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Die Registermodernisierung ist vielleicht die Voraussetzung für flächendeckende, komfortabel zu nutzende digitale Verwaltungsangebote und wie weit wir auf dem Weg dahin sind zur Registermodernisierung, darüber sprechen wir heute. Wir haben uns einen besonderen Ort dafür ausgesucht. Wir sind in einem mobilen Studio auf der Smart Country Convention in Berlin. Das ist also eine Liveausgabe von restart digital Und deswegen klingt die Tonqualität ein bisschen anders als gewohnt. Wie gewohnt bin ich Franziska Walser, der Host und sitze hier mit meinen beiden Co Hosts, Professor Peter Pariczek, Leiter des Kompetenzzentrums Öffentlicher IT am Fraunhofer Institut Focus in Berlin und Professor an der Donauuni Krems. Hallo Peter. Hallo Franziska. Und ebenfalls dabei Nicole Opiella, Politologin und stellvertretende Leiterin des Kompetenzzentrums Öffentlicher IT, kurz öfit. Hallo Nicole. Hallo Franziska. Peter, ich weiß nicht, ob Du 'n Typ für Superlative bist, aber ich hab einen früheren Podcast von uns gehört aus dem Jahr 2021, da ging's auch schon Registermodernisierung und da hast Du gesagt, das ist ein Jahrzehnteprojekt. Erinnerst Du dich? Ja. Und war das eine Metapher oder meinen wir das ernst? Dauert das wirklich Jahrzehnte? Viele haben gehofft, dass ich's nicht ernst meine, aber es war damals ernst gemeint, weil's das dickste Brett ist, dass es zu bohren gibt. Ja, viele Beteiligte, Du hast ja schon angesprochen, 10000 Kommunen, da ist viel zu tun und ja, wir mal schauen, wie schnell wir vorankommen. Okay, wenn man sich die Planungen anguckt, dann gehen die auch jetzt schon bis mindestens 20 28. Und wenn wir mal überlegen, wie das alles angefangen hat mit dem UZG, wie lange das gedauert hat, bis wir das Registermodernisierungsgesetz hatten. Also da sind wir ja bei den Zum Beispiel ist das jetzt klar noch. Jetzt klar noch. Das schon rum, mehr oder weniger. Genau, also für ein Jahrzehnt reicht's auf jeden Fall, hoffentlich nicht noch für viele weitere. Ja und es gibt ja auch 'n konkreten Zeitplan mit verschiedenen Schritten, die eben passieren. Da sprechen wir auch später noch mal genauer drüber über den Zeitplan. Jetzt steigen wir mal ein mit einem Beispiel. Ich hab mir rausgesucht, was Romantisches Heirat, also Standesamt. Könnt ihr mal erklären, wie da der Status quo ist und wie es wäre, wenn die Registermodernisierung erfolgreich umgesetzt wäre? Also Status quo erst mal. Bei mir ist länger her, dass ich geheiratet hab. Ich hab auch in Amerika geheiratet. Ich ich weiß es wirklich nicht. Der Status quo ist, dass wir ja das Vergnügen haben, aufs Standesamt, das Lokale zu gehen, da wo wir ursprünglich auch geboren worden sind, also aus der aus der Perspektive und da kann, glaube ich, jeder von uns Anekdoten dazu erzählen. Also ich keine persönliche, aber vom Hören und Sagen gibt's gibt es ja da immer wieder die die schönsten Geschichten, was denn alles passiert, wie aufwendig das ist, diese Nachweise tatsächlich zusammenzutragen, dann zu heiraten und das Ganze setzt sich dann auch noch fort, wenn man Kinder bekommt, weil diese Daten sauber voneinander getrennt an den jeweiligen Lokalen Landesämtern, ja, im Papier, also im im Traumhaften. Also das ist ein richtiges Buch, wo man Jahrhunderte zurückgehen kann in einem gut geführten Standesamt und das Original ist da tatsächlich noch das Papier, das geführt wird und das Elektronische gibt's natürlich auch, ist aber irgendein Abbild davon. Mhm, okay. Also ich muss wirklich physisch in meinen Heimatort fahren oder wenn ich Glück habe, hat der das vielleicht schon digitalisiert? Ich muss auf jeden Fall persönlich auf dem Standesamt erscheinen und ich brauch eben einen aktuellen Auszug aus dem Personenstandsregister und das eben von meinem Geburtsort. Genau, also je nachdem muss ich auf jeden Fall da wieder Kontakt aufnehmen und dafür sorgen, dass ich diese Nachweise dann habe, damit ich überhaupt diese Eheschließung dann anmelden kann. Okay. Und jetzt Registermodernisierung. Das hieße dieses Personenstandsregister heißt das, ne? Mhm. Alles, was da drinsteht, steht auch digital irgendwo in 'ner Akte drin, ja? Exakt. Okay. Das heißt, jede Gemeinde in Deutschland, noch so klein, hat das erst mal überführt. Teilweise ist es schon überführt. Also es ist nicht so, dass wir jetzt damit beginnen müssen, vom Papier alles in die die digitale Welt überzutragen. Kommt auch immer drauf an, muss man dann immer von Fall zu Fall sehr detailliert schauen. Also da gibt's schon elektronische Daten. Die die Frage ist nur, sind die authentisch abgebildet in den digitalen Registern, im Personenstandsregister, wo ich ja dann auch alle zusätzlichen Elemente mit dabei hätte. Also wie hat sich mein Personenstand verändert über die über die Jahre, über die Jahrzehnte? Welche Kinder habe ich bekommen? Also all diese Informationen, die ja sehr vital sind und notwendig sind für jede Art auch von Sozialleistungen, könnten dann voll integriert werden in soziale Transferleistungen beispielsweise. Das ist momentan aktuell leider eben noch nicht der Fall. Und man stellt sich das erst mal sehr einfach vor, ne, weil man sich denkt, okay, na gut, wie viele Felder hat son Formular? Nicht so viele. Mhm. Aber dadurch, dass wir ausm föderalen System kommen, hast Du mir, glaube ich, erklärt, Peter, zum Beispiel, dass bei manchen steht Nachname, bei manchen steht Familienname. Also diese Daten dann in 'n einheitliches Format zu bringen, kann komplexer sein, als man sich das so vorstellt im ersten Moment, ne. Tja, also die die das semantische Problem, das beginnt bei der Sprache und zieht sich natürlich dann auch weiter in die in das digitale Abbild, also wie ist ein Datensatz dann beschrieben und auch wie wie ist organisatorisch geregelt? Also wie können wir dann die Qualität sicherstellen? Also das sind ja alles Punkte, die man auf den unterschiedlichen Schichten bearbeiten muss, also die die sichtbare, also für uns Menschen, jedem für uns Menschen lesbaren Texte, dann in weiterer Folge die organisatorischen Prozesse, die damit verbunden sind, Qualitätssicherung, wer entscheidet am Schluss über die Wahrheit, die gespeichert ist und wie schaut das digitale Abbild aus von der Struktur des Datensatzes und und wie kann der auch abgerufen werden? Halt, ja, durch diese Schichten, Du hast das Brett am Anfang gebracht, durch dieses dicke Brett dieser semantischen Schichten, wo man sich durchbohren und deswegen ja, habe ich auch damals gesagt, das ist 'n Jahrzehnteprojekt. Dickes Brett auch deshalb, weil wir haben über 375 Register. Wir haben allein über 5000 Meldebehörden, die dann ihre eigenen Register führen. Genau, Du hast schon gesagt, das föderale System, wir haben Register auf Bundesebene, auf Länderebene, aber eben auch Fehler auf Kommunenebene und das muss ja hinterher alles irgendwie zusammenspielen können. Genau, Semantik ist ein Problem. Wie sind sind Datenfelder getrennt? Wie sind die benannt? Was habe ich für Systeme? Wie sieht's mit Schnittstellen aus? Also das ist wirklich, ja, deswegen, da ist schon viel Vorarbeit gelaufen, aber da liegt auch noch sehr viel an Arbeit vor und Ja. Und dann wird's ganz einfach, weil nämlich dann gilt das Once only Prinzip. Das ist ja so das führende Prinzip hinter dem Ganzen. Was meint das noch mal? Das heißt eigentlich, dass ich als Bürger, Bürgerin oder auch als Unternehmen Daten, die der Verwaltung eigentlich schon vorliegen, nicht noch einmal beibringen muss. Mhm. Im Moment ist es ja so, wenn ich einen Antrag stelle, muss ich immer wieder meine Bestandsdatennahme, Vorname, Geburtsdatum, Anschrift et cetera. Ich muss das immer wieder neu eingeben, teilweise auf jedem Blatt. Mhm. Und das wäre dann eben nicht notwendig. Ich könnte dann, es wäre dann teilweise vorausgefüllt und eben Nachweise, die der Verwaltung auch schon vorliegen, auch bei 1 anderen Behörde, dass ich zum Beispiel Kinder habe, dass ich verheiratet bin, was mein Einkommen ist und so weiter. Das müsste ich da, da müsste ich dann nicht zu der jeweiligen Behörde gehen und mir eben diese Nachweise ausstellen lassen, sie bei der anderen Behörde wieder einzureichen, sondern ich kann es eben autorisieren, dass diese Nachweise direkt abgerufen werden können über eine einheitliche technische Infrastruktur. Ich kann mir die dann noch mal einmal angucken. Es gibt sone Previewfunktion, kann schauen, ist das tatsächlich alles korrekt und möchte ich auch, dass dieser Nachweis jetzt genutzt werden kann im Rahmen dieses Verfahrens? Und wenn ich das bejaht, dann ist das erledigt, also das kann ich quasi von zu Hause aus machen. Bei der Eheschließung vielleicht nicht, da ist das persönliche Erscheinen im im Stand. Es ist immer noch Es ist zumindest beliebt beieinander, aber wenigstens bei der Beantwortung. Genau, aber bei vielen anderen Verfahren spar ich mir da viel Aufwand und die Behörden untereinander natürlich auch. Ja und damit es aber funktioniert, dieses ones only, also damit ich sozusagen zugeordnet werden kann zu meinen Daten, braucht's ja diese Identifikationsnummer und die war ja 'n sehr heißes Eisen am Anfang und wurde viel diskutiert, vielleicht immer noch sogar, ne. Warum eigentlich? Das geht zurück auf eine eine eine Jahrzehnte lang, also es gibt bis zurück in den in die in die Siebziger-, Achtzigerjahre, Letztes Volkszählungsurteil ist da das Stichwort, ne, genau. Wo es ja große Proteste gab. Wo das erste Mal darüber intensiv nachgedacht wurde, das war so der der Beginn der elektronischen Verwaltung in Deutschland oder auch weltweit, wo man das erste Mal begonnen hat, auf elektronischen Systemen Daten abzubilden und zu verarbeiten. Und damals wollte man damit die Volkszählung digitalisieren zu einem sehr frühen Zeitpunkt. Und damit man das machen kann und sich die Daten von dir Franziska zusammenzuführen, gibt's vielleicht mehrweiser oder auch vielleicht gibt's einen Schreibfehler, nicht? Auch das kann ja passieren. Und dass ich eben hundertprozentig weiß, dass das tatsächlich deine Identität ist und dich die Daten aus den unterschiedlichen Registern zusammenziehen kann, daraus dann eine digitale Volkszählung zu machen, ist das erste Mal die Debatte aufgekommen, dass man so einen eindeutigen Identifier verwendet. Mhm. Und das zieht sich bis heute und wir sind in der Debatte insgesamt weiter, weil wir weil wir's neue Mechanismen gibt, wie man Datenmissbrauch schützen kann. Und all diese Varianten des Schutzes vor Datenmissbrauch, die haben wir in der Diskussion des Registermonisierungsgesetzes damals. Das war eben ja, tatsächlich jetzt schon 5 Jahre her, weil sag mal 2 19 19 20 begonnen zu diskutieren auf der politischen Ebene. Ja, die die Maßnahmen, die jetzt getroffen werden sind, sind ein mindestzug guter, wenn nicht besserer Schutz vor Datenmissbrauch. Ja, also genau, weil die Angst, die da immer umgeht, ist ja der gläserne Bürger und ich also um's jetzt mal an 'nem Beispiel zu erklären, wäre vielleicht, ich weiß nicht, ich will mein Auto anmelden, identifizier mich und dann weiß der Typ im Kraftfahrzeugamt, ich hab 'n uneheliches Kind. Was was ja überhaupt nichts mit dem Auto zu tun hat. Also so was geht's, oder? Exakt. Ja. Und also diese Vorstellung, dass wenn wir die Register miteinander vernetzen und eindeutige Identifier zu den jeweiligen Datensätzen hinzufügen, dass dann jede Person innerhalb der Verwaltung darüber suchen kann. Das ist natürlich, ja, das ist 'n falsches Bild, das das teilweise auch gezeichnet worden ist. Wir überprüfen, bevor die Daten überhaupt abgerufen werden, wird überprüft, ob ich deine Daten abrufen darf und dazu muss ich bekannt geben, welches Verfahren nutze ich Genau. Und dann und führt das für das jeweilige Verfahren wird reduziert, welche Datenfelder sind für dieses Verfahren relevant? Das heißt, ich habe eine Vorabprüfung, also 'n sehr, also besser kann ich eigentlich den Datenschutz gar nicht gewährleisten, indem ich vorab prüfe, ob diese Daten für das Verwaltungsverfahren relevant sind. Und was, glaube ich, ganz wichtig ist und das hat kein anderes Vergleich, also hat kein anderes Land in dieser in dem Ausbau, den wir anstreben, dass die Daten nicht zentralisiert werden, sondern die Daten Die liegen bei der Gemeinde. Die liegen bei der Gemeinde. Wo ich zum Beispiel geboren bin. Exakt. Ja. Oder auf der Landesebene. Also es wird das eine oder andere gab's ja jetzt schon, also das Flensburger Knöllchenregister ist, glaube ich, jedem bekannt. Das ist 'n zentrales Register. Das heißt, es gibt hin und wieder ein zentrales Register. Es wird aber sehr viele Register geben, die weiterhin dezentral geführt werden und das ist eine Architektur, die es nach meinem Wissen stand in keinem anderen Land in der in dieser Ausprägung gibt. Also da macht man son bisschen eine Tugend aus der föderalen Zersplitterung sozusagen und nutzt arbeitet mit dem, was man da hat Ja. Letztendlich, ne. Und es ist es ist und da sehen wir ja jetzt, wie fragil Demokratien sind. Es hat auch neben dem Datenschutz auch eine demokratiepolitische Wirkung, weil letztendlich, wenn und da trauen die uns ja fast tagespolitisch nicht mehr über den Teich zu schauen, falls es tatsächlich zu Verschiebungen kommen sollte in der nahen Zukunft oder in der Zukunft, dann könnte rein theoretisch könnte könnte Berlin den den Datensteck erzielen und sagen, ich stelle meine Daten der gesamten Republik nicht mehr zur Verfügung und ich schütze meine Bürger somit, dass dass die Daten genutzt werden können von von einem politischen System. Ah ja, interessant. Ja, okay. Genau, also wir haben da verschiedene Schutzmechanismen eingebaut. Peter hat schon gesagt, diese Ex Ante Überprüfung, die da durchgeführt wird. Also ist das überhaupt plausibel, dass eine Behörde zu diesem Zweck auf die und die Daten zugreifen möchte? Das ist dieses for Corner Modell, also dass ich intermediäre habe zwischen der datenabrufenden Stelle, also dem Data Consumer heißt das dann und dem entsprechenden Register, also dem Data Provider. Und auf der anderen Seite habe ich aber als Bürger und Bürgerin zum Beispiel auch noch mal 'n Kontrollmechanismen über das sogenannte Datenschutz Cockpit. Also da kann ich gucken, wer hat denn grad so meine Daten abgerufen in Münster Zeit, ne? Bis bis 2 Jahre in die Vergangenheit hab ich da Protokoll und Inhaltsdaten, kann also gucken, welche Behörde hat wann zu welchem Zweck auf welche Daten zugegriffen und kann dann natürlich auch schauen und und sollte, also das man wird quasi selber so zum Datenschutz beauftragen und genau, soll perspektivisch auch Möglichkeiten haben, dass es aber wirklich noch Zukunftsmusik über dieses Datenschutz Cockpit, das soll irgendwann mal in die Bund ID integriert werden, dann auch mit den Behörden zu interagieren. Ja. Und falls es noch nicht deutlich geworden ist, also diese Identifikationsnummer, das wäre meine EID, oder? Nach der letzten, nee, ist das meine Steuernummer, so ist es, ne? Ist deine Steuernummer. Genau, ja. Du hast schon in unterschiedlichen Verfahren verwendet wurde, deswegen hat man sich auch darauf geeinigt, ist auch eine nicht sprechende Nummer und wird tatsächlich nur in diesem Austausch verwendet. Das heißt, ich kann jetzt nicht mit dieser Nummer suchen. Also was finde ich jetzt mit deiner Steuern? Also bei nicht sprechend heißt zum Beispiel bei meiner Sozialversicherungsnummer ist ja mein Geburtsdatum drin und das heißt, das ist eine total zufällige Nummer? Ja. Ja. Okay. Mhm. Bekommt ja jeder bei und für juristische Personen, also Unternehmen, Freiberufler*innen und so weiter, gibt es eben das entsprechende Pendant, das ist die bundeseinheitliche Wirtschaftsnummer, die eingeführt worden ist. Okay, genau. Hab ich wirklich bei meinen Kindern zur Geburt gekriegt? Hab ich hab ich geschaut. Eine schöne Begrüßung, genau. Und dann hat meine Tochter mit 16 den ersten Job gehabt und dann hab ich sie wiedergefunden. Ah, Gott sei Dank. Das versuchen. Ja. Okay, genau, aber warum ich jetzt grade auf die eID gekommen bin, ist, also der deutsche Ansatz, der ist eben sehr besonders mit dieser dezentralen Speicherung. Es gibt aber ja auch andere Ansätze. Also Deutschland ist ja nicht das einzige Land, was an E-Government-Ansätzen arbeitet und zum Beispiel die Schweiz arbeitet mit der eID, ne? Den von Architekten, wie ich's grad beschrieben hab, die führenden Government Länder setzen auf zentrale Register. Mhm. Also die haben zu einem sehr frühen Zeitpunkt, Estland begonnen, Register zentral aufzubauen, auch in Skandinavien, die auch sehr eng miteinander zu vernetzen. Die, wenn's gar nicht funktioniert, könnte man sagen, also was was passiert, wenn die Registermodernisierung scheitern sollte? Ja. Die Schweiz haben dieses Projekt noch gar nicht so breit gestartet, haben aber eine Art Zwischenlösung gebaut aktuell. Da bekomme ich als Bürgerbürerin muss ich auch zu meiner lokalen Behörde einmal mich dort ausweisen und kann aber dann die Daten von der Behörde auf mein Mobiltelefon übertragen Okay. Und sie dann wie in 1 elektronischen Dokumentenmappe verspeichern. Hast Du noch seine bekommen aus Mitglieder gefunden? Eine Dokumentenmappe? Dokumentenmappe, nein. Ich glaube nicht. Tatsächlich. Also ich hab das noch bekommen, für meinen Eltern ist es tatsächlich eine furchtbare, also also keine Ahnung. Und dann dann sammelst Du drinnen deine Geburts-, Sekund-, Staatsbürger-, Staatsbürger- und so weiter. Dieses Bild, dieser Dokumentenmappe mit den mit den staatlichen mit den staatlich zertifizierten Dokumenten und Stempelmarken gab's damals auch noch. Das übertragt man quasi auf die mobile Telefonwelt, sodass man, wie wir das kennen von, und jeder von uns hat schon mal eine Bordkarte, in sein Mobiltelefon gespeichert. Und das ist das sogenannte Wallet, also wo ich dann meine meine neben meiner Bordkarte dann auch meine Identifikationskarte liegen hab, meiner Staatsbürgerschaft Ja. Oder meiner Geburtsurkunde und dieses oder wenn ich Kinder habe, die Daten meiner Kinder. Und ich kann dann selbst gesteuert aus meinem elektronischen Dokumentenmappe, EU Wallet, dann in einen Behördenprozess integrieren. Mhm. Das ist ist eine eine Variante, die in der Schweiz als Übergangslösung gerade versucht will, ausgerollt zu werden, aber auch die Schweiz, ich hab da mit Vertretern gesprochen, streben natürlich auch an, dass sie eine Register, dass sie ihre Register dann auch noch vernetzen zu 'nem späteren Zeitpunkt. Okay. Ja, genau, aber es ist einfach 'n anderer Ansatz, ne. Da bin ich als Bürger in 'ner viel aktiveren Rolle und Du hast ja grad beschrieben Nicole, ich hab ja natürlich Kontrolle auch in dem deutschen Modell, aber da wär ich halt wirklich so, ich geborene euch meine Wallet oder ich geborene euch meine Wallet nicht sozusagen, ne. Da bin ich 'n bisschen in 'ner mächtigeren Position Genau, also die da, ne. Also muss natürlich auch mehr machen. In dem Fall. Also ich übermittel dann die Nachweise und in dem anderen Fall liegen sie ja bei der jeweiligen registerführenden Stelle und ich autorisiere nur, dass die anfragende Stelle der Data Consumer für das Verfahren, für das es benötigt wird, diese Daten eben abrufen und nutzen darf. Ja. Okay. Passt aber auch zum zum Schweizer Selbstverständnis 'n bisschen besser, weil ich hab da mit Studierenden in der Schweiz immer wieder diskutiert und die Vorstellung, dass ein ein Verfahren proaktiv, also ohne dass es beantragt wird vom Bürger oder Bürgerin, hat bei den Schweizer Studierenden Kopfschütteln erzeugt. Was ja in Österreich zum Beispiel der Fall ist mit dem Kindergeld, ne? Ja. Das kommt einfach. Das kommt einfach. Da muss ich nix machen. Nein, ich beantrage es nicht mehr, sondern ich direkt überwiesen. Und das wäre 'nem Schweizer suspekt. Das wär dem Schweizer, also das dem dem Schweizer und der Schweizerin absolut suspekt, weil sie sagen, also als als Bürger und Bürgerin bin ich selbstbestimmt, ich hab auch eine Verantwortung, dass ich mich meine Verwaltungsverfahren selbstständig kümmere. Und nicht, dass der Staat als großer als großer Bruder sich fortlaufend darum sorgt oder große Schwester, je nachdem wie man das das jetzt vom Bild her betrachten möchte, darum sorgt, dass ich gewisse Transferleistungen voll automatisiert zugestellt bekomme. Also das kann man durchaus, da sieht man schon, da wird's ein wirklich auch Ist interessanter wird's dann so kulturell auch, ne, irgendwie und ja sehr individuell für jedes Land. Aktuell ist es aber, ist Deutschland doch eher an der aktiven am aktiven Transfer orientiert, wenn wir ja in die politische Debatte schauen. Ja, Okay. Und wo stehen wir im Zeitplan? Also Herbst 2025, wir haben dieses Jahrzehnteprojekt. Sind wir in der Hälfte? Sind wir gut dabei? Wo stehen wir denn grade? Ja, schwierig zu sagen. Ich hab am Anfang ja schon gesagt, erst mal ging es ja darum, die ganzen Grundlagen zu schaffen. Also das Registermodernisierungsgesetz, ich hab das OZG Änderungsgesetz seit 20 24 in Kraft, wo ich zum ersten Mal eine Generalklausel habe tatsächlich für diesen automatisierten Nachweisabruf. Das Identifikationsnummerngesetz musste auf den Weg gebracht werden und natürlich waren auch an diversen Fachgesetzen und noch Änderungen vorzunehmen, Bundesmeldegesetz beispielsweise. Datenschutzrechtliche Aspekte waren zu beachten. Dann haben wir jetzt den Staatsvertrag, der ist der geschlossen worden ist. Das sind Bund und Ländern. Genau, wo es die technische Infrastruktur geht. Das ist das National Oneless only, nee, only, nee, National Onees Only Technical System. Doch genau, Notes. Zum Glück, ja. Kurz? Ja. Genau, der ist jetzt vom Bundeskabinett auch bereits ratifiziert worden. Also es waren erst mal in rechtlicher Hinsicht sehr viele Voraussetzungen zu schaffen, aber gleichzeitig wurde natürlich auch schon an der technischen Umsetzung gearbeitet. Also es wurden proof of concepts erstellt für die technischen Komponenten. Die Umsetzung wurde vorbereitet, der dieses Datenschutz Cockpit, was wir erwähnt haben, das ist schon mal in den Pilotbetrieb gegangen. Genau und das ist son bisschen, ich weiß, man son bisschen die Vorarbeiten und wo wir jetzt stehen, ist eigentlich bei der praktischen Umsetzung, wo es dann darum geht, das Ganze tatsächlich zu erproben, grade dieses Notes auch. Da ist jetzt die Referenzumgebung steht zur Verfügung. Da haben sich auch schon einige Behörden als Data Consumer und Data Provider angeschlossen. Ich glaube, letzter Stand waren 12, die das mal erprobt haben, wie dieses Zusammenspiel überhaupt funktioniert, ob ihre Systeme auch dafür bereit sind, da tatsächlich, wenn das dann irgendwann in den Produktivbetrieb geht, angeschlossen zu werden. Genau, und auf der anderen Seite geht's halt dieses ganze Identitäts Access Management. Auch da startet jetzt grade der Roll out. Also wir sind grade so am Anfang der großen Welle, wo es jetzt wirklich darum geht, die technische Umsetzung zu erproben und weiterzuentwickeln, das dann irgendwann in den Produktivbetrieb überführen zu können. Mhm. Und wo es ja dann auch relevant wird für die einzelnen Behörden, würdet ihr sagen, hier auf der Messe, ist es schon so Kaffeeschlangen Talk? Also sind die alle so, huh, jetzt kommt die Registermodernisierung irgendwie oder ist es noch gar nicht so angekommen in der Fläche? Also ich finde schon, das Bewusstsein ist dafür gewachsen, dass man an der Registermodernisierung eigentlich eigentlich gar nicht vorbeikommt und dass das wirklich ja auch alle betrifft von vom Bund bis zur kleinsten Kommune. Und ja, ich finde, man findet das hier im Programm auch wieder auf der Smart Country Convention. Wir sind ja nicht die einzige Veranstaltung, die sich dem Thema widmet. Auch in den Vorjahren gab's Veranstaltungen dazu und diesmal war das sogar 1, der relativ, ich glaub, man konnte so 8 zwischen 8 verschiedenen Tags oder so auswählen für die Veranstaltung und Registermodernisierung war dabei, also anscheinend auch von Bitkom als 1 der Topthemen identifiziert hier auf jeden Fall. Okay. Ihr, die ihr jetzt ja nah dran seid daran, könnt ihr auch sagen, jetzt in dieser Phase, die hier jetzt ansteht, also in diesem Roll out, da gibt's Sachen, da wissen wir jetzt schon, die werden herausfordernd sein, weiß ich nicht genau. Bei der bei der Software, bei also kann man son bisschen absehen, wo es dann vielleicht auch mal 'n bisschen haken könnte jetzt in der Phase? Es hakt an den Stellen, wo Du letztendlich die die die Mitarbeit aller brauchst. Mhm. Ich glaub, das ist jetzt so 'n Punkt, das ist kein Projekt, das der Bund alleine machen kann. Nicht, also die die das Notsystem, also dieses dieses System, dass Du diese Vernetzung von der Bund auf die Landesebene auf die kommunale Ebene hin bekommst, ist ein ist ein ein Element. Die Länder müssen aber alle jetzt beginnen, ihre eigenen Hausaufgaben zu machen. Und ich glaub, das wird vielfach noch unterschätzt, beginnt jetzt, also Ja. Wird gerade letzte Woche hatten wir eine eine Konferenz am Fraunhofer Fokus. Da war schön zu sehen, dass sowohl Brandenburg als auch Sachsen Anhalt jetzt beginnen, sone Art Dateninventur auch zu machen. Also welche Daten habe ich denn überhaupt in meinen Systemen gespeichert? Welche Daten liegen auf der kommunalen Ebene? Und jetzt darüber nachzudenken, wie können wir wie können wir unsere Daten viel besser nutzen in unseren Verwaltungsverfahren? Weil typischerweise lebst Du ja in 1 Stadt in einem Land. Die Ausnahme ist schon, wenn Du in 2 unterschiedlichen Ländern irgendwie Niederlassungen hast, vielleicht noch Berlin Brandenburg, aber das ist dann eher schon die Ausnahme, nicht? Also die die größeren Teil kannst Du ganz sicher damit gut abholen, wenn Du in ein an einem Ort ein gutes Datenmanagement hast, in Kombination mit dem mit dem jeweiligen Land, das rund den Ort ist. Und diese Erkenntnis, dass das jetzt beginnt, Schleswig Holstein hat schon vor Jahren damit begonnen, die eigenen Daten zu erheben und eine eigene Strategie zu entwickeln, wie gehen wir mit unseren Daten aus der Landes- und auf der kommunalen Ebene ist, glaube ich, jetzt 'n wichtiger wichtiger nächster Schritt. Mhm. Okay, das wär einfach, dass wir da auch unterschiedliche Geschwindigkeiten haben, Ja. Aber es müssen eben alle im Ziel ankommen am Ende sozusagen, ne? Und das son bisschen Ja. Zu managen und und mhm. Und dann ziehst Du und dann kann man kann man sich das bildlich vorstellen und dann kannst Du einzelne Register rausziehen, die vielleicht einfacher zu entwickeln sind, weil Du gut mit Sachsoftwareherstellern eng zusammenarbeitest, weil viele Daten liegen, also sind bereits liegen bereits digital vor, liegen aber in den jeweiligen in der jeweiligen Software der Kommune oder auf der Landesebene. Und da gilt's jetzt, mit diesen mit diesen Herstellern eng zusammenzuarbeiten, weil wenn man mit der dort keine Vereinbarung findet für gemeinsame Schnittstellen, dann wird's schwer, dass man auf diese Daten tatsächlich sinnvoll zugreifen kann. Und da sehe ich jetzt sehr viel positive Bewegung. Also ich bin jetzt in den letzten Monaten viel optimistischer geworden, dass wir jetzt größere Schritte in naher Zukunft sehen, wo das eine oder andere Register vielleicht dieses Jahr auch noch in dem Registerverbund quasi mit aufgenommen werden kann und Länder auch fortnehmen, eigene Strategien entwickeln, ihre Daten gut in die Verwaltungsverfahren zu bringen. Aber es klingt jetzt, ums vielleicht mal positiv noch zu formulieren, als gäb's da auch so Neben Benefits, ne. Neben okay, wir sind jetzt register modernisiert sozusagen, also sowas wie eine Dateninventur, was Du sagst. Also das klingt, als wär das sone Gelegenheit, mal son Grundputz zu machen und eine Bestandsaufnahme von, was nutzen wir eigentlich für Software, was haben wir eigentlich für Daten und so weiter. Also oder? Absolut, also da da kommen jetzt auch unterschiedliche Entwicklungen zusammen. Da kommt jetzt tatsächlich der der Data Act der Europäischen Union uns zugute, weil der wirkt jetzt auch. Der sieht so was auch vor, dass Organisationen das machen müssen und das fällt jetzt zeitlich sehr, sehr gut zusammen. Also dass es einfach auch wie sone Art Zeitfrist gibt und 'n bisschen Druck, der ja von außen kommt. Ja. Ja. Mhm. Das sind jetzt unterschiedliche Faktoren, die jetzt, glaub ich, gut zusammenspielen und ja, jetzt doch leicht optimistisch nach vorne schau, dass wir gute Ergebnisse die wir gute Ergebnisse in den nächsten 2, 3 Jahre sehen werden. Ich habe ja nicht damit gemeint, dass wir 10 Jahre lang warten müssen, bis wir das erste Register haben. Die 10 Jahre haben sich darauf bezogen, dass wir beispielsweise einen vollelektronischen, ohne dass wir hochrechnen müssen, einen vollelektronischen Zensus machen können. Also mit mit Echtdaten ohne einen vollelektronischen Zensus machen können. Also mit mit Echtdaten, ohne statistisch hochgerechnet zu werden. Und das, weil dazu brauche ich nicht ein Register, dazu brauche ich die 30 Register, damit ich so einen voll digitalen Zensus machen kann mit Echtdaten. Ja, und das wär sone Art, ja, nicht Goldstandard, aber son, ne, wo man sagen könnte, das wär mal echt 'n Ziel. Ja, wenn Du da wenn Du das erreichst, da hast Du schon wirklich sehr viele, also da musst Du die die die Daten, die relevant sind, grade aus der Bürger- und Bürgerinnensicht für die täglichen Verfahren oder für die Verfahren, die regelmäßig vorkommen, die hast Du dann tatsächlich digitalisiert und verfügbar gemacht. Ja. Was vielleicht noch wichtig ist zu erwähnen, Du hast auch gesagt, es gibt eben auch EU Regulatorik in dem Moment und es ist ja auch so gedacht, dass, mal angenommen, ich würde ein Eastländer heiraten wollen und Estland ist ja sehr weit eben, die könnten dann auch EU weit ausgetauscht werden, ne. Das ist vielleicht noch mal wichtig zu betonen. Das ist das ist weit von der Europäischen Union her, deswegen heißt es auch National Infrastructure, also dass Du dann zwischen den Nationen, also dass jeder jeder Mitgliedsstaat muss einen Not betreiben und zwischen diesen Notsknoten werden dann die Daten ausgetauscht. Ich seh diese Entwicklung aber relativ skeptisch, ganz ehrlich zu sein, Okay. Weil der Mehrwert sehr überschaubar sein wird, weil Du, ich hab zuerst schon das Beispiel gebracht, Du lebst wahrscheinlich hauptsächlich in Berlin und vielleicht hast Du noch 'n Nebenwohnsitz Ja. In Brandenburg. Die Wahrscheinlichkeit, dass Du auch in Österreich lebst, wird schon sehr gering. Also ich gehör noch dazu, also ich, aber Du hast einfach dann Nicht so viele Anwendungsfälle und dafür 'n relativ großen Aufwand. Und Du fokussierst dann, wo wo empfängt Du deine Sozialleistungen in einem Staat und da auf den auf den fokussierst Du dann und schaust, dass Du dort gut mit 1 IT ausgestattet bist, mit 1 Zustellung ausgestattet bist. Also ich glaub, dass da diese grenzüberschreitenden Wirkungen überschaubarer sind, als man das in der Debatte, glaube ich, darstellt. Anders bei der Wirtschaft, da hast Du natürlich wesentlich stärker schon die Verbreitung über ganz Deutschland. Also als Wirtschafts- und als erfolgreiches Wirtschaftsunternehmen habe ich mehrere Standorte in Deutschland, aber vielleicht auch in der Europäischen Union. Also was Daten der Wirtschaft betrifft, da sind die Potenziale wesentlich größer im also im den diesen Mehrwerte dann erheben zu können. Ja, okay. Aber Du hast recht, das sind also tatsächlich Entwicklungen, die jetzt parallel laufen auf deutscher nationaler Ebene eben mit dem Registermodernisierungsgesetz und auf der EU Ebene mit der Single Digital Gateway Verordnung. Dazu haben wir ja auch mal einen einen eigenen Podcast gemacht. Da war ja tatsächlich die Idee, dass über die nationalen once only technical Systems über eine intermedäre Plattform verbunden sind, über nationale Delivery Access Points und dann da eben Nachweise auch grenzüberschreitend ausgetauscht werden können, so wie's eben mit dem Registermodernisierungsgesetz auch angedacht ist. Da war die Frist mal, dass das umgesetzt sein sollte im Dezember 20 23. Ja, vorbei. Das hat, ja, das hat aber nicht nur Deutschland nicht geschafft, das hat tatsächlich kein EU Okay, EU ganz ambitioniert. Das war tatsächlich zu ambitioniert. Also wir sehen ja schon, wie komplex das auf der nationalen Ebene ist und wenn man sich das dann EU weit anschaut, dann haben wir natürlich noch mal ganz andere auch technische Systeme, Zuständigkeiten, gesetzliche Grundlagen. Also da steigt die Komplexität dann ja noch mal enorm. Ja. Okay, also uns stehen spannende Jahre bevor. Wollt ihr noch mal sagen, wie ihr vom Fraunhofer Kompetenzzentrum für öffentliche IT diesen Prozess jetzt begleitet? Also da haben ja bestimmt viele Leute fragen, müssen sich neues Wissen drauf schaffen? Was was habt ihr da im Angebot? Also wir haben unterschiedlich Wissenschaftlerinnen eingeladen, Blogbeiträge zu schreiben, weil das ja so vielfältige Dimensionen hat, das Thema und bereiten jetzt diese Boxserie gerade vor und laden aber natürlich auch Praktiker und Praktikerinnen ein, ihren aktuellen Stand zu teilen, sodass man ein jetzt eine gute Übersicht darüber bekommen, wo stehen wir denn eigentlich mit der Registermodernisierung und was müssten wir tun, damit wir es erfolgreich umsetzen können? Das ist so ein ein Teil, auf den wir gerade fokussieren und sonst natürlich auch immer wieder im Austausch mit den Kommunen und den Ländern und dem ja, dem jetzigen neuen Ministerium für Digitalisierung, Staatsmodernisierung, wo das natürlich 'n ganz großes Thema ist. Ja, genau und Peter hat es ja schon gesagt, also jetzt ist eben das Interessante, wie auch die Länder beispielsweise damit umgehen, ihre Datenbestände zu sichten und zu modernisieren und bereit zu machen für die Registermodernisierung und das haben wir eigentlich auch als als eine der wesentlichen Fragestellungen aktuell identifiziert. Deswegen ist auch geplant, dass wir uns in 1 Studie anschauen, wie eben in den Ländern das Vorgehen ist, die Registermodernisierung umzusetzen. Werden da also eine vergleichende Studie machen, wo wir uns dann einige einige bundesdeutsche Länder einmal 'n bisschen genauer angucken, denn es gibt ja durchaus noch verschiedene Möglichkeiten, wie das Vorgehen da aussehen kann. Okay, son bisschen Richtung Best Practice und Austausch und ja. Okay. Genau. Ja, total spannend. Ja, dann danke ich euch beiden fürs Dabeisein. Peter Pariczek, Leiter des Kompetenzzentrums öffentlicher IT und Nicole Opiella, stellvertretende Leiterin des öfit. Schön, dass ihr da wart. Danke dir. Danke. Das war Digital, diesmal als Liveaufzeichnung von der Smart Country Convention in Berlin. Die Blogbeiträge zum Thema Registermodernisierung findet ihr zusammen mit vielen anderen hilfreichen Infos auf öFIT Punkt d e mit o e geschrieben. Und diesen Podcast, den findet ihr auf allen gängigen Podcastportalen. Da könnt ihr uns auch abonnieren und dann bekommt ihr immer eine Erinnerung, wenn eine neue Folge erscheint. Ich verabschiede mich für heute. Mein Name ist Franziska Walser. 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Über ein Unterfangen, das nur gelingen kann, wenn von der Bundesregierung bis zum kleinsten Gemeindeamt wirklich alle zusammenarbeiten. Es geht, Trommelwirbel, die Registermodernisierung in Deutschland. Die Registermodernisierung ist vielleicht die Voraussetzung für flächendeckende, komfortabel zu nutzende digitale Verwaltungsangebote und wie weit wir auf dem Weg dahin sind zur Registermodernisierung, darüber sprechen wir heute. Wir haben uns einen besonderen Ort dafür ausgesucht.\n\nWir sind in einem mobilen Studio auf der Smart Country Convention in Berlin. Das ist also eine Liveausgabe von restart digital Und deswegen klingt die Tonqualität ein bisschen anders als gewohnt. Wie gewohnt bin ich Franziska Walser, der Host und sitze hier mit meinen beiden Co Hosts, Professor Peter Pariczek, Leiter des Kompetenzzentrums Öffentlicher IT am Fraunhofer Institut Focus in Berlin und Professor an der Donauuni Krems. Hallo Peter.\n\nSpeaker 1: Hallo Franziska.\n\nSpeaker 0: Und ebenfalls dabei Nicole Opiella, Politologin und stellvertretende Leiterin des Kompetenzzentrums Öffentlicher IT, kurz öfit. Hallo Nicole. Hallo Franziska. Peter, ich weiß nicht, ob Du 'n Typ für Superlative bist, aber ich hab einen früheren Podcast von uns gehört aus dem Jahr 2021, da ging's auch schon Registermodernisierung und da hast Du gesagt, das ist ein Jahrzehnteprojekt. Erinnerst Du dich?\n\nJa. Und war das eine Metapher oder meinen wir das ernst? Dauert das wirklich\n\nSpeaker 1: Jahrzehnte? Viele haben gehofft, dass ich's nicht ernst meine, aber es war damals ernst gemeint, weil's das dickste Brett ist, dass es zu bohren gibt. Ja, viele Beteiligte, Du hast ja schon angesprochen, 10000 Kommunen, da ist viel zu tun und ja, wir mal schauen, wie schnell wir vorankommen.\n\nSpeaker 2: Okay, wenn man sich die Planungen anguckt, dann gehen die auch jetzt schon bis mindestens 20 28. Und wenn wir mal überlegen, wie das alles angefangen hat mit dem UZG, wie lange das gedauert hat, bis wir das Registermodernisierungsgesetz hatten. Also da sind wir\n\nSpeaker 0: ja bei den Zum Beispiel ist das jetzt klar noch.\n\nSpeaker 2: Jetzt klar noch. Das\n\nSpeaker 0: schon rum, mehr\n\nSpeaker 2: oder weniger. Genau, also für ein Jahrzehnt reicht's auf jeden Fall, hoffentlich nicht noch für viele weitere.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja und es gibt ja auch 'n konkreten Zeitplan mit verschiedenen Schritten, die eben passieren. Da sprechen wir auch später noch mal genauer drüber über den Zeitplan. Jetzt steigen wir mal ein mit einem Beispiel. Ich hab mir rausgesucht, was Romantisches Heirat, also Standesamt. Könnt ihr mal erklären, wie da der Status quo ist und wie es wäre, wenn die Registermodernisierung erfolgreich umgesetzt wäre?\n\nAlso Status quo erst mal. Bei mir ist länger her, dass ich geheiratet hab. Ich hab auch in Amerika geheiratet. Ich ich weiß es wirklich nicht.\n\nSpeaker 1: Der Status quo ist, dass wir ja das Vergnügen haben, aufs Standesamt, das Lokale zu gehen, da wo wir ursprünglich auch geboren worden sind, also aus der aus der Perspektive und da kann, glaube ich, jeder von uns Anekdoten dazu erzählen. Also ich keine persönliche, aber vom Hören und Sagen gibt's gibt es ja da immer wieder die die schönsten Geschichten, was denn alles passiert, wie aufwendig das ist, diese Nachweise tatsächlich zusammenzutragen, dann zu heiraten und das Ganze setzt sich dann auch noch fort, wenn man Kinder bekommt, weil diese Daten sauber voneinander getrennt an den jeweiligen Lokalen Landesämtern, ja, im Papier, also im im Traumhaften. Also das ist ein richtiges Buch, wo man Jahrhunderte zurückgehen kann in einem gut geführten Standesamt und das Original ist da tatsächlich noch das Papier, das geführt wird und das Elektronische gibt's natürlich auch, ist aber irgendein Abbild davon.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm, okay. Also ich muss wirklich physisch in meinen Heimatort fahren oder wenn ich Glück habe, hat der das vielleicht schon digitalisiert?\n\nSpeaker 2: Ich muss auf jeden Fall persönlich auf dem Standesamt erscheinen und ich brauch eben einen aktuellen Auszug aus dem Personenstandsregister und das eben von meinem Geburtsort. Genau, also je nachdem muss ich auf jeden Fall da wieder Kontakt aufnehmen und dafür sorgen, dass ich diese Nachweise dann habe, damit ich überhaupt diese Eheschließung dann anmelden kann.\n\nSpeaker 0: Okay. Und jetzt Registermodernisierung. Das hieße dieses Personenstandsregister heißt das, ne? Mhm. Alles, was da drinsteht, steht auch digital irgendwo in 'ner Akte drin, ja?\n\nSpeaker 1: Exakt.\n\nSpeaker 0: Okay. Das heißt, jede Gemeinde in Deutschland, noch so klein, hat das erst mal überführt.\n\nSpeaker 1: Teilweise ist es schon überführt. Also es ist nicht so, dass wir jetzt damit beginnen müssen, vom Papier alles in die die digitale Welt überzutragen. Kommt auch immer drauf an, muss man dann immer von Fall zu Fall sehr detailliert schauen. Also da gibt's schon elektronische Daten. Die die Frage ist nur, sind die authentisch abgebildet in den digitalen Registern, im Personenstandsregister, wo ich ja dann auch alle zusätzlichen Elemente mit dabei hätte.\n\nAlso wie hat sich mein Personenstand verändert über die über die Jahre, über die Jahrzehnte? Welche Kinder habe ich bekommen? Also all diese Informationen, die ja sehr vital sind und notwendig sind für jede Art auch von Sozialleistungen, könnten dann voll integriert werden in soziale Transferleistungen beispielsweise. Das ist momentan aktuell leider eben noch nicht der Fall.\n\nSpeaker 0: Und man stellt sich das erst mal sehr einfach vor, ne, weil man sich denkt, okay, na gut, wie viele Felder hat son Formular? Nicht so viele. Mhm. Aber dadurch, dass wir ausm föderalen System kommen, hast Du mir, glaube ich, erklärt, Peter, zum Beispiel, dass bei manchen steht Nachname, bei manchen steht Familienname. Also diese Daten dann in 'n einheitliches Format zu bringen, kann komplexer sein, als man sich das so vorstellt im ersten Moment, ne.\n\nSpeaker 1: Tja, also die die das semantische Problem, das beginnt bei der Sprache und zieht sich natürlich dann auch weiter in die in das digitale Abbild, also wie ist ein Datensatz dann beschrieben und auch wie wie ist organisatorisch geregelt? Also wie können wir dann die Qualität sicherstellen? Also das sind ja alles Punkte, die man auf den unterschiedlichen Schichten bearbeiten muss, also die die sichtbare, also für uns Menschen, jedem für uns Menschen lesbaren Texte, dann in weiterer Folge die organisatorischen Prozesse, die damit verbunden sind, Qualitätssicherung, wer entscheidet am Schluss über die Wahrheit, die gespeichert ist und wie schaut das digitale Abbild aus von der Struktur des Datensatzes und und wie kann der auch abgerufen werden? Halt, ja, durch diese Schichten, Du hast das Brett am Anfang gebracht, durch dieses dicke Brett dieser semantischen Schichten, wo man sich durchbohren und deswegen ja, habe ich auch damals gesagt, das ist 'n Jahrzehnteprojekt.\n\nSpeaker 2: Dickes Brett auch deshalb, weil wir haben über 375 Register. Wir haben allein über 5000 Meldebehörden, die dann ihre eigenen Register führen. Genau, Du hast schon gesagt, das föderale System, wir haben Register auf Bundesebene, auf Länderebene, aber eben auch Fehler auf Kommunenebene und das muss ja hinterher alles irgendwie zusammenspielen können. Genau, Semantik ist ein Problem. Wie sind sind Datenfelder getrennt?\n\nWie sind die benannt? Was habe ich für Systeme? Wie sieht's mit Schnittstellen aus? Also das ist wirklich, ja, deswegen, da ist schon viel Vorarbeit gelaufen, aber da liegt auch noch sehr viel an Arbeit vor und\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja. Und dann wird's ganz einfach, weil nämlich dann gilt das Once only Prinzip. Das ist ja so das führende Prinzip hinter dem Ganzen. Was meint das noch mal?\n\nSpeaker 2: Das heißt eigentlich, dass ich als Bürger, Bürgerin oder auch als Unternehmen Daten, die der Verwaltung eigentlich schon vorliegen, nicht noch einmal beibringen muss. Mhm. Im Moment ist es ja so, wenn ich einen Antrag stelle, muss ich immer wieder meine Bestandsdatennahme, Vorname, Geburtsdatum, Anschrift et cetera. Ich muss das immer wieder neu eingeben, teilweise auf jedem Blatt. Mhm.\n\nUnd das wäre dann eben nicht notwendig. Ich könnte dann, es wäre dann teilweise vorausgefüllt und eben Nachweise, die der Verwaltung auch schon vorliegen, auch bei 1 anderen Behörde, dass ich zum Beispiel Kinder habe, dass ich verheiratet bin, was mein Einkommen ist und so weiter. Das müsste ich da, da müsste ich dann nicht zu der jeweiligen Behörde gehen und mir eben diese Nachweise ausstellen lassen, sie bei der anderen Behörde wieder einzureichen, sondern ich kann es eben autorisieren, dass diese Nachweise direkt abgerufen werden können über eine einheitliche technische Infrastruktur. Ich kann mir die dann noch mal einmal angucken. Es gibt sone Previewfunktion, kann schauen, ist das tatsächlich alles korrekt und möchte ich auch, dass dieser Nachweis jetzt genutzt werden kann im Rahmen dieses Verfahrens?\n\nUnd wenn ich das bejaht, dann ist das erledigt, also das kann ich quasi von zu Hause aus machen. Bei der Eheschließung vielleicht nicht, da ist das persönliche Erscheinen im im Stand. Es ist immer noch Es\n\nSpeaker 1: ist zumindest\n\nSpeaker 0: beliebt beieinander, aber wenigstens bei der Beantwortung.\n\nSpeaker 2: Genau, aber bei vielen anderen Verfahren spar ich mir da viel Aufwand und die Behörden untereinander natürlich auch.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja und damit es aber funktioniert, dieses ones only, also damit ich sozusagen zugeordnet werden kann zu meinen Daten, braucht's ja diese Identifikationsnummer und die war ja 'n sehr heißes Eisen am Anfang und wurde viel diskutiert, vielleicht immer noch sogar, ne. Warum eigentlich?\n\nSpeaker 1: Das geht zurück auf eine eine eine Jahrzehnte lang, also es gibt bis zurück in den in die in die Siebziger-, Achtzigerjahre, Letztes\n\nSpeaker 0: Volkszählungsurteil ist da das Stichwort, ne, genau. Wo es ja große Proteste gab.\n\nSpeaker 1: Wo das erste Mal darüber intensiv nachgedacht wurde, das war so der der Beginn der elektronischen Verwaltung in Deutschland oder auch weltweit, wo man das erste Mal begonnen hat, auf elektronischen Systemen Daten abzubilden und zu verarbeiten. Und damals wollte man damit die Volkszählung digitalisieren zu einem sehr frühen Zeitpunkt. Und damit man das machen kann und sich die Daten von dir Franziska zusammenzuführen, gibt's vielleicht mehrweiser oder auch vielleicht gibt's einen Schreibfehler, nicht? Auch das kann ja passieren. Und dass ich eben hundertprozentig weiß, dass das tatsächlich deine Identität ist und dich die Daten aus den unterschiedlichen Registern zusammenziehen kann, daraus dann eine digitale Volkszählung zu machen, ist das erste Mal die Debatte aufgekommen, dass man so einen eindeutigen Identifier verwendet.\n\nMhm. Und das zieht sich bis heute und wir sind in der Debatte insgesamt weiter, weil wir weil wir's neue Mechanismen gibt, wie man Datenmissbrauch schützen kann. Und all diese Varianten des Schutzes vor Datenmissbrauch, die haben wir in der Diskussion des Registermonisierungsgesetzes damals. Das war eben ja, tatsächlich jetzt schon 5 Jahre her, weil sag mal 2 19 19 20 begonnen zu diskutieren auf der politischen Ebene. Ja, die die Maßnahmen, die jetzt getroffen werden sind, sind ein mindestzug guter, wenn nicht besserer Schutz vor Datenmissbrauch.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja, also genau, weil die Angst, die da immer umgeht, ist ja der gläserne Bürger und ich also um's jetzt mal an 'nem Beispiel zu erklären, wäre vielleicht, ich weiß nicht, ich will mein Auto anmelden, identifizier mich und dann weiß der Typ im Kraftfahrzeugamt, ich hab 'n uneheliches Kind. Was was ja überhaupt nichts mit dem Auto zu tun hat. Also so was geht's, oder?\n\nSpeaker 1: Exakt. Ja. Und also diese Vorstellung, dass wenn wir die Register miteinander vernetzen und eindeutige Identifier zu den jeweiligen Datensätzen hinzufügen, dass dann jede Person innerhalb der Verwaltung darüber suchen kann. Das ist natürlich, ja, das ist 'n falsches Bild, das das teilweise auch gezeichnet worden ist. Wir überprüfen, bevor die Daten überhaupt abgerufen werden, wird überprüft, ob ich deine Daten abrufen darf und dazu muss ich bekannt geben, welches Verfahren nutze ich\n\nSpeaker 2: Genau.\n\nSpeaker 1: Und dann und führt das für das jeweilige Verfahren wird reduziert, welche Datenfelder sind für dieses Verfahren relevant? Das heißt, ich habe eine Vorabprüfung, also 'n sehr, also besser kann ich eigentlich den Datenschutz gar nicht gewährleisten, indem ich vorab prüfe, ob diese Daten für das Verwaltungsverfahren relevant sind. Und was, glaube ich, ganz wichtig ist und das hat kein anderes Vergleich, also hat kein anderes Land in dieser in dem Ausbau, den wir anstreben, dass die Daten nicht zentralisiert werden, sondern die Daten\n\nSpeaker 0: Die liegen bei der Gemeinde.\n\nSpeaker 1: Die liegen bei der Gemeinde.\n\nSpeaker 0: Wo ich zum Beispiel geboren bin.\n\nSpeaker 1: Exakt. Ja. Oder auf der Landesebene. Also es wird das eine oder andere gab's ja jetzt schon, also das Flensburger Knöllchenregister\n\nSpeaker 0: ist,\n\nSpeaker 1: glaube ich, jedem bekannt. Das ist 'n zentrales Register. Das heißt, es gibt hin und wieder ein zentrales Register. Es wird aber sehr viele Register geben, die weiterhin dezentral geführt werden und das ist eine Architektur, die es nach meinem Wissen stand in keinem anderen Land in der in dieser Ausprägung gibt.\n\nSpeaker 0: Also da macht man son bisschen eine Tugend aus der föderalen Zersplitterung sozusagen und nutzt arbeitet mit dem, was man da hat Ja. Letztendlich, ne.\n\nSpeaker 1: Und es ist es ist und da sehen wir ja jetzt, wie fragil Demokratien sind. Es hat auch neben dem Datenschutz auch eine demokratiepolitische Wirkung, weil letztendlich, wenn und da trauen die uns ja fast tagespolitisch nicht mehr über den Teich zu schauen, falls es tatsächlich zu Verschiebungen kommen sollte in der nahen Zukunft oder in der Zukunft, dann könnte rein theoretisch könnte könnte Berlin den den Datensteck erzielen und sagen, ich stelle meine Daten der gesamten Republik nicht mehr zur Verfügung und ich schütze meine Bürger somit, dass dass die Daten genutzt werden können von von einem politischen System.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ah ja, interessant. Ja, okay. Genau, also wir haben\n\nSpeaker 2: da verschiedene Schutzmechanismen eingebaut. Peter hat schon gesagt, diese Ex Ante Überprüfung, die da durchgeführt wird. Also ist das überhaupt plausibel, dass eine Behörde zu diesem Zweck auf die und die Daten zugreifen möchte? Das ist dieses for Corner Modell, also dass ich intermediäre habe zwischen der datenabrufenden Stelle, also dem Data Consumer heißt das dann und dem entsprechenden Register, also dem Data Provider. Und auf der anderen Seite habe ich aber als Bürger und Bürgerin zum Beispiel auch noch mal 'n Kontrollmechanismen über das sogenannte Datenschutz Cockpit.\n\nSpeaker 0: Also da kann ich gucken, wer hat denn grad so meine Daten abgerufen in Münster\n\nSpeaker 2: Zeit, ne?\n\nSpeaker 1: Bis bis\n\nSpeaker 2: 2 Jahre in die Vergangenheit hab ich da Protokoll und Inhaltsdaten, kann also gucken, welche Behörde hat wann zu welchem Zweck auf welche Daten zugegriffen und kann dann natürlich auch schauen und und sollte, also das man wird quasi selber so zum Datenschutz beauftragen und genau, soll perspektivisch auch Möglichkeiten haben, dass es aber wirklich noch Zukunftsmusik über dieses Datenschutz Cockpit, das soll irgendwann mal in die Bund ID integriert werden, dann auch mit den Behörden zu interagieren.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja. Und falls es noch nicht deutlich geworden ist, also diese Identifikationsnummer, das wäre meine EID, oder? Nach der letzten, nee, ist das meine Steuernummer, so ist es, ne?\n\nSpeaker 1: Ist deine Steuernummer.\n\nSpeaker 0: Genau, ja.\n\nSpeaker 1: Du hast schon in unterschiedlichen Verfahren verwendet wurde, deswegen hat man sich auch darauf geeinigt, ist auch eine nicht sprechende Nummer und wird tatsächlich nur in diesem Austausch verwendet. Das heißt, ich kann jetzt nicht mit dieser Nummer suchen. Also was finde ich jetzt mit deiner Steuern?\n\nSpeaker 0: Also bei nicht sprechend heißt zum Beispiel bei meiner Sozialversicherungsnummer ist ja mein Geburtsdatum drin und das heißt, das ist eine total zufällige Nummer? Ja.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja. Okay. Mhm. Bekommt ja jeder bei und für juristische Personen, also Unternehmen, Freiberufler*innen und so weiter, gibt es eben das entsprechende Pendant, das ist die bundeseinheitliche Wirtschaftsnummer, die eingeführt worden ist.\n\nSpeaker 0: Okay, genau. Hab ich wirklich bei meinen Kindern zur Geburt gekriegt? Hab ich hab ich geschaut. Eine schöne Begrüßung, genau. Und dann hat meine Tochter mit 16 den ersten Job gehabt und dann hab ich sie wiedergefunden.\n\nAh, Gott sei Dank. Das versuchen. Ja. Okay, genau, aber warum ich jetzt grade auf die eID gekommen bin, ist, also der deutsche Ansatz, der ist eben sehr besonders mit dieser dezentralen Speicherung. Es gibt aber ja auch andere Ansätze.\n\nAlso Deutschland ist ja nicht das einzige Land, was an E-Government-Ansätzen arbeitet und zum Beispiel die Schweiz arbeitet mit der eID,\n\nSpeaker 1: ne? Den von Architekten, wie ich's grad beschrieben hab, die führenden Government Länder setzen auf zentrale Register. Mhm. Also die haben zu einem sehr frühen Zeitpunkt, Estland begonnen, Register zentral aufzubauen, auch in Skandinavien, die auch sehr eng miteinander zu vernetzen. Die, wenn's gar nicht funktioniert, könnte man sagen, also was was passiert, wenn die Registermodernisierung scheitern sollte?\n\nJa. Die Schweiz haben dieses Projekt noch gar nicht so breit gestartet, haben aber eine Art Zwischenlösung gebaut aktuell. Da bekomme ich als Bürgerbürerin muss ich auch zu meiner lokalen Behörde einmal mich dort ausweisen und kann aber dann die Daten von der Behörde auf mein Mobiltelefon übertragen\n\nSpeaker 0: Okay.\n\nSpeaker 1: Und sie dann wie in 1 elektronischen Dokumentenmappe verspeichern. Hast Du noch seine bekommen aus Mitglieder gefunden?\n\nSpeaker 0: Eine Dokumentenmappe?\n\nSpeaker 1: Dokumentenmappe, nein.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ich glaube nicht. Tatsächlich. Also ich\n\nSpeaker 1: hab das noch bekommen, für meinen Eltern ist es tatsächlich eine furchtbare, also also keine Ahnung. Und dann dann sammelst Du drinnen deine\n\nSpeaker 0: Geburts-, Sekund-, Staatsbürger-, Staatsbürger-\n\nSpeaker 1: und so weiter. Dieses Bild, dieser Dokumentenmappe mit den mit den staatlichen mit den staatlich zertifizierten Dokumenten und Stempelmarken gab's damals auch noch. Das übertragt man quasi auf die mobile Telefonwelt, sodass man, wie wir das kennen von, und jeder von uns hat schon mal eine Bordkarte, in sein Mobiltelefon gespeichert. Und das ist das sogenannte Wallet, also wo ich dann meine meine neben meiner Bordkarte dann auch meine Identifikationskarte liegen hab, meiner Staatsbürgerschaft Ja. Oder meiner Geburtsurkunde und dieses oder wenn ich Kinder habe, die Daten meiner Kinder.\n\nUnd ich kann dann selbst gesteuert aus meinem elektronischen Dokumentenmappe, EU Wallet, dann in einen Behördenprozess integrieren.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm.\n\nSpeaker 1: Das ist ist eine eine Variante, die in der Schweiz als Übergangslösung gerade versucht will, ausgerollt zu werden, aber auch die Schweiz, ich hab da mit Vertretern gesprochen, streben natürlich auch an, dass sie eine Register, dass sie ihre Register dann auch noch vernetzen zu 'nem späteren Zeitpunkt. Okay.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja, genau, aber es ist einfach 'n anderer Ansatz, ne. Da bin ich als Bürger in 'ner viel aktiveren Rolle und Du hast ja grad beschrieben Nicole, ich hab ja natürlich Kontrolle auch in dem deutschen Modell, aber da wär ich halt wirklich so, ich geborene euch meine Wallet oder ich geborene euch meine Wallet nicht sozusagen, ne. Da bin ich 'n bisschen in 'ner mächtigeren Position Genau, also\n\nSpeaker 2: die da, ne. Also muss natürlich auch mehr machen. In dem Fall. Also ich übermittel dann die Nachweise und in dem anderen Fall liegen sie ja bei der jeweiligen registerführenden Stelle und ich autorisiere nur, dass die anfragende Stelle der Data Consumer für das Verfahren, für das es benötigt wird, diese Daten eben abrufen und nutzen darf.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja. Okay.\n\nSpeaker 1: Passt aber auch zum zum Schweizer Selbstverständnis 'n bisschen besser, weil ich hab da mit Studierenden in der Schweiz immer wieder diskutiert und die Vorstellung, dass ein ein Verfahren proaktiv, also ohne dass es beantragt wird vom Bürger oder Bürgerin, hat bei den Schweizer Studierenden Kopfschütteln erzeugt.\n\nSpeaker 0: Was ja in Österreich zum Beispiel der Fall ist mit dem Kindergeld, ne? Ja. Das kommt einfach.\n\nSpeaker 1: Das kommt einfach.\n\nSpeaker 0: Da muss ich nix machen.\n\nSpeaker 1: Nein, ich beantrage es nicht mehr, sondern ich direkt überwiesen.\n\nSpeaker 0: Und das wäre 'nem Schweizer suspekt.\n\nSpeaker 1: Das wär dem Schweizer, also das dem dem Schweizer und der Schweizerin absolut suspekt, weil sie sagen, also als als Bürger und Bürgerin bin ich selbstbestimmt, ich hab auch eine Verantwortung, dass ich mich meine Verwaltungsverfahren selbstständig kümmere. Und nicht, dass der Staat als großer als großer Bruder sich fortlaufend darum sorgt oder große Schwester, je nachdem wie man das das jetzt vom Bild her betrachten möchte, darum sorgt, dass ich gewisse Transferleistungen voll automatisiert zugestellt bekomme. Also das kann man durchaus, da sieht man schon, da wird's ein wirklich auch Ist\n\nSpeaker 0: interessanter wird's dann so kulturell auch, ne, irgendwie und ja sehr individuell für jedes Land.\n\nSpeaker 1: Aktuell ist es aber, ist Deutschland doch eher an der aktiven am aktiven Transfer orientiert, wenn wir ja in die politische Debatte schauen.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja, Okay. Und wo stehen wir im Zeitplan? Also Herbst 2025, wir haben dieses Jahrzehnteprojekt. Sind wir in der Hälfte? Sind wir gut dabei?\n\nWo stehen wir denn grade?\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja, schwierig zu sagen. Ich hab am Anfang ja schon gesagt, erst mal ging es ja darum, die ganzen Grundlagen zu schaffen. Also das Registermodernisierungsgesetz, ich hab das OZG Änderungsgesetz seit 20 24 in Kraft, wo ich zum ersten Mal eine Generalklausel habe tatsächlich für diesen automatisierten Nachweisabruf. Das Identifikationsnummerngesetz musste auf den Weg gebracht werden und natürlich waren auch an diversen Fachgesetzen und noch Änderungen vorzunehmen, Bundesmeldegesetz beispielsweise. Datenschutzrechtliche Aspekte waren zu beachten.\n\nDann haben wir jetzt den Staatsvertrag, der ist der geschlossen worden ist. Das sind Bund und Ländern. Genau, wo es die technische Infrastruktur geht. Das ist das National Oneless only, nee, only, nee, National Onees Only Technical System. Doch genau, Notes.\n\nSpeaker 1: Zum Glück, ja.\n\nSpeaker 2: Kurz? Ja. Genau, der ist jetzt vom Bundeskabinett auch bereits ratifiziert worden. Also es waren erst mal in rechtlicher Hinsicht sehr viele Voraussetzungen zu schaffen, aber gleichzeitig wurde natürlich auch schon an der technischen Umsetzung gearbeitet. Also es wurden proof of concepts erstellt für die technischen Komponenten.\n\nDie Umsetzung wurde vorbereitet, der dieses Datenschutz Cockpit, was wir erwähnt haben, das ist schon mal in den Pilotbetrieb gegangen. Genau und das ist son bisschen, ich weiß, man son bisschen die Vorarbeiten und wo wir jetzt stehen, ist eigentlich bei der praktischen Umsetzung, wo es dann darum geht, das Ganze tatsächlich zu erproben, grade dieses Notes auch. Da ist jetzt die Referenzumgebung steht zur Verfügung. Da haben sich auch schon einige Behörden als Data Consumer und Data Provider angeschlossen. Ich glaube, letzter Stand waren 12, die das mal erprobt haben, wie dieses Zusammenspiel überhaupt funktioniert, ob ihre Systeme auch dafür bereit sind, da tatsächlich, wenn das dann irgendwann in den Produktivbetrieb geht, angeschlossen zu werden.\n\nGenau, und auf der anderen Seite geht's halt dieses ganze Identitäts Access Management. Auch da startet jetzt grade der Roll out. Also wir sind grade so am Anfang der großen Welle, wo es jetzt wirklich darum geht, die technische Umsetzung zu erproben und weiterzuentwickeln, das dann irgendwann in den Produktivbetrieb überführen zu können.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm. Und wo es ja dann auch relevant wird für die einzelnen Behörden, würdet ihr sagen, hier auf der Messe, ist es schon so Kaffeeschlangen Talk? Also sind die alle so, huh, jetzt kommt die Registermodernisierung irgendwie oder ist es noch gar nicht so angekommen in der Fläche?\n\nSpeaker 2: Also ich finde schon, das Bewusstsein ist dafür gewachsen, dass man an der Registermodernisierung eigentlich eigentlich gar nicht vorbeikommt und dass das wirklich ja auch alle betrifft von vom Bund bis zur kleinsten Kommune. Und ja, ich finde, man findet das hier im Programm auch wieder auf der Smart Country Convention. Wir sind ja nicht die einzige Veranstaltung, die sich dem Thema widmet. Auch in den Vorjahren gab's Veranstaltungen dazu und diesmal war das sogar 1, der relativ, ich glaub, man konnte so 8 zwischen 8 verschiedenen Tags oder so auswählen für die Veranstaltung und Registermodernisierung war dabei, also anscheinend auch von Bitkom als 1 der Topthemen identifiziert hier auf jeden Fall.\n\nSpeaker 0: Okay. Ihr, die ihr jetzt ja nah dran seid daran, könnt ihr auch sagen, jetzt in dieser Phase, die hier jetzt ansteht, also in diesem Roll out, da gibt's Sachen, da wissen wir jetzt schon, die werden herausfordernd sein, weiß ich nicht genau. Bei der bei der Software, bei also kann man son bisschen absehen, wo es dann vielleicht auch mal 'n bisschen haken könnte jetzt in der Phase?\n\nSpeaker 1: Es hakt an den Stellen, wo Du letztendlich die die die Mitarbeit aller brauchst. Mhm. Ich glaub, das ist jetzt so 'n Punkt, das ist kein Projekt, das der Bund alleine machen kann. Nicht, also die die das Notsystem, also dieses dieses System, dass Du diese Vernetzung von der Bund auf die Landesebene auf die kommunale Ebene hin bekommst, ist ein ist ein ein Element. Die Länder müssen aber alle jetzt beginnen, ihre eigenen Hausaufgaben zu machen.\n\nUnd ich glaub, das wird vielfach noch unterschätzt, beginnt jetzt, also Ja. Wird gerade letzte Woche hatten wir eine eine Konferenz am Fraunhofer Fokus. Da war schön zu sehen, dass sowohl Brandenburg als auch Sachsen Anhalt jetzt beginnen, sone Art Dateninventur auch zu machen. Also welche Daten habe ich denn überhaupt in meinen Systemen gespeichert? Welche Daten liegen auf der kommunalen Ebene?\n\nUnd jetzt darüber nachzudenken, wie können wir wie können wir unsere Daten viel besser nutzen in unseren Verwaltungsverfahren? Weil typischerweise lebst Du ja in 1 Stadt in einem Land. Die Ausnahme ist schon, wenn Du in 2 unterschiedlichen Ländern irgendwie Niederlassungen hast, vielleicht noch Berlin Brandenburg, aber das ist dann eher schon die Ausnahme, nicht? Also die die größeren Teil kannst Du ganz sicher damit gut abholen, wenn Du in ein an einem Ort ein gutes Datenmanagement hast, in Kombination mit dem mit dem jeweiligen Land, das rund den Ort ist. Und diese Erkenntnis, dass das jetzt beginnt, Schleswig Holstein hat schon vor Jahren damit begonnen, die eigenen Daten zu erheben und eine eigene Strategie zu entwickeln, wie gehen wir mit unseren Daten aus der Landes- und auf der kommunalen Ebene ist, glaube ich, jetzt 'n wichtiger wichtiger nächster Schritt.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mhm. Okay, das wär einfach, dass wir da auch unterschiedliche Geschwindigkeiten haben, Ja. Aber es müssen eben alle im Ziel ankommen am Ende sozusagen, ne? Und das son bisschen Ja. Zu managen und\n\nSpeaker 1: und mhm. Und dann ziehst Du und dann kann man kann man sich das bildlich vorstellen und dann kannst Du einzelne Register rausziehen, die vielleicht einfacher zu entwickeln sind, weil Du gut mit Sachsoftwareherstellern eng zusammenarbeitest, weil viele Daten liegen, also sind bereits liegen bereits digital vor, liegen aber in den jeweiligen in der jeweiligen Software der Kommune oder auf der Landesebene. Und da gilt's jetzt, mit diesen mit diesen Herstellern eng zusammenzuarbeiten, weil wenn man mit der dort keine Vereinbarung findet für gemeinsame Schnittstellen, dann wird's schwer, dass man auf diese Daten tatsächlich sinnvoll zugreifen kann. Und da sehe ich jetzt sehr viel positive Bewegung. Also ich bin jetzt in den letzten Monaten viel optimistischer geworden, dass wir jetzt größere Schritte in naher Zukunft sehen, wo das eine oder andere Register vielleicht dieses Jahr auch noch in dem Registerverbund quasi mit aufgenommen werden kann und Länder auch fortnehmen, eigene Strategien entwickeln, ihre Daten gut in die Verwaltungsverfahren zu bringen.\n\nSpeaker 0: Aber es klingt jetzt, ums vielleicht mal positiv noch zu formulieren, als gäb's da auch so Neben Benefits, ne. Neben okay, wir sind jetzt register modernisiert sozusagen, also sowas wie eine Dateninventur, was Du sagst. Also das klingt, als wär das sone Gelegenheit, mal son Grundputz zu machen und eine Bestandsaufnahme von, was nutzen wir eigentlich für Software, was haben wir eigentlich für Daten und so weiter. Also oder?\n\nSpeaker 1: Absolut, also da da kommen jetzt auch unterschiedliche Entwicklungen zusammen. Da kommt jetzt tatsächlich der der Data Act der Europäischen Union uns zugute, weil der wirkt jetzt auch. Der sieht so was auch vor, dass Organisationen das machen müssen und das fällt jetzt zeitlich sehr, sehr gut zusammen.\n\nSpeaker 0: Also dass es einfach auch wie sone Art Zeitfrist gibt und 'n bisschen Druck, der ja von außen kommt. Ja.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja. Mhm. Das sind jetzt unterschiedliche Faktoren, die jetzt, glaub ich, gut zusammenspielen und ja, jetzt doch leicht optimistisch nach vorne schau, dass wir gute Ergebnisse die wir gute Ergebnisse in den nächsten 2, 3 Jahre sehen werden. Ich habe ja nicht damit gemeint, dass wir 10 Jahre lang warten müssen, bis wir das erste Register haben. Die 10 Jahre haben sich darauf bezogen, dass wir beispielsweise einen vollelektronischen, ohne dass wir hochrechnen müssen, einen vollelektronischen Zensus machen können.\n\nAlso mit mit Echtdaten ohne einen vollelektronischen Zensus machen können. Also mit mit Echtdaten, ohne statistisch hochgerechnet zu werden. Und das, weil dazu brauche ich nicht ein Register, dazu brauche ich die 30 Register, damit ich so einen voll digitalen Zensus machen kann mit Echtdaten.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja, und das wär sone Art, ja, nicht Goldstandard, aber son, ne, wo man sagen könnte, das wär mal echt 'n Ziel.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, wenn Du da wenn Du das erreichst, da hast Du schon wirklich sehr viele, also da musst Du die die die Daten, die relevant sind, grade aus der Bürger- und Bürgerinnensicht für die täglichen Verfahren oder für die Verfahren, die regelmäßig vorkommen, die hast Du dann tatsächlich digitalisiert und verfügbar gemacht.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja. Was vielleicht noch wichtig ist zu erwähnen, Du hast auch gesagt, es gibt eben auch EU Regulatorik in dem Moment und es ist ja auch so gedacht, dass, mal angenommen, ich würde ein Eastländer heiraten wollen und Estland ist ja sehr weit eben, die könnten dann auch EU weit ausgetauscht werden, ne. Das ist vielleicht noch mal wichtig zu betonen.\n\nSpeaker 1: Das ist das ist weit von der Europäischen Union her, deswegen heißt es auch National Infrastructure, also dass Du dann zwischen den Nationen, also dass jeder jeder Mitgliedsstaat muss einen Not betreiben und zwischen diesen Notsknoten werden dann die Daten ausgetauscht. Ich seh diese Entwicklung aber relativ skeptisch, ganz ehrlich zu sein, Okay. Weil der Mehrwert sehr überschaubar sein wird, weil Du, ich hab zuerst schon das Beispiel gebracht, Du lebst wahrscheinlich hauptsächlich in Berlin und vielleicht hast Du noch 'n Nebenwohnsitz Ja. In Brandenburg. Die Wahrscheinlichkeit, dass Du auch in Österreich lebst, wird schon sehr gering.\n\nAlso ich gehör noch dazu, also ich, aber Du hast einfach dann\n\nSpeaker 0: Nicht so viele Anwendungsfälle und dafür 'n relativ großen Aufwand.\n\nSpeaker 1: Und Du fokussierst dann, wo wo empfängt Du deine Sozialleistungen in einem Staat und da auf den auf den fokussierst Du dann und schaust, dass Du dort gut mit 1 IT ausgestattet bist, mit 1 Zustellung ausgestattet bist. Also ich glaub, dass da diese grenzüberschreitenden Wirkungen überschaubarer sind, als man das in der Debatte, glaube ich, darstellt. Anders bei der Wirtschaft, da hast Du natürlich wesentlich stärker schon die Verbreitung über ganz Deutschland. Also als Wirtschafts- und als erfolgreiches Wirtschaftsunternehmen habe ich mehrere Standorte in Deutschland, aber vielleicht auch in der Europäischen Union. Also was Daten der Wirtschaft betrifft, da sind die Potenziale wesentlich größer im also im den diesen Mehrwerte dann erheben zu können.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja, okay. Aber Du hast\n\nSpeaker 2: recht, das sind also tatsächlich Entwicklungen, die jetzt parallel laufen auf deutscher nationaler Ebene eben mit dem Registermodernisierungsgesetz und auf der EU Ebene mit der Single Digital Gateway Verordnung. Dazu haben wir ja auch mal einen einen eigenen Podcast gemacht. Da war ja tatsächlich die Idee, dass über die nationalen once only technical Systems über eine intermedäre Plattform verbunden sind, über nationale Delivery Access Points und dann da eben Nachweise auch grenzüberschreitend ausgetauscht werden können, so wie's eben mit dem Registermodernisierungsgesetz auch angedacht ist. Da war die Frist mal, dass das umgesetzt sein sollte im Dezember 20 23.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja, vorbei. Das hat, ja,\n\nSpeaker 2: das hat aber nicht nur Deutschland nicht geschafft, das hat tatsächlich kein EU\n\nSpeaker 0: Okay, EU ganz ambitioniert.\n\nSpeaker 2: Das war tatsächlich zu ambitioniert. Also wir sehen ja schon, wie komplex das auf der nationalen Ebene ist und wenn man sich das dann EU weit anschaut, dann haben wir natürlich noch mal ganz andere auch technische Systeme, Zuständigkeiten, gesetzliche Grundlagen. Also da steigt die Komplexität dann ja noch mal enorm.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja. Okay, also uns stehen spannende Jahre bevor. Wollt ihr noch mal sagen, wie ihr vom Fraunhofer Kompetenzzentrum für öffentliche IT diesen Prozess jetzt begleitet? Also da haben ja bestimmt viele Leute fragen, müssen sich neues Wissen drauf schaffen? Was was habt ihr da im Angebot?\n\nSpeaker 1: Also wir haben unterschiedlich Wissenschaftlerinnen eingeladen, Blogbeiträge zu schreiben, weil das ja so vielfältige Dimensionen hat, das Thema und bereiten jetzt diese Boxserie gerade vor und laden aber natürlich auch Praktiker und Praktikerinnen ein, ihren aktuellen Stand zu teilen, sodass man ein jetzt eine gute Übersicht darüber bekommen, wo stehen wir denn eigentlich mit der Registermodernisierung und was müssten wir tun, damit wir es erfolgreich umsetzen können? Das ist so ein ein Teil, auf den wir gerade fokussieren und sonst natürlich auch immer wieder im Austausch mit den Kommunen und den Ländern und dem ja, dem jetzigen neuen Ministerium für Digitalisierung, Staatsmodernisierung, wo das natürlich 'n ganz großes Thema ist.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja, genau und Peter hat es ja schon gesagt, also jetzt ist eben das Interessante, wie auch die Länder beispielsweise damit umgehen, ihre Datenbestände zu sichten und zu modernisieren und bereit zu machen für die Registermodernisierung und das haben wir eigentlich auch als als eine der wesentlichen Fragestellungen aktuell identifiziert. Deswegen ist auch geplant, dass wir uns in 1 Studie anschauen, wie eben in den Ländern das Vorgehen ist, die Registermodernisierung umzusetzen. Werden da also eine vergleichende Studie machen, wo wir uns dann einige einige bundesdeutsche Länder einmal 'n bisschen genauer angucken, denn es gibt\n\nSpeaker 0: ja\n\nSpeaker 2: durchaus noch verschiedene Möglichkeiten, wie das Vorgehen da aussehen kann.\n\nSpeaker 0: Okay, son bisschen Richtung Best Practice und Austausch und ja. Okay. Genau. Ja, total spannend. Ja, dann danke ich euch beiden fürs Dabeisein.\n\nPeter Pariczek, Leiter des Kompetenzzentrums öffentlicher IT und Nicole Opiella, stellvertretende Leiterin des öfit. Schön, dass ihr da wart.\n\nSpeaker 2: Danke dir.\n\nSpeaker 1: Danke. Das\n\nSpeaker 0: war Digital, diesmal als Liveaufzeichnung von der Smart Country Convention in Berlin. Die Blogbeiträge zum Thema Registermodernisierung findet ihr zusammen mit vielen anderen hilfreichen Infos auf öFIT Punkt d e mit o e geschrieben. Und diesen Podcast, den findet ihr auf allen gängigen Podcastportalen. Da könnt ihr uns auch abonnieren und dann bekommt ihr immer eine Erinnerung, wenn eine neue Folge erscheint. Ich verabschiede mich für heute.\n\nMein Name ist Franziska Walser. Tschüs, bis bald.", "paragraphs": [ { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ich bin ja eigentlich nicht der Typ für Superlative, aber man kann schon sagen, wir sprechen heute über die Mutter aller Digitalisierungsprojekte, über das ganz dicke Brett.", "start": 1.1999999, "end": 10.0199995 }, { "text": "Über ein Unterfangen, das nur gelingen kann, wenn von der Bundesregierung bis zum kleinsten Gemeindeamt wirklich alle zusammenarbeiten.", "start": 10.48, "end": 16.035 }, { "text": "Es geht, Trommelwirbel, die Registermodernisierung in Deutschland.", "start": 17.215, "end": 20.994999 }, { "text": "Die Registermodernisierung ist vielleicht die Voraussetzung für flächendeckende, komfortabel zu nutzende digitale Verwaltungsangebote und wie weit wir auf dem Weg dahin sind zur Registermodernisierung, darüber sprechen wir heute.", "start": 21.615, "end": 33.15 }, { "text": "Wir haben uns einen besonderen Ort dafür ausgesucht.", "start": 33.61, "end": 35.85 } ], "start": 1.1999999, "end": 35.85, "num_words": 88.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Wir sind in einem mobilen Studio auf der Smart Country Convention in Berlin.", "start": 35.85, "end": 39.85 }, { "text": "Das ist also eine Liveausgabe von restart digital Und deswegen klingt die Tonqualität ein bisschen anders als gewohnt.", "start": 39.85, "end": 47.125 }, { "text": "Wie gewohnt bin ich Franziska Walser, der Host und sitze hier mit meinen beiden Co Hosts, Professor Peter Pariczek, Leiter des Kompetenzzentrums Öffentlicher IT am Fraunhofer Institut Focus in Berlin und Professor an der Donauuni Krems.", "start": 56.489998, "end": 71.095 }, { "text": "Hallo Peter.", "start": 71.095, "end": 71.735 } ], "start": 35.85, "end": 71.735, "num_words": 69.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Hallo Franziska.", "start": 71.735, "end": 72.475 } ], "start": 71.735, "end": 72.475, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und ebenfalls dabei Nicole Opiella, Politologin und stellvertretende Leiterin des Kompetenzzentrums Öffentlicher IT, kurz öfit.", "start": 73.335, "end": 80.055 }, { "text": "Hallo Nicole.", "start": 80.055, "end": 80.854996 }, { "text": "Hallo Franziska.", "start": 80.854996, "end": 81.674995 }, { "text": "Peter, ich weiß nicht, ob Du 'n Typ für Superlative bist, aber ich hab einen früheren Podcast von uns gehört aus dem Jahr 2021, da ging's auch schon Registermodernisierung und da hast Du gesagt, das ist ein Jahrzehnteprojekt.", "start": 82.99, "end": 92.92999 }, { "text": "Erinnerst Du dich?", "start": 93.46999, "end": 94.42999 } ], "start": 73.335, "end": 94.42999, "num_words": 60.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja.", "start": 94.42999, "end": 94.92999 }, { "text": "Und war das eine Metapher oder meinen wir das ernst?", "start": 95.284996, "end": 97.445 }, { "text": "Dauert das wirklich", "start": 97.445, "end": 98.424995 } ], "start": 94.42999, "end": 98.424995, "num_words": 14.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Jahrzehnte?", "start": 98.80499, "end": 99.045 }, { "text": "Viele haben gehofft, dass ich's nicht ernst meine, aber es war damals ernst gemeint, weil's das dickste Brett ist, dass es zu bohren gibt.", "start": 99.045, "end": 106.98499 }, { "text": "Ja, viele Beteiligte, Du hast ja schon angesprochen, 10000 Kommunen, da ist viel zu tun und ja, wir mal schauen, wie schnell wir vorankommen.", "start": 107.33, "end": 114.79 } ], "start": 98.80499, "end": 114.79, "num_words": 49.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Okay, wenn man sich die Planungen anguckt, dann gehen die auch jetzt schon bis mindestens 20 28.", "start": 115.09, "end": 120.71 }, { "text": "Und wenn wir mal überlegen, wie das alles angefangen hat mit dem UZG, wie lange das gedauert hat, bis wir das Registermodernisierungsgesetz hatten.", "start": 121.265, "end": 128.485 }, { "text": "Also da sind wir", "start": 128.545, "end": 129.58499 } ], "start": 115.09, "end": 129.58499, "num_words": 44.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "ja bei den Zum Beispiel ist das jetzt klar noch.", "start": 129.58499, "end": 130.83301 } ], "start": 129.58499, "end": 130.83301, "num_words": 10.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Jetzt klar noch.", "start": 130.881, "end": 131.025 }, { "text": "Das", "start": 131.105, "end": 131.345 } ], "start": 130.881, "end": 131.345, "num_words": 4.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "schon rum, mehr", "start": 131.345, "end": 131.985 } ], "start": 131.345, "end": 131.985, "num_words": 3.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "oder weniger.", "start": 131.985, "end": 132.625 }, { "text": "Genau, also für ein Jahrzehnt reicht's auf jeden Fall, hoffentlich nicht noch für viele weitere.", "start": 132.625, "end": 138.56 } ], "start": 131.985, "end": 138.56, "num_words": 17.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja und es gibt ja auch 'n konkreten Zeitplan mit verschiedenen Schritten, die eben passieren.", "start": 138.62001, "end": 142.72 }, { "text": "Da sprechen wir auch später noch mal genauer drüber über den Zeitplan.", "start": 143.1, "end": 145.84001 }, { "text": "Jetzt steigen wir mal ein mit einem Beispiel.", "start": 146.515, "end": 148.275 }, { "text": "Ich hab mir rausgesucht, was Romantisches Heirat, also Standesamt.", "start": 148.275, "end": 151.735 }, { "text": "Könnt ihr mal erklären, wie da der Status quo ist und wie es wäre, wenn die Registermodernisierung erfolgreich umgesetzt wäre?", "start": 152.75499, "end": 159.555 } ], "start": 138.62001, "end": 159.555, "num_words": 64.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also Status quo erst mal.", "start": 159.555, "end": 160.72 }, { "text": "Bei mir ist länger her, dass ich geheiratet hab.", "start": 160.72, "end": 162.31999 }, { "text": "Ich hab auch in Amerika geheiratet.", "start": 162.31999, "end": 163.76 }, { "text": "Ich ich weiß es wirklich nicht.", "start": 163.76, "end": 165.2 } ], "start": 159.555, "end": 165.2, "num_words": 26.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Der Status quo ist, dass wir ja das Vergnügen haben, aufs Standesamt, das Lokale zu gehen, da wo wir ursprünglich auch geboren worden sind, also aus der aus der Perspektive und da kann, glaube ich, jeder von uns Anekdoten dazu erzählen.", "start": 165.2, "end": 177.745 }, { "text": "Also ich keine persönliche, aber vom Hören und Sagen gibt's gibt es ja da immer wieder die die schönsten Geschichten, was denn alles passiert, wie aufwendig das ist, diese Nachweise tatsächlich zusammenzutragen, dann zu heiraten und das Ganze setzt sich dann auch noch fort, wenn man Kinder bekommt, weil diese Daten sauber voneinander getrennt an den jeweiligen Lokalen Landesämtern, ja, im Papier, also im im Traumhaften.", "start": 178.285, "end": 204.08499 }, { "text": "Also das ist ein richtiges Buch, wo man Jahrhunderte zurückgehen kann in einem gut geführten Standesamt und das Original ist da tatsächlich noch das Papier, das geführt wird und das Elektronische gibt's natürlich auch, ist aber irgendein Abbild davon.", "start": 204.305, "end": 219.05 } ], "start": 165.2, "end": 219.05, "num_words": 146.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mhm, okay.", "start": 219.05, "end": 219.69 }, { "text": "Also ich muss wirklich physisch in meinen Heimatort fahren oder wenn ich Glück habe, hat der das vielleicht schon digitalisiert?", "start": 219.69, "end": 226.03 } ], "start": 219.05, "end": 226.03, "num_words": 22.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ich muss auf jeden Fall persönlich auf dem Standesamt erscheinen und ich brauch eben einen aktuellen Auszug aus dem Personenstandsregister und das eben von meinem Geburtsort.", "start": 226.585, "end": 234.845 }, { "text": "Genau, also je nachdem muss ich auf jeden Fall da wieder Kontakt aufnehmen und dafür sorgen, dass ich diese Nachweise dann habe, damit ich überhaupt diese Eheschließung dann anmelden kann.", "start": 235.625, "end": 245.28001 } ], "start": 226.585, "end": 245.28001, "num_words": 56.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Okay.", "start": 245.66, "end": 246.16 }, { "text": "Und jetzt Registermodernisierung.", "start": 246.62001, "end": 247.84001 }, { "text": "Das hieße dieses Personenstandsregister heißt das, ne?", "start": 248.94, "end": 253.42001 }, { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 253.42001, "end": 253.92001 }, { "text": "Alles, was da drinsteht, steht auch digital irgendwo in 'ner Akte drin, ja?", "start": 253.98001, "end": 259.065 } ], "start": 245.66, "end": 259.065, "num_words": 25.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Exakt.", "start": 259.205, "end": 259.705 } ], "start": 259.205, "end": 259.705, "num_words": 1.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Okay.", "start": 260.005, "end": 260.505 }, { "text": "Das heißt, jede Gemeinde in Deutschland, noch so klein, hat das erst mal überführt.", "start": 260.565, "end": 265.225 } ], "start": 260.005, "end": 265.225, "num_words": 15.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Teilweise ist es schon überführt.", "start": 266.245, "end": 267.365 }, { "text": "Also es ist nicht so, dass wir jetzt damit beginnen müssen, vom Papier alles in die die digitale Welt überzutragen.", "start": 267.365, "end": 272.9 }, { "text": "Kommt auch immer drauf an, muss man dann immer von Fall zu Fall sehr detailliert schauen.", "start": 272.96, "end": 276.56 }, { "text": "Also da gibt's schon elektronische Daten.", "start": 276.56, "end": 278.74 }, { "text": "Die die Frage ist nur, sind die authentisch abgebildet in den digitalen Registern, im Personenstandsregister, wo ich ja dann auch alle zusätzlichen Elemente mit dabei hätte.", "start": 279.36002, "end": 288.755 } ], "start": 266.245, "end": 288.755, "num_words": 73.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also wie hat sich mein Personenstand verändert über die über die Jahre, über die Jahrzehnte?", "start": 288.755, "end": 293.895 }, { "text": "Welche Kinder habe ich bekommen?", "start": 293.95502, "end": 295.395 }, { "text": "Also all diese Informationen, die ja sehr vital sind und notwendig sind für jede Art auch von Sozialleistungen, könnten dann voll integriert werden in soziale Transferleistungen beispielsweise.", "start": 295.395, "end": 308.63 }, { "text": "Das ist momentan aktuell leider eben noch nicht der Fall.", "start": 309.33, "end": 312.71 } ], "start": 288.755, "end": 312.71, "num_words": 57.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und man stellt sich das erst mal sehr einfach vor, ne, weil man sich denkt, okay, na gut, wie viele Felder hat son Formular?", "start": 313.175, "end": 318.615 }, { "text": "Nicht so viele.", "start": 318.615, "end": 319.255 }, { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 319.255, "end": 319.575 }, { "text": "Aber dadurch, dass wir ausm föderalen System kommen, hast Du mir, glaube ich, erklärt, Peter, zum Beispiel, dass bei manchen steht Nachname, bei manchen steht Familienname.", "start": 319.575, "end": 326.795 }, { "text": "Also diese Daten dann in 'n einheitliches Format zu bringen, kann komplexer sein, als man sich das so vorstellt im ersten Moment, ne.", "start": 326.935, "end": 333.91 } ], "start": 313.175, "end": 333.91, "num_words": 77.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Tja, also die die das semantische Problem, das beginnt bei der Sprache und zieht sich natürlich dann auch weiter in die in das digitale Abbild, also wie ist ein Datensatz dann beschrieben und auch wie wie ist organisatorisch geregelt?", "start": 335.17, "end": 346.805 }, { "text": "Also wie können wir dann die Qualität sicherstellen?", "start": 346.805, "end": 349.225 }, { "text": "Also das sind ja alles Punkte, die man auf den unterschiedlichen Schichten bearbeiten muss, also die die sichtbare, also für uns Menschen, jedem für uns Menschen lesbaren Texte, dann in weiterer Folge die organisatorischen Prozesse, die damit verbunden sind, Qualitätssicherung, wer entscheidet am Schluss über die Wahrheit, die gespeichert ist und wie schaut das digitale Abbild aus von der Struktur des Datensatzes und und wie kann der auch abgerufen werden?", "start": 349.76498, "end": 374.41998 }, { "text": "Halt, ja, durch diese Schichten, Du hast das Brett am Anfang gebracht, durch dieses dicke Brett dieser semantischen Schichten, wo man sich durchbohren und deswegen ja, habe ich auch damals gesagt, das ist 'n Jahrzehnteprojekt.", "start": 375.065, "end": 386.445 } ], "start": 335.17, "end": 386.445, "num_words": 152.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Dickes Brett auch deshalb, weil wir haben über 375 Register.", "start": 387.37, "end": 391.39 }, { "text": "Wir haben allein über 5000 Meldebehörden, die dann ihre eigenen Register führen.", "start": 391.45, "end": 396.03 }, { "text": "Genau, Du hast schon gesagt, das föderale System, wir haben Register auf Bundesebene, auf Länderebene, aber eben auch Fehler auf Kommunenebene und das muss ja hinterher alles irgendwie zusammenspielen können.", "start": 396.57, "end": 409.25497 }, { "text": "Genau, Semantik ist ein Problem.", "start": 409.555, "end": 411.235 }, { "text": "Wie sind sind Datenfelder getrennt?", "start": 411.235, "end": 413.47498 } ], "start": 387.37, "end": 413.47498, "num_words": 62.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Wie sind die benannt?", "start": 413.47498, "end": 414.53497 }, { "text": "Was habe ich für Systeme?", "start": 415.15, "end": 416.43 }, { "text": "Wie sieht's mit Schnittstellen aus?", "start": 416.43, "end": 417.78998 }, { "text": "Also das ist wirklich, ja, deswegen, da ist schon viel Vorarbeit gelaufen, aber da liegt auch noch sehr viel an Arbeit vor und", "start": 417.78998, "end": 426.03 } ], "start": 413.47498, "end": 426.03, "num_words": 37.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja.", "start": 426.27, "end": 426.77 }, { "text": "Und dann wird's ganz einfach, weil nämlich dann gilt das Once only Prinzip.", "start": 426.83, "end": 430.985 }, { "text": "Das ist ja so das führende Prinzip hinter dem Ganzen.", "start": 431.005, "end": 434.125 }, { "text": "Was meint das noch mal?", "start": 434.125, "end": 435.505 } ], "start": 426.27, "end": 435.505, "num_words": 29.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das heißt eigentlich, dass ich als Bürger, Bürgerin oder auch als Unternehmen Daten, die der Verwaltung eigentlich schon vorliegen, nicht noch einmal beibringen muss.", "start": 435.565, "end": 446.38 }, { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 446.38, "end": 446.69998 }, { "text": "Im Moment ist es ja so, wenn ich einen Antrag stelle, muss ich immer wieder meine Bestandsdatennahme, Vorname, Geburtsdatum, Anschrift et cetera.", "start": 446.69998, "end": 455.825 }, { "text": "Ich muss das immer wieder neu eingeben, teilweise auf jedem Blatt.", "start": 455.825, "end": 458.545 }, { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 458.545, "end": 459.045 } ], "start": 435.565, "end": 459.045, "num_words": 59.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und das wäre dann eben nicht notwendig.", "start": 459.585, "end": 461.525 }, { "text": "Ich könnte dann, es wäre dann teilweise vorausgefüllt und eben Nachweise, die der Verwaltung auch schon vorliegen, auch bei 1 anderen Behörde, dass ich zum Beispiel Kinder habe, dass ich verheiratet bin, was mein Einkommen ist und so weiter.", "start": 462.385, "end": 476.77002 }, { "text": "Das müsste ich da, da müsste ich dann nicht zu der jeweiligen Behörde gehen und mir eben diese Nachweise ausstellen lassen, sie bei der anderen Behörde wieder einzureichen, sondern ich kann es eben autorisieren, dass diese Nachweise direkt abgerufen werden können über eine einheitliche technische Infrastruktur.", "start": 477.31, "end": 494.95502 }, { "text": "Ich kann mir die dann noch mal einmal angucken.", "start": 495.815, "end": 497.75 }, { "text": "Es gibt sone Previewfunktion, kann schauen, ist das tatsächlich alles korrekt und möchte ich auch, dass dieser Nachweis jetzt genutzt werden kann im Rahmen dieses Verfahrens?", "start": 497.75, "end": 507.84998 } ], "start": 459.585, "end": 507.84998, "num_words": 127.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und wenn ich das bejaht, dann ist das erledigt, also das kann ich quasi von zu Hause aus machen.", "start": 508.22998, "end": 513.97504 }, { "text": "Bei der Eheschließung vielleicht nicht, da ist das persönliche Erscheinen im im Stand.", "start": 514.195, "end": 518.115 }, { "text": "Es ist immer noch Es", "start": 518.115, "end": 519.03503 } ], "start": 508.22998, "end": 519.03503, "num_words": 37.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "ist zumindest", "start": 519.03503, "end": 519.155 } ], "start": 519.03503, "end": 519.155, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "beliebt beieinander, aber wenigstens bei der Beantwortung.", "start": 519.155, "end": 520.91504 } ], "start": 519.155, "end": 520.91504, "num_words": 7.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Genau, aber bei vielen anderen Verfahren spar ich mir da viel Aufwand und die Behörden untereinander natürlich auch.", "start": 520.91504, "end": 528.05005 } ], "start": 520.91504, "end": 528.05005, "num_words": 18.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja und damit es aber funktioniert, dieses ones only, also damit ich sozusagen zugeordnet werden kann zu meinen Daten, braucht's ja diese Identifikationsnummer und die war ja 'n sehr heißes Eisen am Anfang und wurde viel diskutiert, vielleicht immer noch sogar, ne.", "start": 528.05005, "end": 543.76495 }, { "text": "Warum eigentlich?", "start": 543.76495, "end": 544.90497 } ], "start": 528.05005, "end": 544.90497, "num_words": 44.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das geht zurück auf eine eine eine Jahrzehnte lang, also es gibt bis zurück in den in die in die Siebziger-, Achtzigerjahre, Letztes", "start": 546.165, "end": 554.43 } ], "start": 546.165, "end": 554.43, "num_words": 23.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Volkszählungsurteil ist da das Stichwort, ne, genau.", "start": 554.83, "end": 557.81 }, { "text": "Wo es ja große Proteste gab.", "start": 558.03, "end": 559.49 } ], "start": 554.83, "end": 559.49, "num_words": 13.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Wo das erste Mal darüber intensiv nachgedacht wurde, das war so der der Beginn der elektronischen Verwaltung in Deutschland oder auch weltweit, wo man das erste Mal begonnen hat, auf elektronischen Systemen Daten abzubilden und zu verarbeiten.", "start": 559.79004, "end": 571.845 }, { "text": "Und damals wollte man damit die Volkszählung digitalisieren zu einem sehr frühen Zeitpunkt.", "start": 572.14496, "end": 577.125 }, { "text": "Und damit man das machen kann und sich die Daten von dir Franziska zusammenzuführen, gibt's vielleicht mehrweiser oder auch vielleicht gibt's einen Schreibfehler, nicht?", "start": 577.345, "end": 585.86 }, { "text": "Auch das kann ja passieren.", "start": 585.86, "end": 587.08 }, { "text": "Und dass ich eben hundertprozentig weiß, dass das tatsächlich deine Identität ist und dich die Daten aus den unterschiedlichen Registern zusammenziehen kann, daraus dann eine digitale Volkszählung zu machen, ist das erste Mal die Debatte aufgekommen, dass man so einen eindeutigen Identifier verwendet.", "start": 587.3, "end": 604.365 } ], "start": 559.79004, "end": 604.365, "num_words": 122.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 604.505, "end": 605.005 }, { "text": "Und das zieht sich bis heute und wir sind in der Debatte insgesamt weiter, weil wir weil wir's neue Mechanismen gibt, wie man Datenmissbrauch schützen kann.", "start": 605.22504, "end": 615.27 }, { "text": "Und all diese Varianten des Schutzes vor Datenmissbrauch, die haben wir in der Diskussion des Registermonisierungsgesetzes damals.", "start": 615.65, "end": 622.79004 }, { "text": "Das war eben ja, tatsächlich jetzt schon 5 Jahre her, weil sag mal 2 19 19 20 begonnen zu diskutieren auf der politischen Ebene.", "start": 623.265, "end": 630.16504 }, { "text": "Ja, die die Maßnahmen, die jetzt getroffen werden sind, sind ein mindestzug guter, wenn nicht besserer Schutz vor Datenmissbrauch.", "start": 630.86505, "end": 637.23004 } ], "start": 604.505, "end": 637.23004, "num_words": 87.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, also genau, weil die Angst, die da immer umgeht, ist ja der gläserne Bürger und ich also um's jetzt mal an 'nem Beispiel zu erklären, wäre vielleicht, ich weiß nicht, ich will mein Auto anmelden, identifizier mich und dann weiß der Typ im Kraftfahrzeugamt, ich hab 'n uneheliches Kind.", "start": 637.77, "end": 652.305 }, { "text": "Was was ja überhaupt nichts mit dem Auto zu tun hat.", "start": 652.46497, "end": 654.385 }, { "text": "Also so was geht's, oder?", "start": 654.385, "end": 655.665 } ], "start": 637.77, "end": 655.665, "num_words": 66.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Exakt.", "start": 655.665, "end": 656.145 }, { "text": "Ja.", "start": 656.145, "end": 656.625 }, { "text": "Und also diese Vorstellung, dass wenn wir die Register miteinander vernetzen und eindeutige Identifier zu den jeweiligen Datensätzen hinzufügen, dass dann jede Person innerhalb der Verwaltung darüber suchen kann.", "start": 656.625, "end": 668.5 }, { "text": "Das ist natürlich, ja, das ist 'n falsches Bild, das das teilweise auch gezeichnet worden ist.", "start": 668.8, "end": 673.7 }, { "text": "Wir überprüfen, bevor die Daten überhaupt abgerufen werden, wird überprüft, ob ich deine Daten abrufen darf und dazu muss ich bekannt geben, welches Verfahren nutze ich", "start": 674.24, "end": 684.555 } ], "start": 655.665, "end": 684.555, "num_words": 73.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Genau.", "start": 684.79504, "end": 685.29504 } ], "start": 684.79504, "end": 685.29504, "num_words": 1.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und dann und führt das für das jeweilige Verfahren wird reduziert, welche Datenfelder sind für dieses Verfahren relevant?", "start": 685.59503, "end": 691.935 }, { "text": "Das heißt, ich habe eine Vorabprüfung, also 'n sehr, also besser kann ich eigentlich den Datenschutz gar nicht gewährleisten, indem ich vorab prüfe, ob diese Daten für das Verwaltungsverfahren relevant sind.", "start": 692.075, "end": 702.62 }, { "text": "Und was, glaube ich, ganz wichtig ist und das hat kein anderes Vergleich, also hat kein anderes Land in dieser in dem Ausbau, den wir anstreben, dass die Daten nicht zentralisiert werden, sondern die Daten", "start": 702.62, "end": 714.355 } ], "start": 685.59503, "end": 714.355, "num_words": 84.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Die liegen bei der Gemeinde.", "start": 714.515, "end": 715.715 } ], "start": 714.515, "end": 715.715, "num_words": 5.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Die liegen bei der Gemeinde.", "start": 715.715, "end": 716.195 } ], "start": 715.715, "end": 716.195, "num_words": 5.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Wo ich zum Beispiel geboren bin.", "start": 716.195, "end": 718.195 } ], "start": 716.195, "end": 718.195, "num_words": 6.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Exakt.", "start": 718.195, "end": 718.59503 }, { "text": "Ja.", "start": 718.59503, "end": 718.995 }, { "text": "Oder auf der Landesebene.", "start": 718.995, "end": 719.97504 }, { "text": "Also es wird das eine oder andere gab's ja jetzt schon, also das Flensburger Knöllchenregister", "start": 720.53, "end": 724.71 } ], "start": 718.195, "end": 724.71, "num_words": 21.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "ist,", "start": 725.09, "end": 725.25 } ], "start": 725.09, "end": 725.25, "num_words": 1.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "glaube ich, jedem bekannt.", "start": 725.25, "end": 726.21 }, { "text": "Das ist 'n zentrales Register.", "start": 726.21, "end": 727.49005 }, { "text": "Das heißt, es gibt hin und wieder ein zentrales Register.", "start": 727.49005, "end": 729.89 }, { "text": "Es wird aber sehr viele Register geben, die weiterhin dezentral geführt werden und das ist eine Architektur, die es nach meinem Wissen stand in keinem anderen Land in der in dieser Ausprägung gibt.", "start": 729.89, "end": 742.875 } ], "start": 725.25, "end": 742.875, "num_words": 52.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also da macht man son bisschen eine Tugend aus der föderalen Zersplitterung sozusagen und nutzt arbeitet mit dem, was man da hat Ja.", "start": 742.935, "end": 748.08997 }, { "text": "Letztendlich, ne.", "start": 748.20996, "end": 748.76996 } ], "start": 742.935, "end": 748.76996, "num_words": 25.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und es ist es ist und da sehen wir ja jetzt, wie fragil Demokratien sind.", "start": 748.76996, "end": 753.11 }, { "text": "Es hat auch neben dem Datenschutz auch eine demokratiepolitische Wirkung, weil letztendlich, wenn und da trauen die uns ja fast tagespolitisch nicht mehr über den Teich zu schauen, falls es tatsächlich zu Verschiebungen kommen sollte in der nahen Zukunft oder in der Zukunft, dann könnte rein theoretisch könnte könnte Berlin den den Datensteck erzielen und sagen, ich stelle meine Daten der gesamten Republik nicht mehr zur Verfügung und ich schütze meine Bürger somit, dass dass die Daten genutzt werden können von von einem politischen System.", "start": 753.56995, "end": 786.075 } ], "start": 748.76996, "end": 786.075, "num_words": 100.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ah ja, interessant.", "start": 786.155, "end": 786.955 }, { "text": "Ja, okay.", "start": 786.955, "end": 787.675 }, { "text": "Genau, also wir haben", "start": 787.675, "end": 788.395 } ], "start": 786.155, "end": 788.395, "num_words": 9.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "da verschiedene Schutzmechanismen eingebaut.", "start": 788.395, "end": 790.335 }, { "text": "Peter hat schon gesagt, diese Ex Ante Überprüfung, die da durchgeführt wird.", "start": 790.395, "end": 795.115 }, { "text": "Also ist das überhaupt plausibel, dass eine Behörde zu diesem Zweck auf die und die Daten zugreifen möchte?", "start": 795.115, "end": 799.93005 }, { "text": "Das ist dieses for Corner Modell, also dass ich intermediäre habe zwischen der datenabrufenden Stelle, also dem Data Consumer heißt das dann und dem entsprechenden Register, also dem Data Provider.", "start": 799.93005, "end": 811.71 }, { "text": "Und auf der anderen Seite habe ich aber als Bürger und Bürgerin zum Beispiel auch noch mal 'n Kontrollmechanismen über das sogenannte Datenschutz Cockpit.", "start": 811.93005, "end": 819.205 } ], "start": 788.395, "end": 819.205, "num_words": 88.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also da kann ich gucken, wer hat denn grad so meine Daten abgerufen in Münster", "start": 819.34503, "end": 822.625 } ], "start": 819.34503, "end": 822.625, "num_words": 15.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Zeit, ne?", "start": 822.625, "end": 823.185 } ], "start": 822.625, "end": 823.185, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Bis bis", "start": 823.185, "end": 823.505 } ], "start": 823.185, "end": 823.505, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "2 Jahre in die Vergangenheit hab ich da Protokoll und Inhaltsdaten, kann also gucken, welche Behörde hat wann zu welchem Zweck auf welche Daten zugegriffen und kann dann natürlich auch schauen und und sollte, also das man wird quasi selber so zum Datenschutz beauftragen und genau, soll perspektivisch auch Möglichkeiten haben, dass es aber wirklich noch Zukunftsmusik über dieses Datenschutz Cockpit, das soll irgendwann mal in die Bund ID integriert werden, dann auch mit den Behörden zu interagieren.", "start": 823.505, "end": 853.02496 } ], "start": 823.505, "end": 853.02496, "num_words": 78.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja.", "start": 853.245, "end": 853.745 }, { "text": "Und falls es noch nicht deutlich geworden ist, also diese Identifikationsnummer, das wäre meine EID, oder?", "start": 854.205, "end": 860.07 }, { "text": "Nach der letzten, nee, ist das meine Steuernummer, so ist es, ne?", "start": 860.07, "end": 862.47003 } ], "start": 853.245, "end": 862.47003, "num_words": 29.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ist deine Steuernummer.", "start": 862.47003, "end": 863.27 } ], "start": 862.47003, "end": 863.27, "num_words": 3.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Genau, ja.", "start": 863.27, "end": 864.17004 } ], "start": 863.27, "end": 864.17004, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Du hast schon in unterschiedlichen Verfahren verwendet wurde, deswegen hat man sich auch darauf geeinigt, ist auch eine nicht sprechende Nummer und wird tatsächlich nur in diesem Austausch verwendet.", "start": 864.39, "end": 873.315 }, { "text": "Das heißt, ich kann jetzt nicht mit dieser Nummer suchen.", "start": 873.315, "end": 875.715 }, { "text": "Also was finde ich jetzt mit deiner Steuern?", "start": 875.715, "end": 878.11505 } ], "start": 864.39, "end": 878.11505, "num_words": 47.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also bei nicht sprechend heißt zum Beispiel bei meiner Sozialversicherungsnummer ist ja mein Geburtsdatum drin und das heißt, das ist eine total zufällige Nummer?", "start": 878.11505, "end": 884.03503 }, { "text": "Ja.", "start": 884.03503, "end": 884.195 } ], "start": 878.11505, "end": 884.195, "num_words": 25.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja.", "start": 884.195, "end": 884.515 }, { "text": "Okay.", "start": 884.515, "end": 884.835 }, { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 884.835, "end": 885.315 }, { "text": "Bekommt ja jeder bei und für juristische Personen, also Unternehmen, Freiberufler*innen und so weiter, gibt es eben das entsprechende Pendant, das ist die bundeseinheitliche Wirtschaftsnummer, die eingeführt worden ist.", "start": 885.315, "end": 897.0 } ], "start": 884.195, "end": 897.0, "num_words": 32.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Okay, genau.", "start": 897.0, "end": 897.72003 }, { "text": "Hab ich wirklich bei meinen Kindern zur Geburt gekriegt?", "start": 897.72003, "end": 900.22003 }, { "text": "Hab ich hab ich geschaut.", "start": 900.425, "end": 901.88495 }, { "text": "Eine schöne Begrüßung, genau.", "start": 902.26495, "end": 904.605 }, { "text": "Und dann hat meine Tochter mit 16 den ersten Job gehabt und dann hab ich sie wiedergefunden.", "start": 904.745, "end": 908.44495 } ], "start": 897.0, "end": 908.44495, "num_words": 37.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ah, Gott sei Dank.", "start": 908.82495, "end": 909.865 }, { "text": "Das versuchen.", "start": 909.94495, "end": 910.685 }, { "text": "Ja.", "start": 910.90497, "end": 911.40497 }, { "text": "Okay, genau, aber warum ich jetzt grade auf die eID gekommen bin, ist, also der deutsche Ansatz, der ist eben sehr besonders mit dieser dezentralen Speicherung.", "start": 911.625, "end": 919.22003 }, { "text": "Es gibt aber ja auch andere Ansätze.", "start": 921.36, "end": 923.36 } ], "start": 908.82495, "end": 923.36, "num_words": 40.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also Deutschland ist ja nicht das einzige Land, was an E-Government-Ansätzen arbeitet und zum Beispiel die Schweiz arbeitet mit der eID,", "start": 923.36, "end": 929.54 } ], "start": 923.36, "end": 929.54, "num_words": 21.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "ne?", "start": 930.015, "end": 930.515 }, { "text": "Den von Architekten, wie ich's grad beschrieben hab, die führenden Government Länder setzen auf zentrale Register.", "start": 930.895, "end": 938.115 }, { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 938.175, "end": 938.495 }, { "text": "Also die haben zu einem sehr frühen Zeitpunkt, Estland begonnen, Register zentral aufzubauen, auch in Skandinavien, die auch sehr eng miteinander zu vernetzen.", "start": 938.495, "end": 947.98004 }, { "text": "Die, wenn's gar nicht funktioniert, könnte man sagen, also was was passiert, wenn die Registermodernisierung scheitern sollte?", "start": 948.68, "end": 953.72003 } ], "start": 930.015, "end": 953.72003, "num_words": 58.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja.", "start": 953.72003, "end": 954.22003 }, { "text": "Die Schweiz haben dieses Projekt noch gar nicht so breit gestartet, haben aber eine Art Zwischenlösung gebaut aktuell.", "start": 954.36005, "end": 961.19495 }, { "text": "Da bekomme ich als Bürgerbürerin muss ich auch zu meiner lokalen Behörde einmal mich dort ausweisen und kann aber dann die Daten von der Behörde auf mein Mobiltelefon übertragen", "start": 961.735, "end": 973.09 } ], "start": 953.72003, "end": 973.09, "num_words": 48.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Okay.", "start": 973.41, "end": 973.56995 } ], "start": 973.41, "end": 973.56995, "num_words": 1.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und sie dann wie in 1 elektronischen Dokumentenmappe verspeichern.", "start": 973.73, "end": 976.87 }, { "text": "Hast Du noch seine bekommen aus Mitglieder gefunden?", "start": 976.93, "end": 979.19 } ], "start": 973.73, "end": 979.19, "num_words": 17.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Eine Dokumentenmappe?", "start": 979.57, "end": 980.31 } ], "start": 979.57, "end": 980.31, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Dokumentenmappe, nein.", "start": 980.53, "end": 981.49 } ], "start": 980.53, "end": 981.49, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ich glaube nicht.", "start": 981.49, "end": 982.21 }, { "text": "Tatsächlich.", "start": 982.21, "end": 982.61 }, { "text": "Also ich", "start": 982.61, "end": 982.93 } ], "start": 981.49, "end": 982.93, "num_words": 6.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "hab das noch bekommen, für meinen Eltern ist es tatsächlich eine furchtbare, also also keine Ahnung.", "start": 982.93, "end": 988.385 }, { "text": "Und dann dann sammelst Du drinnen deine", "start": 988.385, "end": 989.985 } ], "start": 982.93, "end": 989.985, "num_words": 23.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Geburts-, Sekund-, Staatsbürger-, Staatsbürger-", "start": 990.22504, "end": 991.84503 } ], "start": 990.22504, "end": 991.84503, "num_words": 4.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "und so weiter.", "start": 992.945, "end": 993.84503 }, { "text": "Dieses Bild, dieser Dokumentenmappe mit den mit den staatlichen mit den staatlich zertifizierten Dokumenten und Stempelmarken gab's damals auch noch.", "start": 994.385, "end": 1003.87 }, { "text": "Das übertragt man quasi auf die mobile Telefonwelt, sodass man, wie wir das kennen von, und jeder von uns hat schon mal eine Bordkarte, in sein Mobiltelefon gespeichert.", "start": 1003.93, "end": 1014.11 }, { "text": "Und das ist das sogenannte Wallet, also wo ich dann meine meine neben meiner Bordkarte dann auch meine Identifikationskarte liegen hab, meiner Staatsbürgerschaft Ja.", "start": 1014.355, "end": 1023.255 }, { "text": "Oder meiner Geburtsurkunde und dieses oder wenn ich Kinder habe, die Daten meiner Kinder.", "start": 1023.715, "end": 1029.015 } ], "start": 992.945, "end": 1029.015, "num_words": 89.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und ich kann dann selbst gesteuert aus meinem elektronischen Dokumentenmappe, EU Wallet, dann in einen Behördenprozess integrieren.", "start": 1029.37, "end": 1038.83 } ], "start": 1029.37, "end": 1038.83, "num_words": 17.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 1039.21, "end": 1039.69 } ], "start": 1039.21, "end": 1039.69, "num_words": 1.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das ist ist eine eine Variante, die in der Schweiz als Übergangslösung gerade versucht will, ausgerollt zu werden, aber auch die Schweiz, ich hab da mit Vertretern gesprochen, streben natürlich auch an, dass sie eine Register, dass sie ihre Register dann auch noch vernetzen zu 'nem späteren Zeitpunkt.", "start": 1039.69, "end": 1056.135 }, { "text": "Okay.", "start": 1056.135, "end": 1056.635 } ], "start": 1039.69, "end": 1056.635, "num_words": 49.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, genau, aber es ist einfach 'n anderer Ansatz, ne.", "start": 1056.775, "end": 1058.9199 }, { "text": "Da bin ich als Bürger in 'ner viel aktiveren Rolle und Du hast ja grad beschrieben Nicole, ich hab ja natürlich Kontrolle auch in dem deutschen Modell, aber da wär ich halt wirklich so, ich geborene euch meine Wallet oder ich geborene euch meine Wallet nicht sozusagen, ne.", "start": 1058.9199, "end": 1069.64 }, { "text": "Da bin ich 'n bisschen in 'ner mächtigeren Position Genau, also", "start": 1069.64, "end": 1073.065 } ], "start": 1056.775, "end": 1073.065, "num_words": 69.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "die da, ne.", "start": 1073.065, "end": 1073.625 }, { "text": "Also muss natürlich auch mehr machen.", "start": 1073.705, "end": 1075.405 }, { "text": "In dem Fall.", "start": 1075.465, "end": 1076.265 }, { "text": "Also ich übermittel dann die Nachweise und in dem anderen Fall liegen sie ja bei der jeweiligen registerführenden Stelle und ich autorisiere nur, dass die anfragende Stelle der Data Consumer für das Verfahren, für das es benötigt wird, diese Daten eben abrufen und nutzen darf.", "start": 1076.265, "end": 1091.2 } ], "start": 1073.065, "end": 1091.2, "num_words": 57.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja.", "start": 1091.2, "end": 1091.7 }, { "text": "Okay.", "start": 1091.84, "end": 1092.32 } ], "start": 1091.2, "end": 1092.32, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Passt aber auch zum zum Schweizer Selbstverständnis 'n bisschen besser, weil ich hab da mit Studierenden in der Schweiz immer wieder diskutiert und die Vorstellung, dass ein ein Verfahren proaktiv, also ohne dass es beantragt wird vom Bürger oder Bürgerin, hat bei den Schweizer Studierenden Kopfschütteln erzeugt.", "start": 1092.32, "end": 1110.525 } ], "start": 1092.32, "end": 1110.525, "num_words": 47.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Was ja in Österreich zum Beispiel der Fall ist mit dem Kindergeld, ne?", "start": 1110.525, "end": 1113.165 }, { "text": "Ja.", "start": 1113.165, "end": 1113.245 }, { "text": "Das kommt einfach.", "start": 1113.245, "end": 1113.885 } ], "start": 1110.525, "end": 1113.885, "num_words": 17.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das kommt einfach.", "start": 1113.885, "end": 1114.125 } ], "start": 1113.885, "end": 1114.125, "num_words": 3.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Da muss ich nix machen.", "start": 1114.125, "end": 1115.085 } ], "start": 1114.125, "end": 1115.085, "num_words": 5.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Nein, ich beantrage es nicht mehr, sondern ich direkt überwiesen.", "start": 1115.085, "end": 1117.8701 } ], "start": 1115.085, "end": 1117.8701, "num_words": 10.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und das wäre 'nem Schweizer suspekt.", "start": 1118.01, "end": 1119.39 } ], "start": 1118.01, "end": 1119.39, "num_words": 6.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das wär dem Schweizer, also das dem dem Schweizer und der Schweizerin absolut suspekt, weil sie sagen, also als als Bürger und Bürgerin bin ich selbstbestimmt, ich hab auch eine Verantwortung, dass ich mich meine Verwaltungsverfahren selbstständig kümmere.", "start": 1119.6101, "end": 1132.43 }, { "text": "Und nicht, dass der Staat als großer als großer Bruder sich fortlaufend darum sorgt oder große Schwester, je nachdem wie man das das jetzt vom Bild her betrachten möchte, darum sorgt, dass ich gewisse Transferleistungen voll automatisiert zugestellt bekomme.", "start": 1132.835, "end": 1146.855 }, { "text": "Also das kann man durchaus, da sieht man schon, da wird's ein wirklich auch Ist", "start": 1147.15, "end": 1149.63 } ], "start": 1119.6101, "end": 1149.63, "num_words": 92.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "interessanter wird's dann so kulturell auch, ne, irgendwie und ja sehr individuell für jedes Land.", "start": 1149.63, "end": 1153.97 } ], "start": 1149.63, "end": 1153.97, "num_words": 15.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Aktuell ist es aber, ist Deutschland doch eher an der aktiven am aktiven Transfer orientiert, wenn wir ja in die politische Debatte schauen.", "start": 1154.03, "end": 1162.19 } ], "start": 1154.03, "end": 1162.19, "num_words": 23.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, Okay.", "start": 1162.19, "end": 1163.265 }, { "text": "Und wo stehen wir im Zeitplan?", "start": 1163.725, "end": 1165.665 }, { "text": "Also Herbst 2025, wir haben dieses Jahrzehnteprojekt.", "start": 1165.725, "end": 1168.785 }, { "text": "Sind wir in der Hälfte?", "start": 1169.885, "end": 1170.945 }, { "text": "Sind wir gut dabei?", "start": 1172.205, "end": 1173.085 } ], "start": 1162.19, "end": 1173.085, "num_words": 24.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Wo stehen wir denn grade?", "start": 1173.085, "end": 1174.385 } ], "start": 1173.085, "end": 1174.385, "num_words": 5.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, schwierig zu sagen.", "start": 1175.73, "end": 1176.61 }, { "text": "Ich hab am Anfang ja schon gesagt, erst mal ging es ja darum, die ganzen Grundlagen zu schaffen.", "start": 1176.61, "end": 1180.61 }, { "text": "Also das Registermodernisierungsgesetz, ich hab das OZG Änderungsgesetz seit 20 24 in Kraft, wo ich zum ersten Mal eine Generalklausel habe tatsächlich für diesen automatisierten Nachweisabruf.", "start": 1180.61, "end": 1191.3151 }, { "text": "Das Identifikationsnummerngesetz musste auf den Weg gebracht werden und natürlich waren auch an diversen Fachgesetzen und noch Änderungen vorzunehmen, Bundesmeldegesetz beispielsweise.", "start": 1193.375, "end": 1203.795 }, { "text": "Datenschutzrechtliche Aspekte waren zu beachten.", "start": 1204.39, "end": 1206.65 } ], "start": 1175.73, "end": 1206.65, "num_words": 74.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Dann haben wir jetzt den Staatsvertrag, der ist der geschlossen worden ist.", "start": 1207.4299, "end": 1211.11 }, { "text": "Das sind Bund und Ländern.", "start": 1211.11, "end": 1212.23 }, { "text": "Genau, wo es die technische Infrastruktur geht.", "start": 1212.23, "end": 1215.83 }, { "text": "Das ist das National Oneless only, nee, only, nee, National Onees Only Technical System.", "start": 1215.83, "end": 1221.0349 }, { "text": "Doch genau, Notes.", "start": 1221.0349, "end": 1221.995 } ], "start": 1207.4299, "end": 1221.995, "num_words": 41.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Zum Glück, ja.", "start": 1221.995, "end": 1222.3949 } ], "start": 1221.995, "end": 1222.3949, "num_words": 3.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Kurz?", "start": 1222.3949, "end": 1222.8949 }, { "text": "Ja.", "start": 1223.115, "end": 1223.615 }, { "text": "Genau, der ist jetzt vom Bundeskabinett auch bereits ratifiziert worden.", "start": 1224.715, "end": 1228.6549 }, { "text": "Also es waren erst mal in rechtlicher Hinsicht sehr viele Voraussetzungen zu schaffen, aber gleichzeitig wurde natürlich auch schon an der technischen Umsetzung gearbeitet.", "start": 1228.7949, "end": 1238.4401 }, { "text": "Also es wurden proof of concepts erstellt für die technischen Komponenten.", "start": 1238.8201, "end": 1243.3201 } ], "start": 1222.3949, "end": 1243.3201, "num_words": 47.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Die Umsetzung wurde vorbereitet, der dieses Datenschutz Cockpit, was wir erwähnt haben, das ist schon mal in den Pilotbetrieb gegangen.", "start": 1243.7001, "end": 1251.975 }, { "text": "Genau und das ist son bisschen, ich weiß, man son bisschen die Vorarbeiten und wo wir jetzt stehen, ist eigentlich bei der praktischen Umsetzung, wo es dann darum geht, das Ganze tatsächlich zu erproben, grade dieses Notes auch.", "start": 1253.155, "end": 1267.7201 }, { "text": "Da ist jetzt die Referenzumgebung steht zur Verfügung.", "start": 1267.7201, "end": 1270.68 }, { "text": "Da haben sich auch schon einige Behörden als Data Consumer und Data Provider angeschlossen.", "start": 1270.68, "end": 1275.4249 }, { "text": "Ich glaube, letzter Stand waren 12, die das mal erprobt haben, wie dieses Zusammenspiel überhaupt funktioniert, ob ihre Systeme auch dafür bereit sind, da tatsächlich, wenn das dann irgendwann in den Produktivbetrieb geht, angeschlossen zu werden.", "start": 1275.565, "end": 1290.3049 } ], "start": 1243.7001, "end": 1290.3049, "num_words": 116.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Genau, und auf der anderen Seite geht's halt dieses ganze Identitäts Access Management.", "start": 1290.66, "end": 1295.4 }, { "text": "Auch da startet jetzt grade der Roll out.", "start": 1296.18, "end": 1299.0 }, { "text": "Also wir sind grade so am Anfang der großen Welle, wo es jetzt wirklich darum geht, die technische Umsetzung zu erproben und weiterzuentwickeln, das dann irgendwann in den Produktivbetrieb überführen zu können.", "start": 1299.38, "end": 1310.3251 } ], "start": 1290.66, "end": 1310.3251, "num_words": 53.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 1310.3251, "end": 1310.485 }, { "text": "Und wo es ja dann auch relevant wird für die einzelnen Behörden, würdet ihr sagen, hier auf der Messe, ist es schon so Kaffeeschlangen Talk?", "start": 1310.485, "end": 1317.865 }, { "text": "Also sind die alle so, huh, jetzt kommt die Registermodernisierung irgendwie oder ist es noch gar nicht so angekommen in der Fläche?", "start": 1317.925, "end": 1323.61 } ], "start": 1310.3251, "end": 1323.61, "num_words": 48.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also ich finde schon, das Bewusstsein ist dafür gewachsen, dass man an der Registermodernisierung eigentlich eigentlich gar nicht vorbeikommt und dass das wirklich ja auch alle betrifft von vom Bund bis zur kleinsten Kommune.", "start": 1324.23, "end": 1336.905 }, { "text": "Und ja, ich finde, man findet das hier im Programm auch wieder auf der Smart Country Convention.", "start": 1338.085, "end": 1342.985 }, { "text": "Wir sind ja nicht die einzige Veranstaltung, die sich dem Thema widmet.", "start": 1343.045, "end": 1347.545 }, { "text": "Auch in den Vorjahren gab's Veranstaltungen dazu und diesmal war das sogar 1, der relativ, ich glaub, man konnte so 8 zwischen 8 verschiedenen Tags oder so auswählen für die Veranstaltung und Registermodernisierung war dabei, also anscheinend auch von Bitkom als 1 der Topthemen identifiziert hier auf jeden Fall.", "start": 1347.74, "end": 1365.4349 } ], "start": 1324.23, "end": 1365.4349, "num_words": 112.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Okay.", "start": 1365.575, "end": 1366.075 }, { "text": "Ihr, die ihr jetzt ja nah dran seid daran, könnt ihr auch sagen, jetzt in dieser Phase, die hier jetzt ansteht, also in diesem Roll out, da gibt's Sachen, da wissen wir jetzt schon, die werden herausfordernd sein, weiß ich nicht genau.", "start": 1366.695, "end": 1380.32 }, { "text": "Bei der bei der Software, bei also kann man son bisschen absehen, wo es dann vielleicht auch mal 'n bisschen haken könnte jetzt in der Phase?", "start": 1380.32, "end": 1388.02 } ], "start": 1365.575, "end": 1388.02, "num_words": 69.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Es hakt an den Stellen, wo Du letztendlich die die die Mitarbeit aller brauchst.", "start": 1389.395, "end": 1396.615 }, { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 1396.755, "end": 1397.235 }, { "text": "Ich glaub, das ist jetzt so 'n Punkt, das ist kein Projekt, das der Bund alleine machen kann.", "start": 1397.235, "end": 1401.155 }, { "text": "Nicht, also die die das Notsystem, also dieses dieses System, dass Du diese Vernetzung von der Bund auf die Landesebene auf die kommunale Ebene hin bekommst, ist ein ist ein ein Element.", "start": 1401.155, "end": 1413.4401 }, { "text": "Die Länder müssen aber alle jetzt beginnen, ihre eigenen Hausaufgaben zu machen.", "start": 1414.06, "end": 1418.14 } ], "start": 1389.395, "end": 1418.14, "num_words": 77.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und ich glaub, das wird vielfach noch unterschätzt, beginnt jetzt, also Ja.", "start": 1418.14, "end": 1421.235 }, { "text": "Wird gerade letzte Woche hatten wir eine eine Konferenz am Fraunhofer Fokus.", "start": 1421.395, "end": 1426.695 }, { "text": "Da war schön zu sehen, dass sowohl Brandenburg als auch Sachsen Anhalt jetzt beginnen, sone Art Dateninventur auch zu machen.", "start": 1427.075, "end": 1434.1699 }, { "text": "Also welche Daten habe ich denn überhaupt in meinen Systemen gespeichert?", "start": 1434.1699, "end": 1437.15 }, { "text": "Welche Daten liegen auf der kommunalen Ebene?", "start": 1437.45, "end": 1439.71 } ], "start": 1418.14, "end": 1439.71, "num_words": 62.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und jetzt darüber nachzudenken, wie können wir wie können wir unsere Daten viel besser nutzen in unseren Verwaltungsverfahren?", "start": 1439.77, "end": 1445.71 }, { "text": "Weil typischerweise lebst Du ja in 1 Stadt in einem Land.", "start": 1446.4249, "end": 1449.885 }, { "text": "Die Ausnahme ist schon, wenn Du in 2 unterschiedlichen Ländern irgendwie Niederlassungen hast, vielleicht noch Berlin Brandenburg, aber das ist dann eher schon die Ausnahme, nicht?", "start": 1450.025, "end": 1459.065 }, { "text": "Also die die größeren Teil kannst Du ganz sicher damit gut abholen, wenn Du in ein an einem Ort ein gutes Datenmanagement hast, in Kombination mit dem mit dem jeweiligen Land, das rund den Ort ist.", "start": 1459.065, "end": 1471.0 }, { "text": "Und diese Erkenntnis, dass das jetzt beginnt, Schleswig Holstein hat schon vor Jahren damit begonnen, die eigenen Daten zu erheben und eine eigene Strategie zu entwickeln, wie gehen wir mit unseren Daten aus der Landes- und auf der kommunalen Ebene ist, glaube ich, jetzt 'n wichtiger wichtiger nächster Schritt.", "start": 1471.2999, "end": 1485.285 } ], "start": 1439.77, "end": 1485.285, "num_words": 140.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 1485.285, "end": 1485.445 }, { "text": "Okay, das wär einfach, dass wir da auch unterschiedliche Geschwindigkeiten haben, Ja.", "start": 1485.445, "end": 1488.54 }, { "text": "Aber es müssen eben alle im Ziel ankommen am Ende sozusagen, ne?", "start": 1488.58, "end": 1491.54 }, { "text": "Und das son bisschen Ja.", "start": 1491.54, "end": 1492.8999 }, { "text": "Zu managen und", "start": 1492.98, "end": 1493.86 } ], "start": 1485.285, "end": 1493.86, "num_words": 33.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "und mhm.", "start": 1493.86, "end": 1494.26 }, { "text": "Und dann ziehst Du und dann kann man kann man sich das bildlich vorstellen und dann kannst Du einzelne Register rausziehen, die vielleicht einfacher zu entwickeln sind, weil Du gut mit Sachsoftwareherstellern eng zusammenarbeitest, weil viele Daten liegen, also sind bereits liegen bereits digital vor, liegen aber in den jeweiligen in der jeweiligen Software der Kommune oder auf der Landesebene.", "start": 1494.26, "end": 1514.7749 }, { "text": "Und da gilt's jetzt, mit diesen mit diesen Herstellern eng zusammenzuarbeiten, weil wenn man mit der dort keine Vereinbarung findet für gemeinsame Schnittstellen, dann wird's schwer, dass man auf diese Daten tatsächlich sinnvoll zugreifen kann.", "start": 1515.23, "end": 1528.93 }, { "text": "Und da sehe ich jetzt sehr viel positive Bewegung.", "start": 1529.185, "end": 1531.8251 }, { "text": "Also ich bin jetzt in den letzten Monaten viel optimistischer geworden, dass wir jetzt größere Schritte in naher Zukunft sehen, wo das eine oder andere Register vielleicht dieses Jahr auch noch in dem Registerverbund quasi mit aufgenommen werden kann und Länder auch fortnehmen, eigene Strategien entwickeln, ihre Daten gut in die Verwaltungsverfahren zu bringen.", "start": 1531.8251, "end": 1553.03 } ], "start": 1493.86, "end": 1553.03, "num_words": 160.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Aber es klingt jetzt, ums vielleicht mal positiv noch zu formulieren, als gäb's da auch so Neben Benefits, ne.", "start": 1553.57, "end": 1558.525 }, { "text": "Neben okay, wir sind jetzt register modernisiert sozusagen, also sowas wie eine Dateninventur, was Du sagst.", "start": 1558.525, "end": 1563.485 }, { "text": "Also das klingt, als wär das sone Gelegenheit, mal son Grundputz zu machen und eine Bestandsaufnahme von, was nutzen wir eigentlich für Software, was haben wir eigentlich für Daten und so weiter.", "start": 1563.485, "end": 1572.125 }, { "text": "Also oder?", "start": 1572.125, "end": 1573.105 } ], "start": 1553.57, "end": 1573.105, "num_words": 69.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Absolut, also da da kommen jetzt auch unterschiedliche Entwicklungen zusammen.", "start": 1573.41, "end": 1577.01 }, { "text": "Da kommt jetzt tatsächlich der der Data Act der Europäischen Union uns zugute, weil der wirkt jetzt auch.", "start": 1577.01, "end": 1583.3301 }, { "text": "Der sieht so was auch vor, dass Organisationen das machen müssen und das fällt jetzt zeitlich sehr, sehr gut zusammen.", "start": 1583.3301, "end": 1588.465 } ], "start": 1573.41, "end": 1588.465, "num_words": 48.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also dass es einfach auch wie sone Art Zeitfrist gibt und 'n bisschen Druck, der ja von außen kommt.", "start": 1588.465, "end": 1592.225 }, { "text": "Ja.", "start": 1592.225, "end": 1592.465 } ], "start": 1588.465, "end": 1592.465, "num_words": 20.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja.", "start": 1592.465, "end": 1592.625 }, { "text": "Mhm.", "start": 1592.625, "end": 1592.865 }, { "text": "Das sind jetzt unterschiedliche Faktoren, die jetzt, glaub ich, gut zusammenspielen und ja, jetzt doch leicht optimistisch nach vorne schau, dass wir gute Ergebnisse die wir gute Ergebnisse in den nächsten 2, 3 Jahre sehen werden.", "start": 1592.865, "end": 1602.66 }, { "text": "Ich habe ja nicht damit gemeint, dass wir 10 Jahre lang warten müssen, bis wir das erste Register haben.", "start": 1602.88, "end": 1607.22 }, { "text": "Die 10 Jahre haben sich darauf bezogen, dass wir beispielsweise einen vollelektronischen, ohne dass wir hochrechnen müssen, einen vollelektronischen Zensus machen können.", "start": 1607.44, "end": 1613.2582 } ], "start": 1592.465, "end": 1613.2582, "num_words": 79.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also mit mit Echtdaten ohne einen vollelektronischen Zensus machen können.", "start": 1613.2582, "end": 1616.045 }, { "text": "Also mit mit Echtdaten, ohne statistisch hochgerechnet zu werden.", "start": 1616.045, "end": 1619.5851 }, { "text": "Und das, weil dazu brauche ich nicht ein Register, dazu brauche ich die 30 Register, damit ich so einen voll digitalen Zensus machen kann mit Echtdaten.", "start": 1619.805, "end": 1628.385 } ], "start": 1613.2582, "end": 1628.385, "num_words": 45.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, und das wär sone Art, ja, nicht Goldstandard, aber son, ne, wo man sagen könnte, das wär mal echt 'n Ziel.", "start": 1628.525, "end": 1634.26 } ], "start": 1628.525, "end": 1634.26, "num_words": 22.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, wenn Du da wenn Du das erreichst, da hast Du schon wirklich sehr viele, also da musst Du die die die Daten, die relevant sind, grade aus der Bürger- und Bürgerinnensicht für die täglichen Verfahren oder für die Verfahren, die regelmäßig vorkommen, die hast Du dann tatsächlich digitalisiert und verfügbar gemacht.", "start": 1634.26, "end": 1650.075 } ], "start": 1634.26, "end": 1650.075, "num_words": 52.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja.", "start": 1650.075, "end": 1650.575 }, { "text": "Was vielleicht noch wichtig ist zu erwähnen, Du hast auch gesagt, es gibt eben auch EU Regulatorik in dem Moment und es ist ja auch so gedacht, dass, mal angenommen, ich würde ein Eastländer heiraten wollen und Estland ist ja sehr weit eben, die könnten dann auch EU weit ausgetauscht werden, ne.", "start": 1650.635, "end": 1663.14 }, { "text": "Das ist vielleicht noch mal wichtig zu betonen.", "start": 1663.14, "end": 1664.84 } ], "start": 1650.075, "end": 1664.84, "num_words": 61.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das ist das ist weit von der Europäischen Union her, deswegen heißt es auch National Infrastructure, also dass Du dann zwischen den Nationen, also dass jeder jeder Mitgliedsstaat muss einen Not betreiben und zwischen diesen Notsknoten werden dann die Daten ausgetauscht.", "start": 1665.22, "end": 1679.145 }, { "text": "Ich seh diese Entwicklung aber relativ skeptisch, ganz ehrlich zu sein, Okay.", "start": 1679.8451, "end": 1684.32 }, { "text": "Weil der Mehrwert sehr überschaubar sein wird, weil Du, ich hab zuerst schon das Beispiel gebracht, Du lebst wahrscheinlich hauptsächlich in Berlin und vielleicht hast Du noch 'n Nebenwohnsitz Ja.", "start": 1684.5599, "end": 1692.32 }, { "text": "In Brandenburg.", "start": 1692.6399, "end": 1693.46 }, { "text": "Die Wahrscheinlichkeit, dass Du auch in Österreich lebst, wird schon sehr gering.", "start": 1693.9199, "end": 1696.5599 } ], "start": 1665.22, "end": 1696.5599, "num_words": 97.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also ich gehör noch dazu, also ich, aber Du hast einfach dann", "start": 1696.5599, "end": 1700.0249 } ], "start": 1696.5599, "end": 1700.0249, "num_words": 12.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Nicht so viele Anwendungsfälle und dafür 'n relativ großen Aufwand.", "start": 1700.2649, "end": 1702.745 } ], "start": 1700.2649, "end": 1702.745, "num_words": 10.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Und Du fokussierst dann, wo wo empfängt Du deine Sozialleistungen in einem Staat und da auf den auf den fokussierst Du dann und schaust, dass Du dort gut mit 1 IT ausgestattet bist, mit 1 Zustellung ausgestattet bist.", "start": 1702.745, "end": 1714.6 }, { "text": "Also ich glaub, dass da diese grenzüberschreitenden Wirkungen überschaubarer sind, als man das in der Debatte, glaube ich, darstellt.", "start": 1714.6, "end": 1721.34 }, { "text": "Anders bei der Wirtschaft, da hast Du natürlich wesentlich stärker schon die Verbreitung über ganz Deutschland.", "start": 1721.5599, "end": 1727.235 }, { "text": "Also als Wirtschafts- und als erfolgreiches Wirtschaftsunternehmen habe ich mehrere Standorte in Deutschland, aber vielleicht auch in der Europäischen Union.", "start": 1727.235, "end": 1733.395 }, { "text": "Also was Daten der Wirtschaft betrifft, da sind die Potenziale wesentlich größer im also im den diesen Mehrwerte dann erheben zu können.", "start": 1733.395, "end": 1741.65 } ], "start": 1702.745, "end": 1741.65, "num_words": 115.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, okay.", "start": 1741.65, "end": 1742.53 }, { "text": "Aber Du hast", "start": 1742.53, "end": 1743.01 } ], "start": 1741.65, "end": 1743.01, "num_words": 5.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "recht, das sind also tatsächlich Entwicklungen, die jetzt parallel laufen auf deutscher nationaler Ebene eben mit dem Registermodernisierungsgesetz und auf der EU Ebene mit der Single Digital Gateway Verordnung.", "start": 1743.01, "end": 1753.885 }, { "text": "Dazu haben wir ja auch mal einen einen eigenen Podcast gemacht.", "start": 1753.9451, "end": 1757.165 }, { "text": "Da war ja tatsächlich die Idee, dass über die nationalen once only technical Systems über eine intermedäre Plattform verbunden sind, über nationale Delivery Access Points und dann da eben Nachweise auch grenzüberschreitend ausgetauscht werden können, so wie's eben mit dem Registermodernisierungsgesetz auch angedacht ist.", "start": 1757.305, "end": 1778.3201 }, { "text": "Da war die Frist mal, dass das umgesetzt sein sollte im Dezember 20 23.", "start": 1778.3201, "end": 1782.455 } ], "start": 1743.01, "end": 1782.455, "num_words": 98.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, vorbei.", "start": 1782.5549, "end": 1783.6549 }, { "text": "Das hat, ja,", "start": 1783.715, "end": 1784.6749 } ], "start": 1782.5549, "end": 1784.6749, "num_words": 5.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "das hat aber nicht nur Deutschland nicht geschafft, das hat tatsächlich kein EU", "start": 1784.6749, "end": 1787.635 } ], "start": 1784.6749, "end": 1787.635, "num_words": 13.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Okay, EU ganz ambitioniert.", "start": 1787.715, "end": 1789.4149 } ], "start": 1787.715, "end": 1789.4149, "num_words": 4.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Das war tatsächlich zu ambitioniert.", "start": 1789.875, "end": 1791.335 }, { "text": "Also wir sehen ja schon, wie komplex das auf der nationalen Ebene ist und wenn man sich das dann EU weit anschaut, dann haben wir natürlich noch mal ganz andere auch technische Systeme, Zuständigkeiten, gesetzliche Grundlagen.", "start": 1791.635, "end": 1803.7 }, { "text": "Also da steigt die Komplexität dann ja noch mal enorm.", "start": 1803.84, "end": 1806.5 } ], "start": 1789.875, "end": 1806.5, "num_words": 51.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja.", "start": 1806.64, "end": 1807.065 }, { "text": "Okay, also uns stehen spannende Jahre bevor.", "start": 1807.945, "end": 1810.1849 }, { "text": "Wollt ihr noch mal sagen, wie ihr vom Fraunhofer Kompetenzzentrum für öffentliche IT diesen Prozess jetzt begleitet?", "start": 1810.1849, "end": 1815.7849 }, { "text": "Also da haben ja bestimmt viele Leute fragen, müssen sich neues Wissen drauf schaffen?", "start": 1815.7849, "end": 1819.945 }, { "text": "Was was habt ihr da im Angebot?", "start": 1819.945, "end": 1821.485 } ], "start": 1806.64, "end": 1821.485, "num_words": 46.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Also wir haben unterschiedlich Wissenschaftlerinnen eingeladen, Blogbeiträge zu schreiben, weil das ja so vielfältige Dimensionen hat, das Thema und bereiten jetzt diese Boxserie gerade vor und laden aber natürlich auch Praktiker und Praktikerinnen ein, ihren aktuellen Stand zu teilen, sodass man ein jetzt eine gute Übersicht darüber bekommen, wo stehen wir denn eigentlich mit der Registermodernisierung und was müssten wir tun, damit wir es erfolgreich umsetzen können?", "start": 1822.1849, "end": 1845.415 }, { "text": "Das ist so ein ein Teil, auf den wir gerade fokussieren und sonst natürlich auch immer wieder im Austausch mit den Kommunen und den Ländern und dem ja, dem jetzigen neuen Ministerium für Digitalisierung, Staatsmodernisierung, wo das natürlich 'n ganz großes Thema ist.", "start": 1845.415, "end": 1859.18 } ], "start": 1822.1849, "end": 1859.18, "num_words": 110.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Ja, genau und Peter hat es ja schon gesagt, also jetzt ist eben das Interessante, wie auch die Länder beispielsweise damit umgehen, ihre Datenbestände zu sichten und zu modernisieren und bereit zu machen für die Registermodernisierung und das haben wir eigentlich auch als als eine der wesentlichen Fragestellungen aktuell identifiziert.", "start": 1859.18, "end": 1878.4401 }, { "text": "Deswegen ist auch geplant, dass wir uns in 1 Studie anschauen, wie eben in den Ländern das Vorgehen ist, die Registermodernisierung umzusetzen.", "start": 1878.4401, "end": 1886.78 }, { "text": "Werden da also eine vergleichende Studie machen, wo wir uns dann einige einige bundesdeutsche Länder einmal 'n bisschen genauer angucken, denn es gibt", "start": 1887.24, "end": 1893.9349 } ], "start": 1859.18, "end": 1893.9349, "num_words": 95.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "ja", "start": 1893.9349, "end": 1894.095 } ], "start": 1893.9349, "end": 1894.095, "num_words": 1.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "durchaus noch verschiedene Möglichkeiten, wie das Vorgehen da aussehen kann.", "start": 1894.095, "end": 1897.695 } ], "start": 1894.095, "end": 1897.695, "num_words": 10.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Okay, son bisschen Richtung Best Practice und Austausch und ja.", "start": 1897.695, "end": 1901.0549 }, { "text": "Okay.", "start": 1901.0549, "end": 1901.375 }, { "text": "Genau.", "start": 1901.375, "end": 1901.855 }, { "text": "Ja, total spannend.", "start": 1901.855, "end": 1903.075 }, { "text": "Ja, dann danke ich euch beiden fürs Dabeisein.", "start": 1903.4501, "end": 1905.39 } ], "start": 1897.695, "end": 1905.39, "num_words": 23.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Peter Pariczek, Leiter des Kompetenzzentrums öffentlicher IT und Nicole Opiella, stellvertretende Leiterin des öfit.", "start": 1905.4501, "end": 1911.29 }, { "text": "Schön, dass ihr da wart.", "start": 1911.29, "end": 1912.25 } ], "start": 1905.4501, "end": 1912.25, "num_words": 19.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Danke dir.", "start": 1912.25, "end": 1912.9701 } ], "start": 1912.25, "end": 1912.9701, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 2 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Danke.", "start": 1912.9701, "end": 1913.4701 }, { "text": "Das", "start": 1914.3301, "end": 1914.8301 } ], "start": 1912.9701, "end": 1914.8301, "num_words": 2.0, "speaker": 1 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "war Digital, diesmal als Liveaufzeichnung von der Smart Country Convention in Berlin.", "start": 1915.13, "end": 1920.675 }, { "text": "Die Blogbeiträge zum Thema Registermodernisierung findet ihr zusammen mit vielen anderen hilfreichen Infos auf öFIT Punkt d e mit o e geschrieben.", "start": 1920.9751, "end": 1928.275 }, { "text": "Und diesen Podcast, den findet ihr auf allen gängigen Podcastportalen.", "start": 1928.7799, "end": 1931.6 }, { "text": "Da könnt ihr uns auch abonnieren und dann bekommt ihr immer eine Erinnerung, wenn eine neue Folge erscheint.", "start": 1931.98, "end": 1936.88 }, { "text": "Ich verabschiede mich für heute.", "start": 1937.34, "end": 1938.7 } ], "start": 1915.13, "end": 1938.7, "num_words": 67.0, "speaker": 0 }, { "sentences": [ { "text": "Mein Name ist Franziska Walser.", "start": 1938.7, "end": 1940.14 }, { "text": "Tschüs, bis bald.", "start": 1940.14, "end": 1948.9536 } ], "start": 1938.7, "end": 1948.9536, "num_words": 8.0, "speaker": 0 } ] }, "entities": null, "translations": null, 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Ja.", "words": [ { "word": "erinnerst", "start": 93.46999, "end": 93.78999, "confidence": 0.9995117, "punctuated_word": "Erinnerst", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6466458 }, { "word": "du", "start": 93.78999, "end": 93.95, "confidence": 0.9980469, "punctuated_word": "Du", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6466458 }, { "word": "dich", "start": 93.95, "end": 94.42999, "confidence": 0.9975586, "punctuated_word": "dich?", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6466458 }, { "word": "ja", "start": 94.42999, "end": 94.92999, "confidence": 0.9995117, "punctuated_word": "Ja.", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.5856724 } ], "speaker": 0, "id": "8e58634e-446f-4943-9eba-bf21fa5b5707" }, { "start": 95.284996, "end": 98.424995, "confidence": 0.96814907, "channel": 0, "transcript": "Und war das eine Metapher oder meinen wir das ernst? 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"erfolgreich umgesetzt wäre? Also Status quo erst mal. Bei mir ist länger her, dass ich geheiratet hab. Ich hab auch in Amerika geheiratet. Ich ich weiß es wirklich nicht. 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Also es ist nicht so, dass wir jetzt damit beginnen müssen, vom Papier alles in die die digitale Welt überzutragen. Kommt auch immer drauf an, muss man dann immer von Fall zu Fall sehr detailliert schauen. 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Und dann und führt das für das jeweilige Verfahren wird reduziert, welche Datenfelder sind für dieses Verfahren relevant? 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Also ist das überhaupt plausibel, dass eine Behörde zu diesem Zweck auf die und die Daten zugreifen möchte? Das ist dieses for Corner Modell, also dass ich intermediäre", "words": [ { "word": "die", "start": 793.59503, "end": 793.835, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "die", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.82932603 }, { "word": "da", "start": 793.835, "end": 794.075, "confidence": 0.99609375, "punctuated_word": "da", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.82932603 }, { "word": "durchgeführt", "start": 794.075, "end": 794.575, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "durchgeführt", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.82932603 }, { "word": "wird", "start": 794.715, "end": 795.115, "confidence": 0.79248047, "punctuated_word": "wird.", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.82932603 }, { "word": "also", "start": 795.115, "end": 795.435, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "Also", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.82932603 }, { "word": "ist", "start": 795.435, "end": 795.59503, "confidence": 0.98291016, "punctuated_word": "ist", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.82932603 }, { 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Und auf der anderen Seite habe ich aber als Bürger und Bürgerin zum Beispiel auch noch mal 'n Kontrollmechanismen", "words": [ { "word": "stelle", "start": 806.01, "end": 806.25, "confidence": 0.9951172, "punctuated_word": "Stelle,", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.8829504 }, { "word": "also", "start": 806.25, "end": 806.49005, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "also", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.8829504 }, { "word": "dem", "start": 806.49005, "end": 806.73004, "confidence": 0.9941406, "punctuated_word": "dem", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.8829504 }, { "word": "data", "start": 806.73004, "end": 806.97003, "confidence": 0.97998047, "punctuated_word": "Data", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.8829504 }, { "word": "consumer", "start": 806.97003, "end": 807.45, "confidence": 0.99853516, "punctuated_word": "Consumer", "speaker": 2, "speaker_confidence": 0.8829504 }, { "word": "heißt", "start": 807.45, "end": 807.69, "confidence": 0.9707031, 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Also da kann ich gucken, wer hat denn grad so meine Daten abgerufen in Münster Zeit, ne? 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Das heißt, ich kann jetzt nicht mit dieser Nummer suchen. Also was finde ich jetzt mit deiner Steuern? Also bei nicht sprechend heißt zum Beispiel bei meiner Sozialversicherungsnummer", "words": [ { "word": "und", "start": 870.39, "end": 870.63, "confidence": 0.9003906, "punctuated_word": "und", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7581638 }, { "word": "wird", "start": 870.63, "end": 870.87, "confidence": 0.9980469, "punctuated_word": "wird", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7581638 }, { "word": "tatsächlich", "start": 870.87, "end": 871.37, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "tatsächlich", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7581638 }, { "word": "nur", "start": 871.51, "end": 871.75, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "nur", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7581638 }, { "word": "in", "start": 871.75, "end": 871.91003, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "in", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7581638 }, { "word": "diesem", "start": 871.91003, "end": 872.31, "confidence": 0.8442383, "punctuated_word": "diesem", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7581638 }, { 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Ja. Ja. Okay. Mhm. Bekommt ja jeder bei und für juristische Personen, also Unternehmen, Freiberufler*innen", "words": [ { "word": "ist", "start": 880.835, "end": 880.91504, "confidence": 0.8989258, "punctuated_word": "ist", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.57956034 }, { "word": "ja", "start": 880.91504, "end": 881.075, "confidence": 0.9980469, "punctuated_word": "ja", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.57956034 }, { "word": "mein", "start": 881.075, "end": 881.23505, "confidence": 0.9970703, "punctuated_word": "mein", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.57956034 }, { "word": "geburtsdatum", "start": 881.23505, "end": 881.715, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "Geburtsdatum", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.57956034 }, { "word": "drin", "start": 881.715, "end": 882.03503, "confidence": 0.99121094, "punctuated_word": "drin", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.57956034 }, { "word": "und", "start": 882.03503, "end": 882.11505, "confidence": 0.50390625, "punctuated_word": "und", 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Okay, genau. Hab ich wirklich bei meinen Kindern zur Geburt gekriegt? 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Und dann hat meine Tochter mit 16 den ersten Job gehabt und dann hab ich sie wiedergefunden.", "words": [ { "word": "genau", "start": 904.105, "end": 904.605, "confidence": 0.7175293, "punctuated_word": "genau.", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.3395524 }, { "word": "und", "start": 904.745, "end": 904.985, "confidence": 0.70996094, "punctuated_word": "Und", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.3395524 }, { "word": "dann", "start": 904.985, "end": 905.14496, "confidence": 0.5961914, "punctuated_word": "dann", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.3395524 }, { "word": "hat", "start": 905.14496, "end": 905.305, "confidence": 0.99609375, "punctuated_word": "hat", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.3395524 }, { "word": "meine", "start": 905.305, "end": 905.625, "confidence": 0.8745117, "punctuated_word": "meine", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.3395524 }, { "word": "tochter", "start": 905.625, "end": 905.865, "confidence": 0.97314453, "punctuated_word": "Tochter", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.3395524 }, { "word": "mit", "start": 905.865, "end": 906.02496, "confidence": 0.9970703, "punctuated_word": "mit", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.36276168 }, { "word": "16", "start": 906.02496, "end": 906.345, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "16", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.36276168 }, { "word": "den", "start": 906.345, "end": 906.58496, "confidence": 0.9951172, "punctuated_word": "den", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.36276168 }, { "word": "ersten", "start": 906.58496, "end": 906.82495, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "ersten", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.36276168 }, { "word": "job", "start": 906.82495, "end": 906.985, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "Job", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.36276168 }, { "word": "gehabt", "start": 906.985, "end": 907.225, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "gehabt", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.36276168 }, { "word": "und", "start": 907.225, "end": 907.38495, "confidence": 0.98828125, "punctuated_word": "und", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.36276168 }, { "word": "dann", "start": 907.38495, "end": 907.545, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "dann", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.36276168 }, { "word": "hab", "start": 907.545, "end": 907.625, "confidence": 0.74853516, "punctuated_word": "hab", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.36276168 }, { "word": "ich", "start": 907.625, "end": 907.785, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "ich", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.36276168 }, { "word": "sie", "start": 907.785, "end": 907.94495, "confidence": 0.95947266, "punctuated_word": "sie", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.36276168 }, { "word": "wiedergefunden", "start": 907.94495, "end": 908.44495, "confidence": 0.7714844, "punctuated_word": "wiedergefunden.", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.36276168 } ], "speaker": 0, "id": "a8cf3078-77b2-4bb1-9664-3058ce9ab31d" }, { "start": 908.82495, "end": 919.22003, "confidence": 0.9042821, "channel": 0, "transcript": "Ah, Gott sei Dank. 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Und sie dann wie in 1 elektronischen", "words": [ { "word": "übertragen", "start": 972.69, "end": 973.09, "confidence": 0.99609375, "punctuated_word": "übertragen", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.8196925 }, { "word": "okay", "start": 973.41, "end": 973.56995, "confidence": 0.99121094, "punctuated_word": "Okay.", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.05688548 }, { "word": "und", "start": 973.73, "end": 973.89, "confidence": 0.9838867, "punctuated_word": "Und", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.20940948 }, { "word": "sie", "start": 973.89, "end": 973.97, "confidence": 0.99316406, "punctuated_word": "sie", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.20940948 }, { "word": "dann", "start": 973.97, "end": 974.13, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "dann", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7998067 }, { "word": "wie", "start": 974.13, "end": 974.29, "confidence": 0.97998047, "punctuated_word": "wie", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7998067 }, { "word": "in", "start": 974.29, "end": 974.45, "confidence": 0.9902344, "punctuated_word": "in", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7998067 }, { "word": "1", "start": 974.45, "end": 974.69, "confidence": 0.9980469, "punctuated_word": "1", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7998067 }, { "word": "elektronischen", "start": 974.69, "end": 975.19, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "elektronischen", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7998067 } ], "speaker": 1, "id": "3eae7738-1b67-43c7-9731-5485964f9103" }, { "start": 975.57, "end": 979.19, "confidence": 0.9109497, "channel": 0, "transcript": "Dokumentenmappe verspeichern. Hast Du noch seine bekommen aus Mitglieder gefunden?", "words": [ { "word": "dokumentenmappe", "start": 975.57, "end": 976.07, "confidence": 0.99658203, "punctuated_word": "Dokumentenmappe", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7998067 }, { "word": "verspeichern", "start": 976.37, "end": 976.87, "confidence": 0.9082031, "punctuated_word": "verspeichern.", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.7998067 }, { "word": "hast", "start": 976.93, "end": 977.01, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "Hast", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.07646942 }, { "word": "du", "start": 977.01, "end": 977.25, "confidence": 0.9941406, "punctuated_word": "Du", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.07646942 }, { "word": "noch", "start": 977.25, "end": 977.33, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "noch", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.6336509 }, { "word": "seine", "start": 977.33, "end": 977.57, "confidence": 0.80566406, "punctuated_word": "seine", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.6336509 }, { "word": "bekommen", "start": 977.57, "end": 977.89, "confidence": 0.9980469, "punctuated_word": "bekommen", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.6336509 }, { "word": "aus", "start": 977.89, "end": 978.13, "confidence": 0.8144531, "punctuated_word": "aus", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.6336509 }, { "word": "mitglieder", "start": 978.13, "end": 978.63, "confidence": 0.90283203, "punctuated_word": "Mitglieder", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.6336509 }, { "word": "gefunden", "start": 978.69, "end": 979.19, "confidence": 0.6915283, "punctuated_word": "gefunden?", "speaker": 1, "speaker_confidence": 0.6336509 } ], "speaker": 1, "id": "255e8b2d-8068-44e5-9b12-266ca8b5ccce" }, { "start": 979.57, "end": 986.07, "confidence": 0.8168521, "channel": 0, "transcript": "Eine Dokumentenmappe? 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Also muss natürlich auch mehr machen. In dem Fall. 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Also das kann man durchaus, da sieht man schon, da wird's ein wirklich auch Ist interessanter wird's dann so kulturell auch, ne, irgendwie und ja sehr individuell für jedes Land. Aktuell ist es aber, ist Deutschland doch eher an der aktiven am aktiven Transfer orientiert, wenn wir ja in die politische Debatte schauen. 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Also sind die alle so, huh, jetzt kommt die Registermodernisierung", "words": [ { "word": "talk", "start": 1317.365, "end": 1317.865, "confidence": 0.8173828, "punctuated_word": "Talk?", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6458762 }, { "word": "also", "start": 1317.925, "end": 1318.0851, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "Also", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6458762 }, { "word": "sind", "start": 1318.0851, "end": 1318.3251, "confidence": 0.9921875, "punctuated_word": "sind", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.6458762 }, { "word": "die", "start": 1318.3251, "end": 1318.405, "confidence": 0.9086914, "punctuated_word": "die", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.4368325 }, { "word": "alle", "start": 1318.405, "end": 1318.5651, "confidence": 0.9902344, "punctuated_word": "alle", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.4368325 }, { "word": "so", "start": 1318.5651, "end": 1318.805, "confidence": 0.9226074, "punctuated_word": "so,", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 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noch gar nicht so angekommen in der Fläche?", "words": [ { "word": "irgendwie", "start": 1320.485, "end": 1320.87, "confidence": 0.9970703, "punctuated_word": "irgendwie", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.33914942 }, { "word": "oder", "start": 1321.03, "end": 1321.27, "confidence": 0.99902344, "punctuated_word": "oder", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.12115657 }, { "word": "ist", "start": 1321.27, "end": 1321.31, "confidence": 0.99609375, "punctuated_word": "ist", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.12115657 }, { "word": "es", "start": 1321.31, "end": 1321.35, "confidence": 0.984375, "punctuated_word": "es", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.12115657 }, { "word": "noch", "start": 1321.35, "end": 1321.59, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "noch", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.654133 }, { "word": "gar", "start": 1321.59, "end": 1321.75, "confidence": 1.0, "punctuated_word": "gar", "speaker": 0, "speaker_confidence": 0.654133 }, { "word": "nicht", "start": 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Also welche Daten habe ich denn überhaupt in meinen Systemen gespeichert? Welche Daten liegen auf der kommunalen Ebene? 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Und diese Erkenntnis, dass das jetzt beginnt, Schleswig Holstein hat schon vor Jahren damit begonnen, die eigenen Daten zu erheben und eine eigene Strategie zu entwickeln, wie gehen wir mit unseren Daten aus der Landes- und auf der kommunalen Ebene ist, glaube ich, jetzt 'n wichtiger wichtiger nächster Schritt. Mhm. 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Also mit mit Echtdaten, ohne statistisch hochgerechnet zu werden. 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Ja, und das wär sone Art, ja, nicht Goldstandard, aber son, ne, wo man sagen könnte, das wär mal echt 'n Ziel. 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Weil der Mehrwert sehr überschaubar sein wird, weil Du, ich hab zuerst schon das Beispiel gebracht, Du lebst wahrscheinlich hauptsächlich in Berlin und vielleicht hast Du noch 'n Nebenwohnsitz Ja. 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Also ich gehör noch dazu, also ich, aber Du hast einfach dann Nicht so viele Anwendungsfälle und dafür 'n relativ großen Aufwand. 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Also da steigt die Komplexität dann ja noch mal enorm. 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Also da haben ja bestimmt viele Leute fragen, müssen sich neues Wissen drauf schaffen? 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