch nicht. Also wir haben große Städte, die sehr gut versorgt sind, aber genauso gut auch große Städte, die deutlich unter dem bundesweiten Schnitt liegen.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm. Was ich auch noch ganz interessant fand, ist, dass viele private Nutzer*innen ganz offensichtlich an diesem Glasfaserausbau überhaupt kein Interesse haben. Die sind mit ihrem DSL- und Kabelanschluss eigentlich ganz zufrieden. Wird da vielleicht an den Bedürfnissen von Menschen vorbeigebaut?\n\nSpeaker 1: Das ist tatsächlich noch ein Problem, dass die Nachfrage theoretischen Versorgbarkeit noch hinterherhinkt. Also wir haben da noch eine große Spanne zwischen den Homes past, also da läuft irgendwo eine Leitung vorbei und Homes connectet, die also tatsächlich auch den Anschluss haben und genau, die Nutzung ist dann auch noch mal eine andere Frage. Das liegt einfach daran, dass für die derzeit gängigen Anwendungen in vielen Fällen eben Kabel oder DSL noch ausreichend sind. Aber wenn wir uns die Entwicklung anschauen, dann kommen da schon zunehmend auch im Nutzungsverhalten natürlich Anwendungen und Technologien, die auch höhere Ansprüche an die Infrastruktur stellen. Also das ist sozusagen im Moment vielleicht noch 'n bisschen Investition in die Zukunft, aber wenn man sich die Entwicklung anschaut, durchaus notwendig und auch auf politischer Ebene gibt's ja beispielsweise die EU hat auch vor, die Kupfernetze komplett abzuschalten im Jahr 20 30.\n\nAlso der Trend geht schon ganz klar hin zu Glasfaser. Und den sollte man auch nicht verschlafen, auch wenn man im Moment vielleicht sagt, na ja gut, mit dem, was ich so tagtäglich mache, brauche ich das vielleicht noch nicht unbedingt. Noch nicht.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja, das ist ja genau der der Punkt, ne. Also die Politik macht ja auch Druck von anderer Seite. Man möchte Kupfernetze abschalten, Dennis ist das eine gute Idee?\n\nSpeaker 2: Ich weiß nicht, ob es eine gute Idee ist, Kupfernetze abzuschalten, aber ich wollte eher bei der Glasfaser noch mal einhaken. Es gibt, glaube ich, sogar fast global den Trend, zum Beispiel zum Videostreaming statt zum Fernsehen und gerade da beobachten wir ja, dass es immer höhere Auflösungen angeboten werden und sicherlich irgendwann dann auch nachgefragt werden. Also ich glaub schon, dass dass das, auch wenn die Nachfrage jetzt noch nicht da ist, das doch sinnvoll ist, Glasfaser auszubauen, weil ja, ich glaub, das wird dann eingeholt dadurch.\n\nSpeaker 0: Na ja, in der Tat. Also ich nutz ja auch ganz gerne und ich dreh immer im Kreis, wenn's dann anfängt zu ruckeln und man kann praktisch nix machen. Wahrscheinlich ist dann irgendwann die Geschwindigkeit einfach zu langsam, wenn alle drauf zugreifen oder?\n\nSpeaker 2: Das würde ich vermuten, ja.\n\nSpeaker 0: Nicole, schauen wir noch mal aufs Mobilfunknetz. Die vier-g-Versorgung, die ist ja nahezu flächendeckend. Die Abdeckung mit 5 g, die hat sich stark verbessert als Vierfach am ICE. Da bekomme ich davon leider nicht so viel mit. Da ruckelt's auf ganzer Strecke, könnte man sagen, wo muss ich dann noch was tun?\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, ich find's auch immer erstaunlich, dass wir, wenn man sich die Versorgung eigentlich anguckt mit 5 G, da auch bei eigentlich in allen Ländern mindestens 90 Prozent Flächenabdeckung tatsächlich der kompletten Fläche. Da zählt alles dazu, auch jedes Naturschutzgebiet, auch jede Bahnstrecke liegen und\n\nSpeaker 0: man\n\nSpeaker 1: es dann trotzdem immer mal wieder doch schafft, in so ein Funkloch hineinzugeraten.\n\nSpeaker 0: Kommen wir mal zum nächsten Themenfeld, nämlich digitales Leben. Da erschafft ihr auch einen Index erstellt, auch wieder für dieses Jahr und diesen Index, der basiert auf 1 repräsentativen Bevölkerungsbefragung mit über 5800 Teilnehmenden. Die wird auch regelmäßig durchgeführt, zuletzt Ende 20 24, also mal zu erklären, wo die Daten eigentlich überhaupt herkommen. Und da gibt's zunächst mal 'n positives Ergebnis, nämlich die Nutzung von Telemedizin. Die hat sich stark erhöht von 5.1 Prozent in 20 20 auf 13.5 Prozent in 20 24.\n\nWo läuft's da besonders gut mit der Telemedizin, Dennis?\n\nSpeaker 2: Ich glaube, hier gibt es einfach tatsächlich eine große Nachfrage, weil man kann das auch beobachten, dass es vor allem jüngere Menschen sind, die das stärker nachfragen oder stärker nutzen und ich vermute einfach, das hängt ganz stark damit zusammen, dass die sowieso digital affiner sind und dann halt nicht zum Beispiel beim Arzt sitzen wollen im im Sprechzimmer oder im Warteraum, sondern zeitsparend das tatsächlich erledigen wollen. Ich vermute auch, dass gerade während der Coronapandemie, ich weiß es jetzt schon 'n bisschen her, aber da dann halt auch wahrscheinlich viele Ärzte und Ärztinnen, ja, überhaupt das Angebot erst geschaffen haben mit Videosprechstunden und Ähnlichem. Genau, aber das scheint angenommen zu werden.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja, ich find mich da ganz gut wieder. Also ich nutz auch Telemedizin gelegentlich, gerade wenn's da ich sag mal, Lapalien geht, Verwaltung, was auch immer. Man braucht irgend 'n Schein oder so. Mhm. Ich muss da nicht extra hin.\n\nDas ist ja wirklich schon sehr praktisch. Allerdings will man ja mit Telemedizin auch gerade eine ältere Zielgruppe erreichen im ländlichen Raum, ja? Da die Versorgung sicherzustellen, aber gerade der ländliche Raum, der wirkt dann noch ein bisschen abgehängt, hab ich bei euch gelesen. Wie kann man da vielleicht Angebote noch attraktiver machen?\n\nSpeaker 2: Ich würde es nicht sagen, tatsächlich abgehängt, sondern eher auf dem auf dem gleichen Niveau. Wie kann man das attraktiver machen? Ich bin mir da gar nicht so sicher, ob man das machen kann, weil das Angebot ist letzten Endes, glaube ich, da. Ich weiß jetzt nicht, ob es so ist, dass gerade Ärzte im ländlichen Raum, die normalerweise auch der Hausarzt wären, ob die das vielleicht seltener anbieten. Das könnte eine Ursache sein, aber ich hab mich jetzt nicht genau mit den Ursachen davon beschäftigt tatsächlich.\n\nSpeaker 0: Schauen wir uns mal 'n anderen Punkt an, nämlich der Anteil der online engagierten Internetnutzenden. Der ist nach einem Rückgang kurzzeitigen 20 23 auf einen neuen Höchststand gestiegen. 13 Prozent, die sich regelmäßig online engagieren, wie es so heißt, also es betrifft Wikipedia Artikel, Open Source Software, die programmiert wird, offene Lernmaterialien. Was ist da geschehen?\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja, erst mal finde ich das eine eine sehr positive Entwicklung. Auch hier ist es relativ schwierig zu sagen, worauf das jetzt genau zurückzuführen ist. Ich hab verschiedene Rechnungen angestellt, eine Ursache zu finden. Das konnte ich leider nicht identifizieren.\n\nSpeaker 1: Also als wir diesen Rückgang beobachtet haben, dann war unsere erste Interpretation natürlich, okay, während der Coronapandemie, man war auf jeden Fall eingeschränkter in den Möglichkeiten, sich im Analogen zu engagieren. Deswegen hat sich da vielleicht das Engagement ins digitale Ädern eher verlagert und Post Corona dann ein Rückgang, weil dann jetzt die Personen dann doch sich lieber wieder direkt vor Ort engagieren. Und dadurch, dass die Zahlen jetzt aber gestiegen sind und tatsächlich auf einen auf einen Höchststand, also auch höher als während Corona sozusagen, sehen wir, dass diese Interpretation tatsächlich dann eher nicht getragen hat, sondern dass das auch ein Nebeneinander ist und dass auch jetzt nach Corona, wo es wieder möglich ist, sich vor Ort zu engagieren, digitales Engagement trotzdem weiter einen wichtigen Platz in der Gesellschaft und im Bereich gesellschaftliches Engagement einnimmt.\n\nSpeaker 0: Das heißt, durch Corona ist es einfach gewachsen son Stück weit und hört jetzt ein dazu ganz normal, wie auch 'n Engagement die Ecke.\n\nSpeaker 2: Das finden Genau. Leider eine, ja, ich find's leider 'n bisschen eine schwierige Aussage, weil wir tatsächlich keine Zahlen vor Corona haben. Die erste Bevölkerungsbefragung, die haben wir 2020 gemacht. Dementsprechend haben wir den Vergleich zu zuvor einfach nicht. Ich könnte mir auch vorstellen, dass diese Informationsbereitstellung einfach im Internet einfach eine größere Rolle spielt und deshalb vielleicht es mehr Engagement gibt.\n\nWarum es dann den den kleinen Rückgang 2022 gab. Jetzt den Höchststand lässt sich damit allerdings immer noch nicht so gut erklären.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm.\n\nSpeaker 1: Aber es ist tatsächlich ja was, was wir in allen Bereichen, korrigier mich, Dennis, in allen Bereichen des Engagements eigentlich tatsächlich beobachtet haben, dass es in allen Bereichen, die wir uns angeschaut haben, einen Anstieg gegeben hat. Und das betrifft, wenn man so möchte, auch Partizipation in der eigenen Gemeinde. Also Personen, die sich beispielsweise an Planungsverfahren in ihrer Gemeinde online beteiligen oder auch über Onlinemängelnmelder Vorschläge machen oder Müll oder Sonstiges im öffentlichen Raum melden und damit dazu beitragen, dass die Gemeinde Bescheid weiß, wo sie vielleicht aktiv werden müsste oder könnte. In der Beziehung zur zur eigenen Gemeindeverwaltung sehen wir auch, dass da auch das Engagement gestiegen ist.\n\nSpeaker 0: Da schauen wir auch gleich noch mal genauer hin, nämlich in die digitale Verwaltung. Das ist ja auch 'n Thema, das ihr genau untersucht habt. Vorher machen wir noch eine kleine Abwägung. K I, grad generative K I, das ist auch Gegenstand gewesen. Was habt ihr da rausgefunden?\n\nSpeaker 2: Zum einen, was was ich schon überraschend fand, war, dass die Nutzung von generativer K I innerhalb der Bevölkerung noch gar nicht so groß ist Und das, obwohl natürlich jedes Smartphone mittlerweile mit, hier ist generative KI drin beworben wird. Wofür KI genutzt wird, das ist vielleicht gar nicht so überraschend, wenn man die Beschwerden von Hochschulprofessorinnen und Professoren und Lehrerinnen und Lehrern hört, nämlich dass es vor allem im Bereich Ausbildung zum Einsatz kommt und gar nicht so sehr bei Unterhaltung und für oder für andere Zwecke.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm. Ja, kann man gut nachvollziehen, ne. Also grade für die Vorbereitung von wahrscheinlich Hausarbeiten Rechercheaufgaben, da wird KI sicher gerne genutzt. Nur tatsächlich interessant die Zahlen, wenn man schaut, wer insgesamt denn zu KI greift. Das sind weniger als die Hälfte der Internetnutzenden, die überhaupt KI verwenden und nur ein Viertel mindestens einmal im Monat.\n\nVerschlafen wir da grad in Deutschland einen Trend?\n\nSpeaker 2: Da wäre ich mir nicht sicher. Ich glaube, weil gerade wurden ja die diese primären Einsatzzwecke von KI beschrieben und ich glaube, die Leute verwenden es einfach dafür, wo es nützlich ist. Das heißt, ich glaube nicht, dass da ein Trend verschlafen wird. Ausbildung, dann vielleicht auch noch Beruf. Als jetzt ChatGPT das erste Mal veröffentlicht worden ist, dann war das hochinteressant, auch zu Unterhaltungszwecken sich damit auszutauschen, aber ich glaub, das nutzt sich einfach ab.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ich zum Beispiel hab jetzt außerhalb des Berufs nicht ständig das Bedürfnis, generative KI zu nutzen. Wozu? Das heißt, ich glaube nicht, dass ein ein Trend hier verschlafen wird.\n\nSpeaker 0: Also einmal ist es ganz spannend, sich mit ChatGPT zu unterhalten, aber nachm fünfzehnten oder zwanzigsten Mal, dann lässt der Reiz auch nach.\n\nSpeaker 2: Das wäre meine Vermutung, ja.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ihr habt, fand ich interessant, auch gefragt, wie optimistisch die Befragten gegenüber Neuerungen durch KI sind. Was ist da das Ergebnis?\n\nSpeaker 2: Es wird vor allem ein positiver Einfluss grade auf Bildung und Forschung erwartet, was sich dann auch mit dem Ergebnis deckt, dass generative KI vor allem für Ausbildung und Beruf genutzt wird. Gleichzeitig sind die Erwartungen gerade so gesamtgesellschaftlich eher negativ, wenn es zum Beispiel den Zusammenhalten der Gesellschaft geht und auch Wohlstand und Wohlstandsverteilung. Wobei ganz interessant war, dass gerade unter denjenigen, die generative KI schon häufiger nutzen, diese Erwartungen generell positiver sind. Das heißt, vor allem diejenigen, die generative KI selten nutzen, erwarten auch tendenziell negativere Auswirkungen.\n\nSpeaker 0: Kommen wir doch mal zum letzten Themenfeld der digitalen Verwaltung. Da fand ich ganz spannend, dass ihr festgestellt habt, dass diese Effekte des Onlinezugangsgesetzes, wir hatten uns darüber auch schon mal hier in diesem Podcast unterhalten, dass die sichtbar werden. Also im Mai 20 25, das war son Bezugszeitraum, den ihr euch mal angeschaut habt, da standen im Schnitt für 227 Verwaltungsleistungen Onlinedienste flächendeckend zur Verfügung und das sind 68 mehr als 2 Jahre zuvor. Liegt das nur an dem Gesetz oder woran vielleicht noch, Nicole?\n\nSpeaker 1: Na, ich wollte noch ergänzen, dass die Erwartung der Auswirkungen von KI übrigens auch bei der öffentlichen Verwaltung positiver waren. Also da wird auf jeden Fall von den Bürgerinnen und Bürgern auch noch großes Potenzial gesehen, KI in der öffentlichen Verwaltung zu nutzen. Aber genau, was Du angesprochen hast, ja das Onlinezugangsgesetz hatte ja eigentlich oder die ursprüngliche Frist, sagen wir's so, war eigentlich bis Ende 20 22 alle 575 Leistungen digital anzubieten. Das heißt also, dass ich als Bürger, Bürgerin einen Onlinezugang dazu habe. Du hast grade schon gesagt, jetzt im Mai waren's 227 Leistungen im Schnitt in den Ländern.\n\nDa sind wir von 575 noch 'n ganzes Stück entfernt und 20 22 ist auch schon 'n bisschen länger her.\n\nSpeaker 0: Das heißt, der Anstieg, der klingt besser, als er letztendlich insgesamt ist, ne, wenn man sich total anschaut, was erreicht werden könnte, ja?\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, das das UZG war einfach ein ein sehr ambitioniertes Vorhaben. Es war eigentlich auch schon relativ früh klar, dass das wahrscheinlich nicht erreicht werden kann, aber es hat auch durch die die erste Frist beispielsweise natürlich ganz klare Anreize gesetzt und die Verwaltung motiviert. Obwohl diese Frist jetzt verstrichen ist, ist das OZG ja immer noch in Kraft. Das heißt, dieses Ziel, auch wenn's jetzt keine so klare Frist mehr gibt, alle Leistungen digital anzubieten, das besteht auch weiterhin. Dazu kommen auch auf EU Ebene jetzt noch verschiedene andere Regelungen, die das auch erforderlich machen würden.\n\nDa müssen wir jetzt vielleicht gar nicht so gar nicht so tief drauf eingehen. Aber wie Du schon gesagt hast, der Anstieg auch innerhalb von 2 Jahren, der ist doch durchaus noch beachtlich, auch wenn das Ziel genau noch nicht erreicht ist. Und das da sieht man also, dass dieses OZG und diese Verpflichtung, die damit geschaffen wurde, auch nach Fristende immer noch diese Zugwirkung hat, weitere Leistungen digital anzubieten. Was wir allerdings dabei sehen, ist, dass die Unterschiede der Länder da relativ groß sind. Also wir haben das Dashboard digitale Verwaltung des inzwischen BMDS.\n\nDa kann man sich angucken, für wie viele dieser OZG Leistungen Onlinedienste in den Ländern schon flächendeckend zur Verfügung stehen. Und da haben wir noch relativ große Unterschiede. Also Hamburg ist hier Spitzenreiter oder war Spitzenreiter im Mai 20 25. Da ist relativ viel Dynamik drin, muss ich tatsächlich sagen. Also es lohnt sich schon fast monatlich, da mal in die Daten reinzugucken, weil sich da doch immer wieder auch was ändert.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ach so schnell. Ändert sich da tatsächlich auch das Angebot, ja?\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, tatsächlich, genau.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja.\n\nSpeaker 1: Und haben also zu dem Mai hatte Hamburg, ich glaube eineinhalb Mal so viele Leistungen im Angebot etwa wie wie das Schlusslicht und in der Dynamik sehen wir da auch sehr große Unterschiede. Also Hamburg, aber auch Sachsen Anhalt beispielsweise haben in den letzten 2 Jahren für über 90 OZG Leistungen Onlinedienste flächendeckend ausgerollt. In anderen Ländern waren's im gleichen Zeitraum nicht einmal halb so viele. Also da ist viel Bewegung drin und das ist Auf der einen Seite kann man sagen, ja gut, eigentlich war ja mal das Ziel auch mit dem UZG, wir haben eine Nachnutzung, ein Land entwickelt mal was und die anderen können es dann nachnutzen und dann müsste es ja relativ gleich sein zwischen den Ländern. Das mit der Nachnutzung stößt an viele Probleme, das ist auch schon relativ tiefgehend analysiert worden von verschiedenen Seiten.\n\nAber durch diese hohe Dynamik ist das jetzt gar nicht so gesetzt. Da kann man jetzt nicht sagen, okay, jetzt haben wir aber die Spitzenreiter und die Schlusslichter und irgendwie, das ist auch so fest, ne, da da ändert sich wenig, sondern wir sehen auch in den letzten, wenn man das vergleicht mit 20 23 Länder, die eher in der Schlussgruppe waren, die sind inzwischen irgendwo im Mittelfeld gelandet und umgekehrt. Also da passiert im Moment tatsächlich noch richtig, richtig viel im Bereich OZG Leistung.\n\nSpeaker 0: Was ich mich halt frage, also ihr habt ja auch geschaut, wie wird das Angebot eigentlich angenommen, ne? Also der Anteil der Nutzenden an diesen Onlineverwaltungsleistung, der ist gar nicht mal unbedingt gestiegen. Der ist eher gleich geblieben, ne? Also ungefähr genauso viele Leute, die ihre Anträge oder Formulare online übermitteln. Ich frag mich halt warum, ne.\n\nAlso ich find das ja 'n super Service, wenn ich nicht zum Amt muss, sondern das online machen kann. Ist das vielleicht das falsche Angebot oder gibt's da Barrieren, die den Zugang erschweren?\n\nSpeaker 1: Wir haben uns auch gedacht, wenn ich ein ein steigendes Angebot habe, dann müssten doch auch immer mehr Menschen das für sie passende Angebot auch online finden können und nutzen können. Also warum hat sich der Anteil der Nutzenden da nicht wesentlich erhöht? Genau und das kann natürlich ja an an ganz verschiedenen Gründen liegen, aber unsere Interpretation an der Stelle ist, dass es Personen gibt, die nutzen Onlineverwaltungsleistungen und wenn's wenn dann noch mehr Leistungen online verfügbar sind, dann freuen sie sich und dass sie die dann auch noch nutzen können und es gibt aber auch Gruppen, die nutzen es eben nicht. Dass es eine grade eine Herausforderung ist, hier neue nutzenden Gruppen auch zu gewinnen für hier neue nutzenden Gruppen auch zu gewinnen für Onlineverwaltungsleistung. Mhm.\n\nSpeaker 0: Auf der anderen Seite ist ja vielleicht auch eine Diskrepanz, es gibt immer mehr Nutzer*innen, die sich zum Beispiel mit ihrer EID, also mit ihrem Personalausweis online ausweisen oder auch Chatmöglichkeiten mit Verwaltungsmitarbeitenden nutzen. Also diese, ich sag mal, Basic Angebote, die werden ja doch stärker wahrgenommen.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, genau, das steigt, aber das sind ja eher so begleitende Services, sag ich mal und wenn man sich das anguckt, also von den Bürgerinnen und Bürgern, die tatsächlich auch ein Verwaltungsanliegen hatten Innerhalb des letzten Jahres haben im Schnitt 2 Drittel tatsächlich, also 66 Prozent, dann auch Formulare oder Anträge online an die Verwaltung übermittelt. Und die Zahlen für solche Basiskomponenten, wie Du sie grade genannt hast, die liegen ja noch weit darunter. Also ich müsste jetzt noch mal reingucken, aber ich glaube, EID, na, sind wir bei einem Viertel oder auch bei bei Chatmöglichkeiten mit Verwaltungsmitarbeitenden, da sehen wir ein Wachstum, eigentlich auch ein stetiges Wachstum, aber die Zahlen liegen noch deutlich darunter. Also das sind dann eher Dienste, die ich vielleicht mitnutze, wenn ich ohnehin ein Onlineverwaltungsanliegen grade grade grade abwickeln möchte, dass ich mich vorher per Chat oder auch wenns 'n Chatbot gibt mit dem Chatbot erkundige, was ich dafür brauche, an wen ich mich da wenden muss oder dass ich dann auch, wenn's die Möglichkeit gibt, online den Status einsehe oder mich eben mit meiner EID authentifizieren kann, diesen Onlinedienst überhaupt nutzen zu können. Also das sind eher so begleitende Komponenten und wie gesagt, da ist die Nutzung doch noch deutlich geringer.\n\nSpeaker 0: Also 'n Angebot für Leute, die schon gewonnen sind, die auch schon online unterwegs sind in der Verwaltung, die nehmen das dann noch sozusagen mit?\n\nSpeaker 1: Das wäre eine Interpretation, das haben wir uns tatsächlich in in in dem Detail gar nicht angeschaut bisher. Also die Daten, die sind so unglaublich umfangreich, dass man tatsächlich da leider gar nicht alles immer bis ins Letzte für alle Gruppen auch auswerten kann. Deswegen genau.\n\nSpeaker 0: Was ihr abgefragt habt, ist, wie zufrieden die Leute sind mit ihrer elektronischen Verwaltung sozusagen, wo aber auch Verbesserungspotenziale sind. Was hat diese Abfrage ergeben?\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, auch da war mir son bisschen überrascht, dass es ein sehr konstantes Antwortverhalten gab. Also wenn man die Zahlen vergleicht mit den Zahlen von vor 2 Jahren, dann hat sich da quasi gar nichts verändert, was in dem Fall nicht unbedingt schlecht ist, denn die Zufriedenheit mit dem Onlineangebot der eigenen Stadt oder Gemeinde ist tatsächlich eher hoch. Grade was die Auffindbarkeit von Informationen und Leistungen angeht oder auch die Bedienbarkeit des Onlineangebots. Da sagen so etwa 70 Prozent, dass sie damit eher oder auch voll und ganz zufrieden sind. Ein bisschen weniger sind es dann schon, die sagen, dass sie viele Verwaltungsleistungen auch online nutzen können und dafür eben nicht aufs Amt müssen, aber es sind auch immer noch mehr als die Hälfte, die das sagen.\n\nUnd ein bisschen weniger sind es auch, die sagen, dass sie zum zuständigen Onlinedienst weitergeleitet werden, wenn ihre eigene Stadt oder Gemeinde eine Leistung eben nicht selbst online anbietet. Also genau, da sind die Zahlen noch ein bisschen geringer und das ist bei einem relativ komplexen föderalen System, wie wir es ja haben, eigentlich schon auch ganz wichtig, weil als Bürger, Bürger*in, woher soll ich denn jetzt wissen, wo ich meinen Wohngeldantrag zu stellen habe, ob das bei meiner Gemeinde ist, beim Kreis, vielleicht gibt's auch noch eine weitere Einheit wie eine Verwaltungsgemeinschaft oder so. Also mich da erst mal durchzufinden, dann ist es natürlich sehr hilfreich, wenn diese Angebote untereinander auch verknüpft sind.\n\nSpeaker 0: Wenn wir jetzt mal 'n Fazit ziehen, so ganz unterm Strich, kann man sagen jetzt anhand eures Deutschlandindex, dass Deutschland digitaler geworden ist. Also mit einem Anstieg des Gesamtindex, den er ja auch berechnet, 8.6 Prozent seit 20 23. Das ist ja doch 'n relativ deutliches Zeichen. Auf der anderen Seite gilt das eben nicht für alle Leistungen und auch nicht in allen Regionen gleichermaßen. Das war jetzt so mein Fazit, dass ich für mich mitgenommen hab.\n\nWas ist euer Fazit? Was nehmt ihr mit aus dem diesjährigen Deutschlandindex, Dennis?\n\nSpeaker 2: Fällt tatsächlich genauso aus bei mir, dass es Es gab 'n leichten Anstieg, aber der betrifft nicht alle Bundesländer gleich. Teilweise gibt's gibt's halt auch diese diese größere Spreizung zwischen den Bundesländern.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm. Nicole, was nimmst Du mit?\n\nSpeaker 1: Also signitaler ist ist Deutschland auf jeden Fall geworden. Grade in manchen Bereichen, also Infrastruktur, da hat's wirklich enorme Anstiege gegeben, haben wir ja am Anfang ja schon besprochen, aber auch im Bereich der Verwaltung mit den mit den OZG Leistungen beispielsweise. Was ich, genau, was ich son bisschen für mich mitgenommen habe, ist, dass dieser diese Angebote steigen. Also ich hab besseres Infrastrukturangebot, ich hab 'n größeres Angebot an Onlineverwaltungsleistung, aber diese die Nutzung sich tatsächlich eher sehr langsam ändert. Also da sehen wir gar nicht sone große Veränderung.\n\nDigitales Leben haben wir auch tatsächlich die ja die geringste Veränderung von allen unseren Themenbereichen, die wir uns anschauen und dass einfach so Verhalten und Gewohnheiten sich dann doch deutlich langsamer wandeln und diesen Änderungen im Angebot, die teilweise doch sehr schnell gehen können, son bisschen hinterherhinken. Und mit Blick auf Politik, wenn dann auch gewisse Maßnahmen beispielsweise evaluiert werden sollen, wie ist denn die Wirkung von gewissen Maßnahmen, von gewissen Angeboten, die geschaffen worden sind, dass man das auch im Hinterkopf behalten muss, dass man da einfach auch 'n längeren Atem braucht und sich vielleicht auch längere Zeiträume anschauen muss, bis sich dann tatsächlich auch in im Verhalten in der in der Nutzung eine Änderung zeigt. Mhm.\n\nSpeaker 0: Was ihr ja auch mitgebt mit dem Deutschlandindex ist sone Art Handlungsempfehlung für Politik, für Gesellschaft. Gibt's da etwas, was ihr als Handlungsempfehlung noch unbedingt loswerden möchtet?\n\nSpeaker 2: Also ich hab tatsächlich eine aus dem Bereich digitales Leben, weil es dann doch einen starken auffälligen Rückgang gab bei der Anfertigung von Sicherheitskopien. Das heißt, da wär's vielleicht gut, die Bevölkerung noch mal stärker für die Notwendigkeit dieser Sicherheitskopien zu sensibilisieren.\n\nSpeaker 0: Also mehr Sicherheitskopien, einfach weil Daten angreifbar sind, abgeschöpft werden können und da ist es ganz gut, eine Kopie zu haben?\n\nSpeaker 2: Klar, ja und man macht sich dann zum Beispiel auch nicht erpressbar durch ja Erpressungssoftware. Das betrifft jetzt noch nicht mal nur Privatpersonen, sondern auch wenn diese Privatpersonen natürlich auf der Arbeit sind, dann Weil ich glaub schon, dass dass solche Gewohnheiten wahrscheinlich nicht nur privat oder nicht nur beruflich existieren, sondern wahrscheinlich auch ja, eine Gewohnheit insgesamt sind, dass man Sicherheitskopien anfertigt.\n\nSpeaker 0: Nicole, hast Du eine Handlungsempfehlung für Politik, Verwaltung, aber vielleicht auch für die Hörerinnen und Hörer?\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, was mich auch son bisschen überrascht hat oder was ich son bisschen aus dem Index mitnehme, nämlich wie unterschiedliche Wege die Länder auch teilweise gehen oder wie unterschiedlich sie sich entwickeln. Auch da OZG oder auch Glasfaserausbau sind da ganz gute Beispiele, das hatten wir noch gar nicht angesprochen. Wir gucken uns im Bereich Infrastruktur haben wir diesmal erstmalig son Gerechtigkeitsindex berechnet, bei dem wir uns nämlich anschauen, okay, beim Glasfaserausbau steht das Land als ganze so da, aber wie viele Kommunen sind denn eigentlich schon wie weit ausgebaut? Also sind das nur einige große oder sind tatsächlich schon auch ländliche Räume schon ausgebaut? Und auch da gibt's große Unterschiede zwischen den Ländern.\n\nAlso einfach faszinierend auch zu sehen, wie unterschiedlich und wie vielfältig die Entwicklung in den Ländern passiert Und eine Handlungsempfehlung kann ich gar nicht so genau sagen. Ich hab mich ja vor allem mit der Verwaltung befasst und da gibt's im Moment ja ganz viele Ideen, was anders gemacht werden kann. Also dieses 1 für Alle Prinzip, dass sich Leistungen in einem Land entwickel und die anderen können es nachnutzen. Dieses, also kurz heißt das Eva Prinzip, dass darüber nachgedacht wird, das zu reformieren. Es gibt die Idee 1 Deutschland Stacks, also dass sich irgendwelche Infrastrukturen oder auch Dienste, so genau ist das alles noch gar nicht klar, zentral bereitstelle.\n\nUnd da Also das sind grade ganz viele neue Überlegungen im Raum und genau, ich bin erst mal vor allem neugierig und gespannt, wie die sich dann in der Praxis auswirken werden und ob die dann vielleicht tatsächlich, ja, die Dynamik im Bereich der digitalen Verwaltung noch mal erhöhen können.\n\nSpeaker 0: Deutschland ist also digitaler geworden und darf noch digitaler werden. Das hör ich jetzt so raus, das nehme ich mit. Das war Reestart digital, der Podcast des Kompetenzzentrums öffentlicher IT. Ganz herzlichen Dank an meine Kuros, Nicolopialer und Jan Dennis Guns.\n\nSpeaker 2: Danke schön.\n\nSpeaker 1: Danke dir.\n\nSpeaker 0: Und falls euch der Podcast gefallen hat, folgt uns kostenfrei auf Spotify, Apple Podcast und vielen weiteren Apps. Tschüs und bis bald, ich bin Philipp 1.", "paragraphs": [ { "sentences": [ { "text": "Wie digital ist Deutschland wirklich und wie steht es die Länder im Vergleich, wenn es Glasfaserausbau, Telemedizin oder digitale Verwaltungsdienste geht?", "start": 1.36, "end": 11.46 }, { "text": "Antworten liefert der Deutschlandindex der Digitalisierung 20 25 vom Kompetenzzentrum öffentlicher IT.", "start": 12.0, "end": 18.755001 }, { "text": "Alle 2 Jahre werden darin Daten und Zahlen zum Stand der Digitalisierung zusammengetragen und ausgewertet.", "start": 19.215, "end": 24.835 }, { "text": "Neben der Infrastruktur und dem digitalen Leben geht es dabei auch die digitale Verwaltung.", "start": 25.75, "end": 30.33 }, { "text": "Und das darf ich schon mal spoilern, in einigen Bereichen, da hat sich wirklich was getan.", "start": 30.630001, "end": 35.13 } ], "start": 1.36, "end": 35.13, "num_words": 78.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Was genau, das finden wir heute in dieser Podcastfolge heraus.", "start": 35.59, "end": 38.97 }, { "text": "Herzlich willkommen beim öFIT Podcast restart digital, eine Produktion des Fraunhofer Instituts für offene Kommunikationssysteme.", "start": 48.164997, "end": 54.63 }, { "text": "Ich bin Philipp 1 und ich begrüße hier im Studio in Berlin Tegel meine beiden Co Hosts.", "start": 56.050003, "end": 60.870003 }, { "text": "Zum einen Nicole Opiala, sie ist stellvertretende Leiterin des Kompetenzzentrums öffentlicher IT und forscht zu soziotechnischen Trends an der Schnittstelle zwischen Gesellschaft, Verwaltung und Politik.", "start": 61.49, "end": 72.185 }, { "text": "Nicole ist heute nicht im Studio, sondern sie ist uns online zugeschaltet aus Oldenburg.", "start": 72.645, "end": 76.985 } ], "start": 35.59, "end": 76.985, "num_words": 81.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Hallo Nicole.", "start": 77.045, "end": 77.705 } ], "start": 77.045, "end": 77.705, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Hallo Philipp.", "start": 78.244995, "end": 79.065 } ], "start": 78.244995, "end": 79.065, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Hier aber wirklich vor Ort ist Jan Dennis Gumpz.", "start": 80.03, "end": 82.45 }, { "text": "Er ist Data Scientist am Kompetenzzentrum öffentlicher IT und seine Arbeitsschwerpunkte liegen im Bereich der Trendforschung und in der Auswertung und Aufbereitung von Daten.", "start": 82.509995, "end": 92.189995 }, { "text": "Dennis, da bist Du natürlich genau richtig beim Deutschlandindex.", "start": 92.189995, "end": 94.61 } ], "start": 80.03, "end": 94.61, "num_words": 42.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Danke, ja, guten Tag.", "start": 95.095, "end": 96.555 } ], "start": 95.095, "end": 96.555, "num_words": 4.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Zunächst mal hatten wir uns ja vor 2 Jahren schon über den Deutschlandindex, den damaligen Deutschlandindex der Digitalisierung unterhalten.", "start": 97.494995, "end": 104.475 }, { "text": "So ganz grob, was hat sich seitdem getan, was euch beide wirklich überrascht hat?", "start": 104.695, "end": 109.994995 } ], "start": 97.494995, "end": 109.994995, "num_words": 33.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Da gibt's ganz viele Aspekte.", "start": 112.450005, "end": 114.21 }, { "text": "Der Deutschlandindex ist ja wirklich umfangreich.", "start": 114.21, "end": 116.15 }, { "text": "Wir gucken uns da fast 50 verschiedene Kennzahlen an in verschiedenen Bereichen der Digitalisierung und überraschende Entwicklungen gibt's eigentlich an vielen Stellen.", "start": 116.29, "end": 128.765 }, { "text": "Beispielsweise fand ich auch sehr überraschend, dass der Glasfaserausbau tatsächlich sehr rasant vorangeschritten ist.", "start": 129.465, "end": 136.925 }, { "text": "Das Ziel, 50 Prozent der Haushalte bis Ende diesen Jahres anzuschließen, rückt tatsächlich in greifbare Nähe, also ist 'n sehr schöner Erfolg.", "start": 137.38501, "end": 145.78 } ], "start": 112.450005, "end": 145.78, "num_words": 69.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also schnelles Internet für alle, das ist tatsächlich ja 'n Stück weit weitergegangen.", "start": 145.92, "end": 149.86 } ], "start": 145.92, "end": 149.86, "num_words": 13.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Genau.", "start": 151.975, "end": 152.21501 }, { "text": "Und auf der anderen Seite haben wir auch Entwicklungen, wo es vielleicht 'n bisschen nach unten geht, beispielsweise was die Kompetenzen angeht, was ich auch überraschend fand, denn die Nutzung von digitalen Möglichkeiten auch im Alltag, die steigt eigentlich grundsätzlich.", "start": 152.21501, "end": 170.23001 }, { "text": "Das ist ja immer son bisschen, wir gucken ja auch auf die verschiedenen Ländern, natürlich ist das auch nicht in allen Ländern gleich, aber im Bereich der digitalen Basiskompetenzen, also beispielsweise Personen, die von sich selbst sagen, dass es ihnen leicht fällt, ein Programm zu installieren, sich anonym im Netz zu bewegen oder auch eine Sicherheitskopie von Daten anzufertigen.", "start": 171.49, "end": 193.5 }, { "text": "Da sehen wir beispielsweise Rückgänge und das finde ich schon 'n ganz interessanten Kontrast, dass die Nutzung auf der einen Seite steigt, aber die Kompetenzen oder auf jeden Fall dieses Selbstbewusstsein, dass man diese Kompetenzen hat, abnimmt.", "start": 194.04, "end": 208.39499 } ], "start": 151.975, "end": 208.39499, "num_words": 137.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mhm, okay.", "start": 209.015, "end": 209.735 }, { "text": "Ja, da werden wir uns vielleicht noch mal drüber unterhalten, das noch mal vertiefen, Dennis gibt's irgendwas, was dich wirklich überrascht hat an dem neuen Zahlen, an dem Deutschlandindex?", "start": 209.735, "end": 218.75 } ], "start": 209.015, "end": 218.75, "num_words": 31.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Eine Sache, die mich überrascht hat, war, wir haben über die vergangenen Jahre immer so beobachtet, dass die Unterschiede zwischen den Bundesländern tendenziell immer 'n bisschen kleiner werden und zumindest im Bereich digitales Leben gibt es jetzt einzelne Indikatoren und dadurch auch 'n Gesamtindex, so eine Entwicklung, wo die sich eher 'n bisschen auseinanderentwickeln.", "start": 219.05, "end": 239.625 }, { "text": "Das heißt, sie sind weiter verteilt über einen Wertebereich.", "start": 240.80501, "end": 244.02501 }, { "text": "Das heißt, die Unterschiede werden sind in den letzten 2 Jahren scheinbar etwas größer geworden zwischen den Bundesländern.", "start": 245.15001, "end": 250.61 }, { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 250.75, "end": 251.25 } ], "start": 219.05, "end": 251.25, "num_words": 82.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und da kann man gar nicht unbedingt sagen zwischen Stadt und Land, sondern ganz allgemein, da gibt's 'n paar Bundesländer, die sind haben sich ganz gut entwickelt und andere sind eher abgehängt.", "start": 251.95001, "end": 259.89 }, { "text": "Also auch da werden wir gleich noch mal genauer drüber sprechen.", "start": 259.995, "end": 262.815 }, { "text": "Der Deutschlandindex, der setzt ja jedes Mal verschiedene Schwerpunkte und auch Themenfelder.", "start": 263.435, "end": 267.375 }, { "text": "Diesmal sind Themenfelder Infrastruktur, digitales Leben und digitale Verwaltung, aber auch KI spielt eine Rolle.", "start": 267.675, "end": 273.675 }, { "text": "Damit habt ihr euch ja auch befasst, oder?", "start": 273.675, "end": 275.455 } ], "start": 251.95001, "end": 275.455, "num_words": 78.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, genau.", "start": 276.53, "end": 277.35 }, { "text": "Wir haben der der Entwicklung im Bereich KI, insbesondere generative KI Rechnung getragen, indem wir in unsere große Bevölkerungsbefragung diesmal 'n paar Fragen zur KI reingenommen haben, insbesondere halt wie häufig wird so was bereits genutzt und wofür?", "start": 277.97, "end": 294.92502 } ], "start": 276.53, "end": 294.92502, "num_words": 40.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also werfen wir zunächst mal 'n genaueren Blick auf das Thema Infrastruktur.", "start": 296.265, "end": 299.405 }, { "text": "Nicole, Du hast ja schon gesagt, der Indexwert, den berechnet ihr ja für Infrastruktur 20 25, der ist in allen Bundesländern gestiegen, insbesondere liegt das auch am Glasfaserausbau.", "start": 301.065, "end": 311.16003 }, { "text": "Da soll bis Ende 20 25 mindestens 50 Prozent aller Haushalte versorgt werden mit Glasfaser.", "start": 311.7, "end": 317.32 }, { "text": "Klappt das?", "start": 317.54, "end": 318.18002 }, { "text": "Ist das überhaupt möglich?", "start": 318.18002, "end": 319.40002 } ], "start": 296.265, "end": 319.40002, "num_words": 61.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Es rückt tatsächlich in greifbare Nähe.", "start": 320.90503, "end": 323.40503 }, { "text": "Wir haben die Daten von Mitte 20 24, da lagen wir bundesweit bei 37.5 Prozent, Ende 20 24 jetzt bei knapp 40 Prozent.", "start": 324.42502, "end": 335.80502 }, { "text": "Also ob jetzt die letzten 10 Prozentpunkte noch gewuppt werden können das Ende diesen Jahres, das ist jetzt son bisschen Rätselraten, aber auf jeden Fall sind wir knapp davor, tatsächlich dieses Ziel zu erreichen.", "start": 336.31, "end": 348.33 }, { "text": "Und das ist ja schon sehr beeindruckend, wenn man sich auch beispielsweise die Entwicklung anguckt in anderen Bereichen der Infrastruktur.", "start": 348.78497, "end": 355.685 }, { "text": "Auch da gibt's politische Zielsetzungen, beispielsweise Breitband mit 50 Mbit pro Sekunde, da sollte ein Vollausbau, also 100 Prozent aller Haushalte können diese Bandbreiten erhalten, schon 20 18 erreicht sein.", "start": 356.06497, "end": 370.49002 } ], "start": 320.90503, "end": 370.49002, "num_words": 113.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Da sind wir immer noch nicht, auch 7 Jahre später noch nicht, aber in fast allen Ländern haben wir inzwischen 95 Prozent aller Haushalte mit 50 Mbit pro Sekunde versorgt und das zeigt auch son bisschen, wenn man von Vollausbau spricht, dann ist eine 100 Prozent eher nicht erreichbar.", "start": 371.03, "end": 395.47 }, { "text": "Also Vollausbau bedeutet schon eher über 95 Prozent, aber nicht unbedingt 100 Prozent, denn es gibt immer sehr abgelegene Liegenschaften.", "start": 395.93, "end": 405.035 }, { "text": "Also wir sprechen wirklich nicht von Orten oder Ortsteilen, sondern wirklich einzelnen Liegenschaften, die dann sehr schwierig und unter sehr hohem Aufwand nur anzuschließen sind und bei denen dann tatsächlich es vielleicht sinnvoller ist zu überlegen, mit welchen alternativen Technologien Richtfunk, Satellit, Mobilfunk und so weiter, die angeschlossen werden können.", "start": 405.095, "end": 426.68 }, { "text": "Und das ist vielleicht auch ganz wichtig im Hinterkopf zu behalten, wenn man jetzt auf den Vollausbau Glasfaser schielt, der dann 20 30 erreicht werden soll.", "start": 426.68, "end": 435.425 } ], "start": 371.03, "end": 435.425, "num_words": 145.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 435.485, "end": 435.985 }, { "text": "Jetzt kann man ja auch noch mal schauen, wo genau klappt's denn mit dem Ausbau gut?", "start": 436.525, "end": 440.04498 }, { "text": "Also ich wohn jetzt selbst in Berlin, da wurde auch vorm meiner Haustür kräftig gebuddelt und irgendwelche Glasfaserleitungen wurden da verlegt, denkt man natürlich, na gut, also grad in großen Städten, da ist man da vielleicht 'n bisschen schneller.", "start": 440.04498, "end": 452.49 }, { "text": "Ist das denn so?", "start": 452.49, "end": 453.29 }, { "text": "Gibt's tatsächlich da 'n Vorteil in den Städten gegenüber den ländlichen Kommunen?", "start": 453.29, "end": 457.63 } ], "start": 435.485, "end": 457.63, "num_words": 72.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, interessanterweise nicht.", "start": 458.575, "end": 460.335 }, { "text": "Und was wir, ich muss sagen, in den Anfangszeiten des Deutschlandindex ja oft beobachtet haben, das war son West Ost Gefälle zwischen den Ländern und eben auch eine Stadt Land Gefälle.", "start": 460.335, "end": 473.375 }, { "text": "Also in den Anfangstagen, da waren eigentlich die Stadtstaaten immer unaufholbar an der Spitze in fast allen Bereichen und dieses Bild hat sich zunehmend aufgelöst, grade auch bei der Infrastruktur sieht man das.", "start": 473.375, "end": 486.95 }, { "text": "Also Ost West ist da ein wesentliches Unterscheidungsmerkmal mehr, beispielsweise beim Glasfaser und Stadt Land tatsächlich auch nicht.", "start": 486.95, "end": 496.745 }, { "text": "Also wir haben große Städte, die sehr gut versorgt sind, aber genauso gut auch große Städte, die deutlich unter dem bundesweiten Schnitt liegen.", "start": 496.745, "end": 506.59998 } ], "start": 458.575, "end": 506.59998, "num_words": 108.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 507.46, "end": 507.96 }, { "text": "Was ich auch noch ganz interessant fand, ist, dass viele private Nutzer*innen ganz offensichtlich an diesem Glasfaserausbau überhaupt kein Interesse haben.", "start": 508.58, "end": 515.835 }, { "text": "Die sind mit ihrem DSL- und Kabelanschluss eigentlich ganz zufrieden.", "start": 516.155, "end": 518.97504 }, { "text": "Wird da vielleicht an den Bedürfnissen von Menschen vorbeigebaut?", "start": 519.11505, "end": 522.17505 } ], "start": 507.46, "end": 522.17505, "num_words": 41.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das ist tatsächlich noch ein Problem, dass die Nachfrage theoretischen Versorgbarkeit noch hinterherhinkt.", "start": 525.515, "end": 532.47003 }, { "text": "Also wir haben da noch eine große Spanne zwischen den Homes past, also da läuft irgendwo eine Leitung vorbei und Homes connectet, die also tatsächlich auch den Anschluss haben und genau, die Nutzung ist dann auch noch mal eine andere Frage.", "start": 533.17, "end": 546.075 }, { "text": "Das liegt einfach daran, dass für die derzeit gängigen Anwendungen in vielen Fällen eben Kabel oder DSL noch ausreichend sind.", "start": 546.775, "end": 555.355 }, { "text": "Aber wenn wir uns die Entwicklung anschauen, dann kommen da schon zunehmend auch im Nutzungsverhalten natürlich Anwendungen und Technologien, die auch höhere Ansprüche an die Infrastruktur stellen.", "start": 555.65497, "end": 571.05 }, { "text": "Also das ist sozusagen im Moment vielleicht noch 'n bisschen Investition in die Zukunft, aber wenn man sich die Entwicklung anschaut, durchaus notwendig und auch auf politischer Ebene gibt's ja beispielsweise die EU hat auch vor, die Kupfernetze komplett abzuschalten im Jahr 20 30.", "start": 571.05, "end": 590.84 } ], "start": 525.515, "end": 590.84, "num_words": 145.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also der Trend geht schon ganz klar hin zu Glasfaser.", "start": 591.38, "end": 595.56 }, { "text": "Und den sollte man auch nicht verschlafen, auch wenn man im Moment vielleicht sagt, na ja gut, mit dem, was ich so tagtäglich mache, brauche ich das vielleicht noch nicht unbedingt.", "start": 596.02, "end": 604.695 }, { "text": "Noch nicht.", "start": 605.315, "end": 606.055 } ], "start": 591.38, "end": 606.055, "num_words": 43.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, das ist ja genau der der Punkt, ne.", "start": 606.275, "end": 608.03503 }, { "text": "Also die Politik macht ja auch Druck von anderer Seite.", "start": 608.03503, "end": 610.59503 }, { "text": "Man möchte Kupfernetze abschalten, Dennis ist das eine gute Idee?", "start": 610.59503, "end": 614.375 } ], "start": 606.275, "end": 614.375, "num_words": 29.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ich weiß nicht, ob es eine gute Idee ist, Kupfernetze abzuschalten, aber ich wollte eher bei der Glasfaser noch mal einhaken.", "start": 615.98004, "end": 623.84 }, { "text": "Es gibt, glaube ich, sogar fast global den Trend, zum Beispiel zum Videostreaming statt zum Fernsehen und gerade da beobachten wir ja, dass es immer höhere Auflösungen angeboten werden und sicherlich irgendwann dann auch nachgefragt werden.", "start": 625.74005, "end": 641.975 }, { "text": "Also ich glaub schon, dass dass das, auch wenn die Nachfrage jetzt noch nicht da ist, das doch sinnvoll ist, Glasfaser auszubauen, weil ja, ich glaub, das wird dann eingeholt dadurch.", "start": 642.195, "end": 656.18 } ], "start": 615.98004, "end": 656.18, "num_words": 88.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Na ja, in der Tat.", "start": 656.64, "end": 657.44 }, { "text": "Also ich nutz ja auch ganz gerne und ich dreh immer im Kreis, wenn's dann anfängt zu ruckeln und man kann praktisch nix machen.", "start": 657.44, "end": 662.815 }, { "text": "Wahrscheinlich ist dann irgendwann die Geschwindigkeit einfach zu langsam, wenn alle drauf zugreifen oder?", "start": 662.815, "end": 666.915 } ], "start": 656.64, "end": 666.915, "num_words": 43.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das würde ich vermuten, ja.", "start": 666.975, "end": 668.59503 } ], "start": 666.975, "end": 668.59503, "num_words": 5.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Nicole, schauen wir noch mal aufs Mobilfunknetz.", "start": 670.015, "end": 671.715 }, { "text": "Die vier-g-Versorgung, die ist ja nahezu flächendeckend.", "start": 672.41003, "end": 675.15 }, { "text": "Die Abdeckung mit 5 g, die hat sich stark verbessert als Vierfach am ICE.", "start": 675.53, "end": 680.57 }, { "text": "Da bekomme ich davon leider nicht so viel mit.", "start": 680.57, "end": 682.17004 }, { "text": "Da ruckelt's auf ganzer Strecke, könnte man sagen, wo muss ich dann noch was tun?", "start": 682.17004, "end": 686.27 } ], "start": 670.015, "end": 686.27, "num_words": 52.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, ich find's auch immer erstaunlich, dass wir, wenn man sich die Versorgung eigentlich anguckt mit 5 G, da auch bei eigentlich in allen Ländern mindestens 90 Prozent Flächenabdeckung tatsächlich der kompletten Fläche.", "start": 687.485, "end": 703.08 }, { "text": "Da zählt alles dazu, auch jedes Naturschutzgebiet, auch jede Bahnstrecke liegen und", "start": 703.08, "end": 708.7 } ], "start": 687.485, "end": 708.7, "num_words": 45.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "man", "start": 709.0, "end": 709.24005 } ], "start": 709.0, "end": 709.24005, "num_words": 1.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "es dann trotzdem immer mal wieder doch schafft, in so ein Funkloch hineinzugeraten.", "start": 709.24005, "end": 714.06 } ], "start": 709.24005, "end": 714.06, "num_words": 13.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Kommen wir mal zum nächsten Themenfeld, nämlich digitales Leben.", "start": 716.03503, "end": 719.49506 }, { "text": "Da erschafft ihr auch einen Index erstellt, auch wieder für dieses Jahr und diesen Index, der basiert auf 1 repräsentativen Bevölkerungsbefragung mit über 5800 Teilnehmenden.", "start": 720.03503, "end": 731.85004 }, { "text": "Die wird auch regelmäßig durchgeführt, zuletzt Ende 20 24, also mal zu erklären, wo die Daten eigentlich überhaupt herkommen.", "start": 732.31, "end": 738.09 }, { "text": "Und da gibt's zunächst mal 'n positives Ergebnis, nämlich die Nutzung von Telemedizin.", "start": 738.55005, "end": 742.54504 }, { "text": "Die hat sich stark erhöht von 5.1 Prozent in 20 20 auf 13.5 Prozent in 20 24.", "start": 743.24506, "end": 751.10504 } ], "start": 716.03503, "end": 751.10504, "num_words": 83.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Wo läuft's da besonders gut mit der Telemedizin, Dennis?", "start": 752.04504, "end": 755.10504 } ], "start": 752.04504, "end": 755.10504, "num_words": 9.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ich glaube, hier gibt es einfach tatsächlich eine große Nachfrage, weil man kann das auch beobachten, dass es vor allem jüngere Menschen sind, die das stärker nachfragen oder stärker nutzen und ich vermute einfach, das hängt ganz stark damit zusammen, dass die sowieso digital affiner sind und dann halt nicht zum Beispiel beim Arzt sitzen wollen im im Sprechzimmer oder im Warteraum, sondern zeitsparend das tatsächlich erledigen wollen.", "start": 756.82, "end": 785.8 }, { "text": "Ich vermute auch, dass gerade während der Coronapandemie, ich weiß es jetzt schon 'n bisschen her, aber da dann halt auch wahrscheinlich viele Ärzte und Ärztinnen, ja, überhaupt das Angebot erst geschaffen haben mit Videosprechstunden und Ähnlichem.", "start": 785.86, "end": 801.045 }, { "text": "Genau, aber das scheint angenommen zu werden.", "start": 801.665, "end": 804.645 } ], "start": 756.82, "end": 804.645, "num_words": 112.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, ich find mich da ganz gut wieder.", "start": 804.945, "end": 806.465 }, { "text": "Also ich nutz auch Telemedizin gelegentlich, gerade wenn's da ich sag mal, Lapalien geht, Verwaltung, was auch immer.", "start": 806.465, "end": 813.70996 }, { "text": "Man braucht irgend 'n Schein oder so.", "start": 813.76996, "end": 815.13 }, { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 815.13, "end": 815.20996 }, { "text": "Ich muss da nicht extra hin.", "start": 815.20996, "end": 816.25 } ], "start": 804.945, "end": 816.25, "num_words": 40.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das ist ja wirklich schon sehr praktisch.", "start": 816.25, "end": 817.63 }, { "text": "Allerdings will man ja mit Telemedizin auch gerade eine ältere Zielgruppe erreichen im ländlichen Raum, ja?", "start": 818.08997, "end": 824.205 }, { "text": "Da die Versorgung sicherzustellen, aber gerade der ländliche Raum, der wirkt dann noch ein bisschen abgehängt, hab ich bei euch gelesen.", "start": 824.445, "end": 830.705 }, { "text": "Wie kann man da vielleicht Angebote noch attraktiver machen?", "start": 831.565, "end": 834.54504 } ], "start": 816.25, "end": 834.54504, "num_words": 53.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ich würde es nicht sagen, tatsächlich abgehängt, sondern eher auf dem auf dem gleichen Niveau.", "start": 834.92004, "end": 839.72003 }, { "text": "Wie kann man das attraktiver machen?", "start": 839.72003, "end": 841.5 }, { "text": "Ich bin mir da gar nicht so sicher, ob man das machen kann, weil das Angebot ist letzten Endes, glaube ich, da.", "start": 841.72003, "end": 848.2 }, { "text": "Ich weiß jetzt nicht, ob es so ist, dass gerade Ärzte im ländlichen Raum, die normalerweise auch der Hausarzt wären, ob die das vielleicht seltener anbieten.", "start": 848.2, "end": 857.155 }, { "text": "Das könnte eine Ursache sein, aber ich hab mich jetzt nicht genau mit den Ursachen davon beschäftigt tatsächlich.", "start": 857.295, "end": 868.06 } ], "start": 834.92004, "end": 868.06, "num_words": 87.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Schauen wir uns mal 'n anderen Punkt an, nämlich der Anteil der online engagierten Internetnutzenden.", "start": 870.04, "end": 875.5 }, { "text": "Der ist nach einem Rückgang kurzzeitigen 20 23 auf einen neuen Höchststand gestiegen.", "start": 876.12, "end": 881.41504 }, { "text": "13 Prozent, die sich regelmäßig online engagieren, wie es so heißt, also es betrifft Wikipedia Artikel, Open Source Software, die programmiert wird, offene Lernmaterialien.", "start": 882.43506, "end": 891.575 }, { "text": "Was ist da geschehen?", "start": 892.3, "end": 893.36 } ], "start": 870.04, "end": 893.36, "num_words": 56.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, erst mal finde ich das eine eine sehr positive Entwicklung.", "start": 894.54004, "end": 897.60004 }, { "text": "Auch hier ist es relativ schwierig zu sagen, worauf das jetzt genau zurückzuführen ist.", "start": 898.46, "end": 903.68 }, { "text": "Ich hab verschiedene Rechnungen angestellt, eine Ursache zu finden.", "start": 903.98004, "end": 907.845 }, { "text": "Das konnte ich leider nicht identifizieren.", "start": 908.625, "end": 910.245 } ], "start": 894.54004, "end": 910.245, "num_words": 40.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also als wir diesen Rückgang beobachtet haben, dann war unsere erste Interpretation natürlich, okay, während der Coronapandemie, man war auf jeden Fall eingeschränkter in den Möglichkeiten, sich im Analogen zu engagieren.", "start": 911.58496, "end": 926.74 }, { "text": "Deswegen hat sich da vielleicht das Engagement ins digitale Ädern eher verlagert und Post Corona dann ein Rückgang, weil dann jetzt die Personen dann doch sich lieber wieder direkt vor Ort engagieren.", "start": 927.92, "end": 940.725 }, { "text": "Und dadurch, dass die Zahlen jetzt aber gestiegen sind und tatsächlich auf einen auf einen Höchststand, also auch höher als während Corona sozusagen, sehen wir, dass diese Interpretation tatsächlich dann eher nicht getragen hat, sondern dass das auch ein Nebeneinander ist und dass auch jetzt nach Corona, wo es wieder möglich ist, sich vor Ort zu engagieren, digitales Engagement trotzdem weiter einen wichtigen Platz in der Gesellschaft und im Bereich gesellschaftliches Engagement einnimmt.", "start": 941.425, "end": 970.555 } ], "start": 911.58496, "end": 970.555, "num_words": 136.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das heißt, durch Corona ist es einfach gewachsen son Stück weit und hört jetzt ein dazu ganz normal, wie auch 'n Engagement die Ecke.", "start": 970.85504, "end": 977.275 } ], "start": 970.85504, "end": 977.275, "num_words": 24.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das finden Genau.", "start": 978.51, "end": 979.15 }, { "text": "Leider eine, ja, ich find's leider 'n bisschen eine schwierige Aussage, weil wir tatsächlich keine Zahlen vor Corona haben.", "start": 979.23, "end": 986.19 }, { "text": "Die erste Bevölkerungsbefragung, die haben wir 2020 gemacht.", "start": 986.19, "end": 989.97 }, { "text": "Dementsprechend haben wir den Vergleich zu zuvor einfach nicht.", "start": 990.645, "end": 993.60504 }, { "text": "Ich könnte mir auch vorstellen, dass diese Informationsbereitstellung einfach im Internet einfach eine größere Rolle spielt und deshalb vielleicht es mehr Engagement gibt.", "start": 993.60504, "end": 1003.625 } ], "start": 978.51, "end": 1003.625, "num_words": 62.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Warum es dann den den kleinen Rückgang 2022 gab.", "start": 1003.85004, "end": 1008.73004 }, { "text": "Jetzt den Höchststand lässt sich damit allerdings immer noch nicht so gut erklären.", "start": 1008.73004, "end": 1012.27 } ], "start": 1003.85004, "end": 1012.27, "num_words": 22.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 1012.49, "end": 1012.99 } ], "start": 1012.49, "end": 1012.99, "num_words": 1.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Aber es ist tatsächlich ja was, was wir in allen Bereichen, korrigier mich, Dennis, in allen Bereichen des Engagements eigentlich tatsächlich beobachtet haben, dass es in allen Bereichen, die wir uns angeschaut haben, einen Anstieg gegeben hat.", "start": 1014.01, "end": 1028.3351 }, { "text": "Und das betrifft, wenn man so möchte, auch Partizipation in der eigenen Gemeinde.", "start": 1028.7151, "end": 1035.1499 }, { "text": "Also Personen, die sich beispielsweise an Planungsverfahren in ihrer Gemeinde online beteiligen oder auch über Onlinemängelnmelder Vorschläge machen oder Müll oder Sonstiges im öffentlichen Raum melden und damit dazu beitragen, dass die Gemeinde Bescheid weiß, wo sie vielleicht aktiv werden müsste oder könnte.", "start": 1035.9299, "end": 1057.995 }, { "text": "In der Beziehung zur zur eigenen Gemeindeverwaltung sehen wir auch, dass da auch das Engagement gestiegen ist.", "start": 1058.6599, "end": 1065.08 } ], "start": 1014.01, "end": 1065.08, "num_words": 110.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Da schauen wir auch gleich noch mal genauer hin, nämlich in die digitale Verwaltung.", "start": 1066.34, "end": 1069.0599 }, { "text": "Das ist ja auch 'n Thema, das ihr genau untersucht habt.", "start": 1069.0599, "end": 1071.86 }, { "text": "Vorher machen wir noch eine kleine Abwägung.", "start": 1071.86, "end": 1073.5599 }, { "text": "K I, grad generative K I, das ist auch Gegenstand gewesen.", "start": 1073.995, "end": 1077.355 }, { "text": "Was habt ihr da rausgefunden?", "start": 1077.355, "end": 1078.495 } ], "start": 1066.34, "end": 1078.495, "num_words": 48.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Zum einen, was was ich schon überraschend fand, war, dass die Nutzung von generativer K I innerhalb der Bevölkerung noch gar nicht so groß ist Und das, obwohl natürlich jedes Smartphone mittlerweile mit, hier ist generative KI drin beworben wird.", "start": 1080.475, "end": 1094.98 }, { "text": "Wofür KI genutzt wird, das ist vielleicht gar nicht so überraschend, wenn man die Beschwerden von Hochschulprofessorinnen und Professoren und Lehrerinnen und Lehrern hört, nämlich dass es vor allem im Bereich Ausbildung zum Einsatz kommt und gar nicht so sehr bei Unterhaltung und für oder für andere Zwecke.", "start": 1094.98, "end": 1112.985 } ], "start": 1080.475, "end": 1112.985, "num_words": 88.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 1114.485, "end": 1114.5651 }, { "text": "Ja, kann man gut nachvollziehen, ne.", "start": 1114.5651, "end": 1116.245 }, { "text": "Also grade für die Vorbereitung von wahrscheinlich Hausarbeiten Rechercheaufgaben, da wird KI sicher gerne genutzt.", "start": 1116.245, "end": 1123.016 }, { "text": "Nur tatsächlich interessant die Zahlen, wenn man schaut, wer insgesamt denn zu KI greift.", "start": 1123.016, "end": 1127.8 }, { "text": "Das sind weniger als die Hälfte der Internetnutzenden, die überhaupt KI verwenden und nur ein Viertel mindestens einmal im Monat.", "start": 1127.8, "end": 1134.3 } ], "start": 1114.485, "end": 1134.3, "num_words": 56.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Verschlafen wir da grad in Deutschland einen Trend?", "start": 1134.5951, "end": 1136.775 } ], "start": 1134.5951, "end": 1136.775, "num_words": 8.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Da wäre ich mir nicht sicher.", "start": 1138.3551, "end": 1139.8151 }, { "text": "Ich glaube, weil gerade wurden ja die diese primären Einsatzzwecke von KI beschrieben und ich glaube, die Leute verwenden es einfach dafür, wo es nützlich ist.", "start": 1139.9551, "end": 1151.2999 }, { "text": "Das heißt, ich glaube nicht, dass da ein Trend verschlafen wird.", "start": 1151.2999, "end": 1153.88 }, { "text": "Ausbildung, dann vielleicht auch noch Beruf.", "start": 1154.1, "end": 1156.44 }, { "text": "Als jetzt ChatGPT das erste Mal veröffentlicht worden ist, dann war das hochinteressant, auch zu Unterhaltungszwecken sich damit auszutauschen, aber ich glaub, das nutzt sich einfach ab.", "start": 1156.9, "end": 1167.0549 } ], "start": 1138.3551, "end": 1167.0549, "num_words": 76.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 1167.0549, "end": 1167.455 } ], "start": 1167.0549, "end": 1167.455, "num_words": 1.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ich zum Beispiel hab jetzt außerhalb des Berufs nicht ständig das Bedürfnis, generative KI zu nutzen.", "start": 1167.455, "end": 1174.815 }, { "text": "Wozu?", "start": 1174.815, "end": 1175.315 }, { "text": "Das heißt, ich glaube nicht, dass ein ein Trend hier verschlafen wird.", "start": 1175.6, "end": 1178.8201 } ], "start": 1167.455, "end": 1178.8201, "num_words": 29.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also einmal ist es ganz spannend, sich mit ChatGPT zu unterhalten, aber nachm fünfzehnten oder zwanzigsten Mal, dann lässt der Reiz auch nach.", "start": 1179.04, "end": 1185.7001 } ], "start": 1179.04, "end": 1185.7001, "num_words": 23.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das wäre meine Vermutung, ja.", "start": 1185.76, "end": 1187.46 } ], "start": 1185.76, "end": 1187.46, "num_words": 5.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ihr habt, fand ich interessant, auch gefragt, wie optimistisch die Befragten gegenüber Neuerungen durch KI sind.", "start": 1188.255, "end": 1194.975 }, { "text": "Was ist da das Ergebnis?", "start": 1194.975, "end": 1196.355 } ], "start": 1188.255, "end": 1196.355, "num_words": 21.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Es wird vor allem ein positiver Einfluss grade auf Bildung und Forschung erwartet, was sich dann auch mit dem Ergebnis deckt, dass generative KI vor allem für Ausbildung und Beruf genutzt wird.", "start": 1198.255, "end": 1211.55 }, { "text": "Gleichzeitig sind die Erwartungen gerade so gesamtgesellschaftlich eher negativ, wenn es zum Beispiel den Zusammenhalten der Gesellschaft geht und auch Wohlstand und Wohlstandsverteilung.", "start": 1213.13, "end": 1224.1849 }, { "text": "Wobei ganz interessant war, dass gerade unter denjenigen, die generative KI schon häufiger nutzen, diese Erwartungen generell positiver sind.", "start": 1225.605, "end": 1235.5901 }, { "text": "Das heißt, vor allem diejenigen, die generative KI selten nutzen, erwarten auch tendenziell negativere Auswirkungen.", "start": 1235.5901, "end": 1244.97 } ], "start": 1198.255, "end": 1244.97, "num_words": 89.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Kommen wir doch mal zum letzten Themenfeld der digitalen Verwaltung.", "start": 1247.4249, "end": 1251.605 }, { "text": "Da fand ich ganz spannend, dass ihr festgestellt habt, dass diese Effekte des Onlinezugangsgesetzes, wir hatten uns darüber auch schon mal hier in diesem Podcast unterhalten, dass die sichtbar werden.", "start": 1253.0249, "end": 1263.12 }, { "text": "Also im Mai 20 25, das war son Bezugszeitraum, den ihr euch mal angeschaut habt, da standen im Schnitt für 227 Verwaltungsleistungen Onlinedienste flächendeckend zur Verfügung und das sind 68 mehr als 2 Jahre zuvor.", "start": 1263.58, "end": 1278.2749 }, { "text": "Liegt das nur an dem Gesetz oder woran vielleicht noch, Nicole?", "start": 1278.815, "end": 1282.9149 } ], "start": 1247.4249, "end": 1282.9149, "num_words": 86.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Na, ich wollte noch ergänzen, dass die Erwartung der Auswirkungen von KI übrigens auch bei der öffentlichen Verwaltung positiver waren.", "start": 1284.1749, "end": 1293.4099 }, { "text": "Also da wird auf jeden Fall von den Bürgerinnen und Bürgern auch noch großes Potenzial gesehen, KI in der öffentlichen Verwaltung zu nutzen.", "start": 1294.4299, "end": 1302.5299 }, { "text": "Aber genau, was Du angesprochen hast, ja das Onlinezugangsgesetz hatte ja eigentlich oder die ursprüngliche Frist, sagen wir's so, war eigentlich bis Ende 20 22 alle 575 Leistungen digital anzubieten.", "start": 1303.3099, "end": 1320.2351 }, { "text": "Das heißt also, dass ich als Bürger, Bürgerin einen Onlinezugang dazu habe.", "start": 1320.6951, "end": 1326.06 }, { "text": "Du hast grade schon gesagt, jetzt im Mai waren's 227 Leistungen im Schnitt in den Ländern.", "start": 1326.28, "end": 1333.66 } ], "start": 1284.1749, "end": 1333.66, "num_words": 101.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Da sind wir von 575 noch 'n ganzes Stück entfernt und 20 22 ist auch schon 'n bisschen länger her.", "start": 1334.12, "end": 1341.2051 } ], "start": 1334.12, "end": 1341.2051, "num_words": 20.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das heißt, der Anstieg, der klingt besser, als er letztendlich insgesamt ist, ne, wenn man sich total anschaut, was erreicht werden könnte, ja?", "start": 1341.665, "end": 1347.8451 } ], "start": 1341.665, "end": 1347.8451, "num_words": 23.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, das das UZG war einfach ein ein sehr ambitioniertes Vorhaben.", "start": 1347.9851, "end": 1352.76 }, { "text": "Es war eigentlich auch schon relativ früh klar, dass das wahrscheinlich nicht erreicht werden kann, aber es hat auch durch die die erste Frist beispielsweise natürlich ganz klare Anreize gesetzt und die Verwaltung motiviert.", "start": 1353.22, "end": 1371.5149 }, { "text": "Obwohl diese Frist jetzt verstrichen ist, ist das OZG ja immer noch in Kraft.", "start": 1371.975, "end": 1376.1349 }, { "text": "Das heißt, dieses Ziel, auch wenn's jetzt keine so klare Frist mehr gibt, alle Leistungen digital anzubieten, das besteht auch weiterhin.", "start": 1376.1349, "end": 1385.12 }, { "text": "Dazu kommen auch auf EU Ebene jetzt noch verschiedene andere Regelungen, die das auch erforderlich machen würden.", "start": 1385.5, "end": 1392.515 } ], "start": 1347.9851, "end": 1392.515, "num_words": 97.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Da müssen wir jetzt vielleicht gar nicht so gar nicht so tief drauf eingehen.", "start": 1392.655, "end": 1395.795 }, { "text": "Aber wie Du schon gesagt hast, der Anstieg auch innerhalb von 2 Jahren, der ist doch durchaus noch beachtlich, auch wenn das Ziel genau noch nicht erreicht ist.", "start": 1396.655, "end": 1408.62 }, { "text": "Und das da sieht man also, dass dieses OZG und diese Verpflichtung, die damit geschaffen wurde, auch nach Fristende immer noch diese Zugwirkung hat, weitere Leistungen digital anzubieten.", "start": 1409.08, "end": 1421.745 }, { "text": "Was wir allerdings dabei sehen, ist, dass die Unterschiede der Länder da relativ groß sind.", "start": 1422.125, "end": 1428.785 }, { "text": "Also wir haben das Dashboard digitale Verwaltung des inzwischen BMDS.", "start": 1429.885, "end": 1435.11 } ], "start": 1392.655, "end": 1435.11, "num_words": 95.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Da kann man sich angucken, für wie viele dieser OZG Leistungen Onlinedienste in den Ländern schon flächendeckend zur Verfügung stehen.", "start": 1436.53, "end": 1445.51 }, { "text": "Und da haben wir noch relativ große Unterschiede.", "start": 1446.465, "end": 1449.045 }, { "text": "Also Hamburg ist hier Spitzenreiter oder war Spitzenreiter im Mai 20 25.", "start": 1449.505, "end": 1453.845 }, { "text": "Da ist relativ viel Dynamik drin, muss ich tatsächlich sagen.", "start": 1454.385, "end": 1456.945 }, { "text": "Also es lohnt sich schon fast monatlich, da mal in die Daten reinzugucken, weil sich da doch immer wieder auch was ändert.", "start": 1456.945, "end": 1462.52 } ], "start": 1436.53, "end": 1462.52, "num_words": 72.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ach so schnell.", "start": 1462.52, "end": 1463.08 }, { "text": "Ändert sich da tatsächlich auch das Angebot, ja?", "start": 1463.08, "end": 1465.26 } ], "start": 1462.52, "end": 1465.26, "num_words": 11.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, tatsächlich, genau.", "start": 1466.44, "end": 1467.88 } ], "start": 1466.44, "end": 1467.88, "num_words": 3.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja.", "start": 1467.88, "end": 1468.38 } ], "start": 1467.88, "end": 1468.38, "num_words": 1.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und haben also zu dem Mai hatte Hamburg, ich glaube eineinhalb Mal so viele Leistungen im Angebot etwa wie wie das Schlusslicht und in der Dynamik sehen wir da auch sehr große Unterschiede.", "start": 1468.76, "end": 1480.045 }, { "text": "Also Hamburg, aber auch Sachsen Anhalt beispielsweise haben in den letzten 2 Jahren für über 90 OZG Leistungen Onlinedienste flächendeckend ausgerollt.", "start": 1480.045, "end": 1491.11 }, { "text": "In anderen Ländern waren's im gleichen Zeitraum nicht einmal halb so viele.", "start": 1491.65, "end": 1495.1901 }, { "text": "Also da ist viel Bewegung drin und das ist Auf der einen Seite kann man sagen, ja gut, eigentlich war ja mal das Ziel auch mit dem UZG, wir haben eine Nachnutzung, ein Land entwickelt mal was und die anderen können es dann nachnutzen und dann müsste es ja relativ gleich sein zwischen den Ländern.", "start": 1495.65, "end": 1513.2251 }, { "text": "Das mit der Nachnutzung stößt an viele Probleme, das ist auch schon relativ tiefgehend analysiert worden von verschiedenen Seiten.", "start": 1513.64, "end": 1522.6201 } ], "start": 1468.76, "end": 1522.6201, "num_words": 140.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Aber durch diese hohe Dynamik ist das jetzt gar nicht so gesetzt.", "start": 1523.4801, "end": 1528.5651 }, { "text": "Da kann man jetzt nicht sagen, okay, jetzt haben wir aber die Spitzenreiter und die Schlusslichter und irgendwie, das ist auch so fest, ne, da da ändert sich wenig, sondern wir sehen auch in den letzten, wenn man das vergleicht mit 20 23 Länder, die eher in der Schlussgruppe waren, die sind inzwischen irgendwo im Mittelfeld gelandet und umgekehrt.", "start": 1528.5651, "end": 1548.1 }, { "text": "Also da passiert im Moment tatsächlich noch richtig, richtig viel im Bereich OZG Leistung.", "start": 1548.96, "end": 1554.42 } ], "start": 1523.4801, "end": 1554.42, "num_words": 85.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Was ich mich halt frage, also ihr habt ja auch geschaut, wie wird das Angebot eigentlich angenommen, ne?", "start": 1556.255, "end": 1560.9751 }, { "text": "Also der Anteil der Nutzenden an diesen Onlineverwaltungsleistung, der ist gar nicht mal unbedingt gestiegen.", "start": 1560.9751, "end": 1567.2151 }, { "text": "Der ist eher gleich geblieben, ne?", "start": 1567.2151, "end": 1568.9751 }, { "text": "Also ungefähr genauso viele Leute, die ihre Anträge oder Formulare online übermitteln.", "start": 1568.9751, "end": 1573.0701 }, { "text": "Ich frag mich halt warum, ne.", "start": 1575.53, "end": 1576.7301 } ], "start": 1556.255, "end": 1576.7301, "num_words": 57.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also ich find das ja 'n super Service, wenn ich nicht zum Amt muss, sondern das online machen kann.", "start": 1576.7301, "end": 1580.7301 }, { "text": "Ist das vielleicht das falsche Angebot oder gibt's da Barrieren, die den Zugang erschweren?", "start": 1580.7301, "end": 1584.51 } ], "start": 1576.7301, "end": 1584.51, "num_words": 33.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Wir haben uns auch gedacht, wenn ich ein ein steigendes Angebot habe, dann müssten doch auch immer mehr Menschen das für sie passende Angebot auch online finden können und nutzen können.", "start": 1585.105, "end": 1595.5249 }, { "text": "Also warum hat sich der Anteil der Nutzenden da nicht wesentlich erhöht?", "start": 1595.825, "end": 1601.04 }, { "text": "Genau und das kann natürlich ja an an ganz verschiedenen Gründen liegen, aber unsere Interpretation an der Stelle ist, dass es Personen gibt, die nutzen Onlineverwaltungsleistungen und wenn's wenn dann noch mehr Leistungen online verfügbar sind, dann freuen sie sich und dass sie die dann auch noch nutzen können und es gibt aber auch Gruppen, die nutzen es eben nicht.", "start": 1602.38, "end": 1622.0 }, { "text": "Dass es eine grade eine Herausforderung ist, hier neue nutzenden Gruppen auch zu gewinnen für hier neue nutzenden Gruppen auch zu gewinnen für Onlineverwaltungsleistung.", "start": 1622.0, "end": 1629.99 }, { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 1631.01, "end": 1631.51 } ], "start": 1585.105, "end": 1631.51, "num_words": 128.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Auf der anderen Seite ist ja vielleicht auch eine Diskrepanz, es gibt immer mehr Nutzer*innen, die sich zum Beispiel mit ihrer EID, also mit ihrem Personalausweis online ausweisen oder auch Chatmöglichkeiten mit Verwaltungsmitarbeitenden nutzen.", "start": 1632.77, "end": 1645.715 }, { "text": "Also diese, ich sag mal, Basic Angebote, die werden ja doch stärker wahrgenommen.", "start": 1645.935, "end": 1649.955 } ], "start": 1632.77, "end": 1649.955, "num_words": 47.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, genau, das steigt, aber das sind ja eher so begleitende Services, sag ich mal und wenn man sich das anguckt, also von den Bürgerinnen und Bürgern, die tatsächlich auch ein Verwaltungsanliegen hatten Innerhalb des letzten Jahres haben im Schnitt 2 Drittel tatsächlich, also 66 Prozent, dann auch Formulare oder Anträge online an die Verwaltung übermittelt.", "start": 1652.19, "end": 1680.5651 }, { "text": "Und die Zahlen für solche Basiskomponenten, wie Du sie grade genannt hast, die liegen ja noch weit darunter.", "start": 1682.23, "end": 1687.61 }, { "text": "Also ich müsste jetzt noch mal reingucken, aber ich glaube, EID, na, sind wir bei einem Viertel oder auch bei bei Chatmöglichkeiten mit Verwaltungsmitarbeitenden, da sehen wir ein Wachstum, eigentlich auch ein stetiges Wachstum, aber die Zahlen liegen noch deutlich darunter.", "start": 1688.3099, "end": 1707.2051 }, { "text": "Also das sind dann eher Dienste, die ich vielleicht mitnutze, wenn ich ohnehin ein Onlineverwaltungsanliegen grade grade grade abwickeln möchte, dass ich mich vorher per Chat oder auch wenns 'n Chatbot gibt mit dem Chatbot erkundige, was ich dafür brauche, an wen ich mich da wenden muss oder dass ich dann auch, wenn's die Möglichkeit gibt, online den Status einsehe oder mich eben mit meiner EID authentifizieren kann, diesen Onlinedienst überhaupt nutzen zu können.", "start": 1707.265, "end": 1738.965 }, { "text": "Also das sind eher so begleitende Komponenten und wie gesagt, da ist die Nutzung doch noch deutlich geringer.", "start": 1739.2001, "end": 1746.02 } ], "start": 1652.19, "end": 1746.02, "num_words": 207.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also 'n Angebot für Leute, die schon gewonnen sind, die auch schon online unterwegs sind in der Verwaltung, die nehmen das dann noch sozusagen mit?", "start": 1746.3201, "end": 1752.5 } ], "start": 1746.3201, "end": 1752.5, "num_words": 25.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das wäre eine Interpretation, das haben wir uns tatsächlich in in in dem Detail gar nicht angeschaut bisher.", "start": 1753.705, "end": 1760.0449 }, { "text": "Also die Daten, die sind so unglaublich umfangreich, dass man tatsächlich da leider gar nicht alles immer bis ins Letzte für alle Gruppen auch auswerten kann.", "start": 1760.9049, "end": 1770.91 }, { "text": "Deswegen genau.", "start": 1771.29, "end": 1773.9501 } ], "start": 1753.705, "end": 1773.9501, "num_words": 46.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Was ihr abgefragt habt, ist, wie zufrieden die Leute sind mit ihrer elektronischen Verwaltung sozusagen, wo aber auch Verbesserungspotenziale sind.", "start": 1774.0901, "end": 1782.795 }, { "text": "Was hat diese Abfrage ergeben?", "start": 1782.9551, "end": 1784.5751 } ], "start": 1774.0901, "end": 1784.5751, "num_words": 25.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, auch da war mir son bisschen überrascht, dass es ein sehr konstantes Antwortverhalten gab.", "start": 1785.3551, "end": 1793.515 }, { "text": "Also wenn man die Zahlen vergleicht mit den Zahlen von vor 2 Jahren, dann hat sich da quasi gar nichts verändert, was in dem Fall nicht unbedingt schlecht ist, denn die Zufriedenheit mit dem Onlineangebot der eigenen Stadt oder Gemeinde ist tatsächlich eher hoch.", "start": 1793.515, "end": 1811.8301 }, { "text": "Grade was die Auffindbarkeit von Informationen und Leistungen angeht oder auch die Bedienbarkeit des Onlineangebots.", "start": 1812.335, "end": 1818.355 }, { "text": "Da sagen so etwa 70 Prozent, dass sie damit eher oder auch voll und ganz zufrieden sind.", "start": 1819.135, "end": 1825.635 }, { "text": "Ein bisschen weniger sind es dann schon, die sagen, dass sie viele Verwaltungsleistungen auch online nutzen können und dafür eben nicht aufs Amt müssen, aber es sind auch immer noch mehr als die Hälfte, die das sagen.", "start": 1826.6599, "end": 1838.76 } ], "start": 1785.3551, "end": 1838.76, "num_words": 128.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und ein bisschen weniger sind es auch, die sagen, dass sie zum zuständigen Onlinedienst weitergeleitet werden, wenn ihre eigene Stadt oder Gemeinde eine Leistung eben nicht selbst online anbietet.", "start": 1839.285, "end": 1850.985 }, { "text": "Also genau, da sind die Zahlen noch ein bisschen geringer und das ist bei einem relativ komplexen föderalen System, wie wir es ja haben, eigentlich schon auch ganz wichtig, weil als Bürger, Bürger*in, woher soll ich denn jetzt wissen, wo ich meinen Wohngeldantrag zu stellen habe, ob das bei meiner Gemeinde ist, beim Kreis, vielleicht gibt's auch noch eine weitere Einheit wie eine Verwaltungsgemeinschaft oder so.", "start": 1851.54, "end": 1877.49 }, { "text": "Also mich da erst mal durchzufinden, dann ist es natürlich sehr hilfreich, wenn diese Angebote untereinander auch verknüpft sind.", "start": 1878.05, "end": 1886.87 } ], "start": 1839.285, "end": 1886.87, "num_words": 114.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Wenn wir jetzt mal 'n Fazit ziehen, so ganz unterm Strich, kann man sagen jetzt anhand eures Deutschlandindex, dass Deutschland digitaler geworden ist.", "start": 1888.53, "end": 1896.215 }, { "text": "Also mit einem Anstieg des Gesamtindex, den er ja auch berechnet, 8.6 Prozent seit 20 23.", "start": 1896.215, "end": 1902.315 }, { "text": "Das ist ja doch 'n relativ deutliches Zeichen.", "start": 1902.855, "end": 1905.0349 }, { "text": "Auf der anderen Seite gilt das eben nicht für alle Leistungen und auch nicht in allen Regionen gleichermaßen.", "start": 1905.91, "end": 1910.17 }, { "text": "Das war jetzt so mein Fazit, dass ich für mich mitgenommen hab.", "start": 1910.79, "end": 1913.83 } ], "start": 1888.53, "end": 1913.83, "num_words": 77.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Was ist euer Fazit?", "start": 1913.83, "end": 1914.79 }, { "text": "Was nehmt ihr mit aus dem diesjährigen Deutschlandindex, Dennis?", "start": 1914.79, "end": 1917.93 } ], "start": 1913.83, "end": 1917.93, "num_words": 13.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Fällt tatsächlich genauso aus bei mir, dass es Es gab 'n leichten Anstieg, aber der betrifft nicht alle Bundesländer gleich.", "start": 1918.965, "end": 1926.8049 }, { "text": "Teilweise gibt's gibt's halt auch diese diese größere Spreizung zwischen den Bundesländern.", "start": 1926.8049, "end": 1932.105 } ], "start": 1918.965, "end": 1932.105, "num_words": 32.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 1933.36, "end": 1933.52 }, { "text": "Nicole, was nimmst Du mit?", "start": 1933.52, "end": 1935.22 } ], "start": 1933.36, "end": 1935.22, "num_words": 6.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also signitaler ist ist Deutschland auf jeden Fall geworden.", "start": 1936.1599, "end": 1940.5 }, { "text": "Grade in manchen Bereichen, also Infrastruktur, da hat's wirklich enorme Anstiege gegeben, haben wir ja am Anfang ja schon besprochen, aber auch im Bereich der Verwaltung mit den mit den OZG Leistungen beispielsweise.", "start": 1941.2, "end": 1954.9149 }, { "text": "Was ich, genau, was ich son bisschen für mich mitgenommen habe, ist, dass dieser diese Angebote steigen.", "start": 1956.255, "end": 1961.7 }, { "text": "Also ich hab besseres Infrastrukturangebot, ich hab 'n größeres Angebot an Onlineverwaltungsleistung, aber diese die Nutzung sich tatsächlich eher sehr langsam ändert.", "start": 1961.76, "end": 1976.125 }, { "text": "Also da sehen wir gar nicht sone große Veränderung.", "start": 1976.505, "end": 1979.245 } ], "start": 1936.1599, "end": 1979.245, "num_words": 90.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Digitales Leben haben wir auch tatsächlich die ja die geringste Veränderung von allen unseren Themenbereichen, die wir uns anschauen und dass einfach so Verhalten und Gewohnheiten sich dann doch deutlich langsamer wandeln und diesen Änderungen im Angebot, die teilweise doch sehr schnell gehen können, son bisschen hinterherhinken.", "start": 1979.7051, "end": 2002.18 }, { "text": "Und mit Blick auf Politik, wenn dann auch gewisse Maßnahmen beispielsweise evaluiert werden sollen, wie ist denn die Wirkung von gewissen Maßnahmen, von gewissen Angeboten, die geschaffen worden sind, dass man das auch im Hinterkopf behalten muss, dass man da einfach auch 'n längeren Atem braucht und sich vielleicht auch längere Zeiträume anschauen muss, bis sich dann tatsächlich auch in im Verhalten in der in der Nutzung eine Änderung zeigt.", "start": 2002.935, "end": 2032.44 }, { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 2032.74, "end": 2033.24 } ], "start": 1979.7051, "end": 2033.24, "num_words": 118.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Was ihr ja auch mitgebt mit dem Deutschlandindex ist sone Art Handlungsempfehlung für Politik, für Gesellschaft.", "start": 2034.005, "end": 2040.105 }, { "text": "Gibt's da etwas, was ihr als Handlungsempfehlung noch unbedingt loswerden möchtet?", "start": 2040.485, "end": 2045.865 } ], "start": 2034.005, "end": 2045.865, "num_words": 27.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also ich hab tatsächlich eine aus dem Bereich digitales Leben, weil es dann doch einen starken auffälligen Rückgang gab bei der Anfertigung von Sicherheitskopien.", "start": 2047.15, "end": 2058.85 }, { "text": "Das heißt, da wär's vielleicht gut, die Bevölkerung noch mal stärker für die Notwendigkeit dieser Sicherheitskopien zu sensibilisieren.", "start": 2060.585, "end": 2068.9248 } ], "start": 2047.15, "end": 2068.9248, "num_words": 42.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also mehr Sicherheitskopien, einfach weil Daten angreifbar sind, abgeschöpft werden können und da ist es ganz gut, eine Kopie zu haben?", "start": 2070.4248, "end": 2078.2302 } ], "start": 2070.4248, "end": 2078.2302, "num_words": 21.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Klar, ja und man macht sich dann zum Beispiel auch nicht erpressbar durch ja Erpressungssoftware.", "start": 2078.77, "end": 2083.75 }, { "text": "Das betrifft jetzt noch nicht mal nur Privatpersonen, sondern auch wenn diese Privatpersonen natürlich auf der Arbeit sind, dann Weil ich glaub schon, dass dass solche Gewohnheiten wahrscheinlich nicht nur privat oder nicht nur beruflich existieren, sondern wahrscheinlich auch ja, eine Gewohnheit insgesamt sind, dass man Sicherheitskopien anfertigt.", "start": 2084.77, "end": 2104.5398 } ], "start": 2078.77, "end": 2104.5398, "num_words": 63.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Nicole, hast Du eine Handlungsempfehlung für Politik, Verwaltung, aber vielleicht auch für die Hörerinnen und Hörer?", "start": 2105.88, "end": 2110.5398 } ], "start": 2105.88, "end": 2110.5398, "num_words": 16.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, was mich auch son bisschen überrascht hat oder was ich son bisschen aus dem Index mitnehme, nämlich wie unterschiedliche Wege die Länder auch teilweise gehen oder wie unterschiedlich sie sich entwickeln.", "start": 2110.8398, "end": 2122.635 }, { "text": "Auch da OZG oder auch Glasfaserausbau sind da ganz gute Beispiele, das hatten wir noch gar nicht angesprochen.", "start": 2124.215, "end": 2130.32 }, { "text": "Wir gucken uns im Bereich Infrastruktur haben wir diesmal erstmalig son Gerechtigkeitsindex berechnet, bei dem wir uns nämlich anschauen, okay, beim Glasfaserausbau steht das Land als ganze so da, aber wie viele Kommunen sind denn eigentlich schon wie weit ausgebaut?", "start": 2130.38, "end": 2148.5352 }, { "text": "Also sind das nur einige große oder sind tatsächlich schon auch ländliche Räume schon ausgebaut?", "start": 2148.8352, "end": 2155.3499 }, { "text": "Und auch da gibt's große Unterschiede zwischen den Ländern.", "start": 2155.97, "end": 2159.5898 } ], "start": 2110.8398, "end": 2159.5898, "num_words": 114.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also einfach faszinierend auch zu sehen, wie unterschiedlich und wie vielfältig die Entwicklung in den Ländern passiert Und eine Handlungsempfehlung kann ich gar nicht so genau sagen.", "start": 2159.73, "end": 2171.7551 }, { "text": "Ich hab mich ja vor allem mit der Verwaltung befasst und da gibt's im Moment ja ganz viele Ideen, was anders gemacht werden kann.", "start": 2171.7551, "end": 2180.715 }, { "text": "Also dieses 1 für Alle Prinzip, dass sich Leistungen in einem Land entwickel und die anderen können es nachnutzen.", "start": 2180.715, "end": 2187.4102 }, { "text": "Dieses, also kurz heißt das Eva Prinzip, dass darüber nachgedacht wird, das zu reformieren.", "start": 2188.27, "end": 2193.73 }, { "text": "Es gibt die Idee 1 Deutschland Stacks, also dass sich irgendwelche Infrastrukturen oder auch Dienste, so genau ist das alles noch gar nicht klar, zentral bereitstelle.", "start": 2194.51, "end": 2207.2249 } ], "start": 2159.73, "end": 2207.2249, "num_words": 110.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und da Also das sind grade ganz viele neue Überlegungen im Raum und genau, ich bin erst mal vor allem neugierig und gespannt, wie die sich dann in der Praxis auswirken werden und ob die dann vielleicht tatsächlich, ja, die Dynamik im Bereich der digitalen Verwaltung noch mal erhöhen können.", "start": 2208.325, "end": 2231.605 } ], "start": 2208.325, "end": 2231.605, "num_words": 50.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Deutschland ist also digitaler geworden und darf noch digitaler werden.", "start": 2233.4248, "end": 2237.505 }, { "text": "Das hör ich jetzt so raus, das nehme ich mit.", "start": 2237.505, "end": 2240.005 }, { "text": "Das war Reestart digital, der Podcast des Kompetenzzentrums öffentlicher IT.", "start": 2240.6902, "end": 2244.6902 }, { "text": "Ganz herzlichen Dank an meine Kuros, Nicolopialer und Jan Dennis Guns.", "start": 2244.6902, "end": 2248.31 } ], "start": 2233.4248, "end": 2248.31, "num_words": 41.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Danke schön.", "start": 2248.77, "end": 2249.59 } ], "start": 2248.77, "end": 2249.59, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Danke dir.", "start": 2249.8901, "end": 2250.7102 } ], "start": 2249.8901, "end": 2250.7102, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und falls euch der Podcast gefallen hat, folgt uns kostenfrei auf Spotify, Apple Podcast und vielen weiteren Apps.", "start": 2251.1702, "end": 2257.645 }, { "text": "Tschüs und bis bald, ich bin Philipp 1.", "start": 2257.7852, "end": 2260.0452 } ], "start": 2251.1702, "end": 2260.0452, "num_words": 26.0, "speaker": 0 } ] }, "entities": null, "translations": null, "topics": null } ], 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Ja, ich find mich da ganz gut wieder. Also ich nutz auch Telemedizin gelegentlich, gerade wenn's da ich sag mal,", "words": [ { "word": "genau", "start": 801.665, "end": 802.145, "confidence": 0.98583984, "punctuated_word": "Genau,", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.72588503 }, { "word": "aber", "start": 802.145, "end": 802.645, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "aber", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.72588503 }, { "word": "das", "start": 802.785, "end": 803.025, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "das", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.72588503 }, { "word": "scheint", "start": 803.025, "end": 803.425, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "scheint", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.72588503 }, { "word": "angenommen", "start": 803.425, "end": 803.925, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "angenommen", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.72588503 }, { "word": "zu", "start": 803.985, "end": 804.145, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "zu", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.72588503 }, { 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Man braucht irgend 'n Schein oder so. Mhm. Ich muss da nicht extra hin. Das ist ja wirklich schon sehr praktisch.", "words": [ { "word": "was", "start": 812.81, "end": 812.97, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "was", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.95845515 }, { "word": "auch", "start": 812.97, "end": 813.20996, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "auch", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.95845515 }, { "word": "immer", "start": 813.20996, "end": 813.70996, "confidence": 0.9436035, "punctuated_word": "immer.", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.95845515 }, { "word": "man", "start": 813.76996, "end": 813.85, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "Man", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.5798517 }, { "word": "braucht", "start": 813.85, "end": 814.17, "confidence": 0.9970703, "punctuated_word": "braucht", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.5798517 }, { "word": "irgend", "start": 814.17, "end": 814.41, "confidence": 0.93603516, "punctuated_word": "irgend", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.5798517 }, { "word": "'n", "start": 814.41, 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Da die Versorgung sicherzustellen, aber gerade der ländliche Raum, der wirkt dann noch ein bisschen abgehängt, hab ich bei euch gelesen.", "words": [ { "word": "im", "start": 822.685, "end": 823.005, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "im", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 1.0 }, { "word": "ländlichen", "start": 823.005, "end": 823.48505, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "ländlichen", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 1.0 }, { "word": "raum", "start": 823.48505, "end": 823.98505, "confidence": 0.87109375, "punctuated_word": "Raum,", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 1.0 }, { "word": "ja", "start": 824.04504, "end": 824.205, "confidence": 0.710083, "punctuated_word": "ja?", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 1.0 }, { "word": "da", "start": 824.445, "end": 824.78503, "confidence": 0.9980469, "punctuated_word": "Da", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 1.0 }, { "word": "die", "start": 824.78503, "end": 825.125, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "die", "speaker": 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Ja, kann man gut nachvollziehen, ne. 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Nur tatsächlich interessant die Zahlen, wenn man schaut, wer insgesamt denn zu KI greift. 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Verschlafen wir da grad in Deutschland einen Trend?", "words": [ { "word": "die", "start": 1130.2, "end": 1130.36, "confidence": 0.98828125, "punctuated_word": "die", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "überhaupt", "start": 1130.36, "end": 1130.86, "confidence": 0.9941406, "punctuated_word": "überhaupt", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "ki", "start": 1130.92, "end": 1131.42, "confidence": 0.95410156, "punctuated_word": "KI", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "verwenden", "start": 1131.48, "end": 1131.8, "confidence": 0.984375, "punctuated_word": "verwenden", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "und", "start": 1131.8, "end": 1131.96, "confidence": 0.9482422, "punctuated_word": "und", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "nur", "start": 1131.96, "end": 1132.12, "confidence": 0.9902344, "punctuated_word": "nur", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "ein", "start": 1132.12, "end": 1132.36, "confidence": 0.9951172, "punctuated_word": "ein", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "viertel", "start": 1132.36, "end": 1132.68, "confidence": 0.9863281, "punctuated_word": "Viertel", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "mindestens", "start": 1132.68, "end": 1133.18, "confidence": 0.9614258, "punctuated_word": "mindestens", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "einmal", "start": 1133.24, "end": 1133.48, "confidence": 0.96435547, "punctuated_word": "einmal", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "im", "start": 1133.48, "end": 1133.8, "confidence": 0.9980469, "punctuated_word": "im", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "monat", "start": 1133.8, "end": 1134.3, "confidence": 0.99658203, "punctuated_word": "Monat.", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "verschlafen", "start": 1134.5951, "end": 1135.0951, "confidence": 0.97094727, "punctuated_word": "Verschlafen", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "wir", "start": 1135.155, "end": 1135.3151, "confidence": 0.9980469, "punctuated_word": "wir", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "da", "start": 1135.3151, "end": 1135.395, "confidence": 0.99609375, "punctuated_word": "da", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "grad", "start": 1135.395, "end": 1135.635, "confidence": 0.56640625, "punctuated_word": "grad", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "in", "start": 1135.635, "end": 1135.7151, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "in", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "deutschland", "start": 1135.7151, "end": 1136.035, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "Deutschland", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "einen", "start": 1136.035, "end": 1136.275, "confidence": 0.5600586, "punctuated_word": "einen", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 }, { "word": "trend", "start": 1136.275, "end": 1136.775, "confidence": 0.99853516, "punctuated_word": "Trend?", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.9900898 } ], "speaker": 0, "id": "e0656c72-9689-4c82-a5e5-20cab448b511" }, { "start": 1138.3551, "end": 1140.775, "confidence": 0.97052, "channel": 0, "transcript": "Da wäre ich mir nicht sicher. 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Also der Anteil der Nutzenden", "words": [ { "word": "was", "start": 1556.255, "end": 1556.3351, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "Was", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6509128 }, { "word": "ich", "start": 1556.3351, "end": 1556.495, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "ich", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6509128 }, { "word": "mich", "start": 1556.495, "end": 1556.5751, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "mich", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6509128 }, { "word": "halt", "start": 1556.5751, "end": 1556.895, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "halt", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6509128 }, { "word": "frage", "start": 1556.895, "end": 1557.375, "confidence": 0.9645996, "punctuated_word": "frage,", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6509128 }, { "word": "also", "start": 1557.375, "end": 1557.615, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "also", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6509128 }, { "word": "ihr", "start": 1557.615, "end": 1557.6951, "confidence": 0.9790039, "punctuated_word": "ihr", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6509128 }, { "word": "habt", "start": 1557.6951, "end": 1557.8551, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "habt", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.86217016 }, { "word": "ja", "start": 1557.8551, "end": 1558.015, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "ja", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.86217016 }, { "word": "auch", "start": 1558.015, "end": 1558.255, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "auch", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.86217016 }, { "word": "geschaut", "start": 1558.255, "end": 1558.755, "confidence": 0.9926758, "punctuated_word": "geschaut,", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.86217016 }, { "word": "wie", "start": 1558.895, "end": 1559.055, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "wie", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.86217016 }, { "word": "wird", "start": 1559.055, "end": 1559.2151, "confidence": 0.9951172, "punctuated_word": "wird", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.86217016 }, { "word": "das", "start": 1559.2151, "end": 1559.535, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "das", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.86217016 }, { "word": "angebot", "start": 1559.535, "end": 1559.935, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "Angebot", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.86217016 }, { "word": "eigentlich", "start": 1559.935, "end": 1560.3351, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "eigentlich", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.86217016 }, { "word": "angenommen", "start": 1560.3351, "end": 1560.8151, "confidence": 0.9238281, "punctuated_word": "angenommen,", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.86217016 }, { "word": "ne", "start": 1560.8151, "end": 1560.9751, "confidence": 0.77685547, "punctuated_word": "ne?", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.86217016 }, { "word": "also", "start": 1560.9751, "end": 1561.135, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "Also", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.81794834 }, { "word": "der", "start": 1561.135, "end": 1561.375, "confidence": 0.68359375, "punctuated_word": "der", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.81794834 }, { "word": "anteil", "start": 1561.375, "end": 1561.615, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "Anteil", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.81794834 }, { "word": "der", "start": 1561.615, "end": 1561.8551, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "der", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.81794834 }, { "word": "nutzenden", "start": 1561.8551, "end": 1562.3551, "confidence": 0.9904785, "punctuated_word": "Nutzenden", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.81794834 } ], "speaker": 0, "id": "fb09f7db-6cd6-45bc-abf3-0f37e653c484" }, { "start": 1562.8151, "end": 1563.795, "confidence": 0.9564616, "channel": 0, "transcript": "an diesen Onlineverwaltungsleistung,", "words": [ { "word": "an", "start": 1562.8151, "end": 1563.055, "confidence": 0.99121094, "punctuated_word": "an", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.81794834 }, { "word": "diesen", "start": 1563.055, "end": 1563.295, "confidence": 0.9941406, "punctuated_word": "diesen", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.81794834 }, { "word": "onlineverwaltungsleistung", "start": 1563.295, "end": 1563.795, "confidence": 0.8840332, "punctuated_word": "Onlineverwaltungsleistung,", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.81794834 } ], "speaker": 0, "id": "6cc0f00b-2283-4191-a579-751023acf9f9" }, { "start": 1565.135, "end": 1573.0701, "confidence": 0.9719922, "channel": 0, "transcript": "der ist gar nicht mal unbedingt gestiegen. Der ist eher gleich geblieben, ne? Also ungefähr genauso viele Leute, die ihre Anträge oder Formulare online übermitteln.", "words": [ { "word": "der", "start": 1565.135, "end": 1565.4551, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "der", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6855114 }, { "word": "ist", "start": 1565.4551, "end": 1565.6951, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "ist", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6855114 }, { "word": "gar", "start": 1565.6951, "end": 1565.8551, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "gar", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6855114 }, { "word": "nicht", "start": 1565.8551, "end": 1566.015, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "nicht", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6855114 }, { "word": "mal", "start": 1566.015, "end": 1566.3351, "confidence": 0.99316406, "punctuated_word": "mal", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6855114 }, { "word": "unbedingt", "start": 1566.3351, "end": 1566.8351, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "unbedingt", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6855114 }, { "word": "gestiegen", "start": 1566.895, "end": 1567.2151, "confidence": 0.89575195, "punctuated_word": "gestiegen.", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6855114 }, { "word": "der", "start": 1567.2151, "end": 1567.4551, "confidence": 0.98828125, "punctuated_word": "Der", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7754809 }, { "word": "ist", "start": 1567.4551, "end": 1567.535, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "ist", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7754809 }, { "word": "eher", "start": 1567.535, "end": 1567.775, "confidence": 0.9941406, "punctuated_word": "eher", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7754809 }, { "word": "gleich", "start": 1567.775, "end": 1568.015, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "gleich", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7754809 }, { "word": "geblieben", "start": 1568.015, "end": 1568.515, "confidence": 0.94628906, "punctuated_word": "geblieben,", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7754809 }, { "word": "ne", "start": 1568.7351, "end": 1568.9751, "confidence": 0.69506836, "punctuated_word": "ne?", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7754809 }, { "word": "also", "start": 1568.9751, "end": 1569.2151, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "Also", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7754809 }, { "word": "ungefähr", "start": 1569.2151, "end": 1569.7151, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "ungefähr", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7754809 }, { "word": "genauso", "start": 1570.01, "end": 1570.41, "confidence": 0.9838867, "punctuated_word": "genauso", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7754809 }, { "word": "viele", "start": 1570.41, "end": 1570.5701, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "viele", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7754809 }, { "word": "leute", "start": 1570.5701, "end": 1570.81, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "Leute,", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7918064 }, { "word": "die", "start": 1570.81, "end": 1570.9701, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "die", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7918064 }, { "word": "ihre", "start": 1570.9701, "end": 1571.2101, "confidence": 0.9770508, "punctuated_word": "ihre", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7918064 }, { "word": "anträge", "start": 1571.2101, "end": 1571.53, "confidence": 0.9770508, "punctuated_word": "Anträge", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7918064 }, { "word": "oder", "start": 1571.53, "end": 1571.6101, "confidence": 0.8691406, "punctuated_word": "oder", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7918064 }, { "word": "formulare", "start": 1571.6101, "end": 1572.1101, "confidence": 0.99121094, "punctuated_word": "Formulare", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7918064 }, { "word": "online", "start": 1572.25, "end": 1572.5701, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "online", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7918064 }, { "word": "übermitteln", "start": 1572.5701, "end": 1573.0701, "confidence": 0.9946289, "punctuated_word": "übermitteln.", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.7918064 } ], "speaker": 0, "id": "5b5acd0e-9492-4dde-a15c-17d32e30066e" }, { "start": 1575.53, "end": 1584.51, "confidence": 0.980018, "channel": 0, "transcript": "Ich frag mich halt warum, ne. Also ich find das ja 'n super Service, wenn ich nicht zum Amt muss, sondern das online machen kann. 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